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Old 08-18-2014, 11:06 PM
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Is anyone else following whats going on in Ferguson? I have so many feeling about this it's ridiculous.
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Old 08-18-2014, 11:42 PM
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Yes, night and day. I have multiple friends who live in ferguson...many friends who are there protesting. It is a horrible horrible situation here right now. I am about 20 minutes away or so.

This was one of my favorite posts so far...that speaks to me.

http://perpetualfirstpancake.blogspo...t-but.html?m=1

I just watched on livefeed a couple hours ago..the crowd started getting rowdy. The leaders made a chain and were backing the crowd up...calming them down. It was working. THEN the police moved in the armored vehicles, started barking commands over the loudspeaker (which were already announced) drowning out the leaders who were actually deescalating the situation. I am just...have no words. Luckily at that end it DID settle, and its been fairly settled since BUT at the other end, where media are currently not allowed (though I am sure there are some) apparently **** hit the fan again.

There are so many elements at play here...and make no mistake, definitely some instigators in the crowds...but MOST...the VAST majority are peacefully protesting.
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Old 08-19-2014, 12:27 AM
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Basically everything Greenmagick said. I'm following somewhat - I'm willing to bet more than the average American, but less than people REALLY following the situation.

All I can say is that the entire situation is shocking and I'm
having a hard time believing it's happening in this day and age. But it is, and that's terrifying.
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Old 08-19-2014, 07:12 AM
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I have a lot of feelings, mostly about society and police. Not too many about this specific situation, mostly because I don't feel like i've been given near enough of a picture to have a valid opinion.

I think the police are far to militarized in general, I think they are too removed from the communities they serve, in some places, especially large cities. I see it in small towns too though these days and I think things are generally better around here than others in terms of community and police relationships.

I think society in general is wanting someone else to take care of all their problems and then they get pissed off when they find out out how much power they've given someone else to be able to take care of everything they want them to.

and on top of that, I think we have a very, very irresponsible media in general these days and very irresponsible consumers of that media.

It has gone far beyond reporting news anymore and it is ALL about evoking emotions, spinning info, pushing agendas, get a response and hammer it home with every broadcast.

This could very well be a case of a young policeman that didn't have the mental capacity to be carrying a gun to keep people "safe" and he overreacted in a situation and an innocent young man is dead. because of a prior crime that occurred, his own personal bias coupled with misinterpreting the young man's body language, he may have overreacted and pulled his gun.

OR, just maybe, this guy was the one seen in video tossing a store owner like a rag doll so he could take his 50 dollars in swishers. maybe he did charge the cop and attack him in his car. He wasn't small and that point, I don't care what preceded or came after, nothing good is going to come of a situation when you physically attack a cop.

His buddy says the cop tried pulling him in the car? at least that's one account I read. I can't imagine too many places where they train an officer to "pull" a suspect into a car without them being restrained and under control first, but that's his account I guess. There are others that say his hands were up, giving up. There's others that say he was charging the police officer.

But what happened, what actually happened doesn't seem to be the goal or the focus in reporting. It's all about hammering home that an "unarmed teenager" was "gunned down" and that he was shot at least "six times"

and subsequently, the populace reacts. Everyone asking for justice and nobody has a ****ing clue what actually happened and nobody seems to care. I don't care if this "teenager" who was twice the size of a lot of grown men had a weapon. Did he charge the officer? Did he attack him? What was the lead up? Instead they just incite and evoke emotion with their soundbites. "nobody deserves to die for cigars" "police gun down an unarmed teenager" "he was shot at least 6 times" "one bullet hit the top of his head and could mean he had his head down giving up" , Or it could have meant he was charging so hard he was still falling forward towards the cop despite being shot 5 times. We won't know, they don't care to really tell us.

I wonder what would happen if they police or NG just left. I wonder what these "protests" would turn into?
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Old 08-19-2014, 08:13 AM
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This is horrible, this whole thing. Westboro can protest funerals all they want, so why are police turning this into a **** riot?

As to the actual shooting, I know we can't be 100% sure what happened, but the fact that ALL of the eyewitness said about the exact same thing about what happened (that the officer tried to pull him in the car and then he ran away), and the police force, who weren't there, are the ones saying Brown tried to assault the officer, is pretty **** convincing.
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Old 08-19-2014, 08:23 AM
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Yeah, because in a community that obviously has an issue with the police, the accounts of "pulling a suspect" into a car where you lose all advantage is totally believable since that is a tactic not taught anywhere on any police force, in fact it's probably high on the list of things "not to do".

It's just as plausible, probably more so, that the eyewitnesses saw brown go after the cop you grabbed him and they ended up in the car. and chose to believe the cop was trying to pull him in the car when in fact Brown was the aggressor.

Do you really believe that a cop, or anybody really, would think it a good idea to pull someone of Brown's size on top of them into a car??

Not ALL accounts say the same thing, there's a cell phone video that captures another eyewitness's account voice having a conversation with someone else in which it sounds like Brown started a fight, ran a little ways away, then charged back at the cop.

And cops didn't burn and loot a dozen stores on night one. There's plenty of people looking for blood and saying they want justice.
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Old 08-19-2014, 09:04 AM
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It's turned into an excuse for people to tear apart a community that may not even be theirs. I hear a lot of people that are going in and causing the problems are from out of town.

I guess my question is what do you want the police to do? Let them burn the town to the ground? Riots are scary because there is no control. That's unsafe for civilians as well as police.

I hate to see the hate the police mentality I see so often here. Many family members and friends are policeman and not a one is out for blood as so many here think they all are. Do you have any idea what it's like to have someone attack you and have to make a decision split second?

So many of the reports I see people site for what happened are so bias. I do tend to believe the cops in these situations. I know even at work when we have things happen on the unit the lies people will tell are unbelievable and even confronted with video they insist their version is truth.

If you want to do something go into your local inner city and help a teen or young kid. Protesting the police about a kid who may have been robbing people just does not sound productive to me. It's a life lost and that's sad but don't put blame on the wrong people.
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Old 08-19-2014, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenmagick View Post
Yes, night and day. I have multiple friends who live in ferguson...many friends who are there protesting. It is a horrible horrible situation here right now. I am about 20 minutes away or so.

This was one of my favorite posts so far...that speaks to me.

http://perpetualfirstpancake.blogspo...t-but.html?m=1

I just watched on livefeed a couple hours ago..the crowd started getting rowdy. The leaders made a chain and were backing the crowd up...calming them down. It was working. THEN the police moved in the armored vehicles, started barking commands over the loudspeaker (which were already announced) drowning out the leaders who were actually deescalating the situation. I am just...have no words. Luckily at that end it DID settle, and its been fairly settled since BUT at the other end, where media are currently not allowed (though I am sure there are some) apparently **** hit the fan again.

There are so many elements at play here...and make no mistake, definitely some instigators in the crowds...but MOST...the VAST majority are peacefully protesting.
Interesting link. Though, in response to this bit:

Quote:
Here's what I want to know: why are police officers so often shooting to kill these days? Why aren't they aiming to stop a perpetrator by taking out their knees or aiming for their shoulders? Most importantly, why would anyone other than an extremely violent wanted criminal ever be shot in the back or multiple times? And when police use excessive force, why do they get away with it?
To suggest that police officers shoot to maim/aim for non-lethal areas is, to put it as lightly as possible, impractical. If they draw their weapons and aim it at someone they should be doing so with the intention of killing someone who is being a real threat to them or others. To aim for a leg and risk missing isn't an option. The issue is why they're raising their guns in the first place.
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Old 08-19-2014, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
Yeah, because in a community that obviously has an issue with the police, the accounts of "pulling a suspect" into a car where you lose all advantage is totally believable since that is a tactic not taught anywhere on any police force, in fact it's probably high on the list of things "not to do".
Unless the cop wasn't following procedures to start with. There are reports that the friends were harassed the day before. Drive up, pull someone close to threaten them? Certainly no one is trained like that, but I do have to wonder if it was happening, the amount of distrust suggests that other parts of that book weren't being followed (not profiling for one).
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Old 08-19-2014, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psyfalcon View Post
Unless the cop wasn't following procedures to start with. There are reports that the friends were harassed the day before. Drive up, pull someone close to threaten them? Certainly no one is trained like that, but I do have to wonder if it was happening, the amount of distrust suggests that other parts of that book weren't being followed (not profiling for one).
could be, and maybe this guy was an over aggressive cop looking for trouble. I'm not defending the cop, so much as I'm saying everyone needs to calm the **** down We don't know much of anything other than a young man was killed and people are protesting, looting and rioting without knowing much of anything.

The media and the consumers of that media are being completely irresponsible. I mean there's a woman and her video statement getting play on how they killed that boy for no reason, no knife, no gun, no reason. She was in the shower when it happened, but she makes a good mouthpiece now. Or the lawyer for the family, how many tv shows have they paraded that guy on to give his "execution style" soundbites more air play?

anyway, my rant is everyone is reactionary. nobody waits for the details anymore and when the details do come out and it's time to act, or not act, they're too busy reacting to something else.

If it comes out that this cop drove up and tried pulling a 6'4" 270+lb man on top of him in the car so he could escalate or intimidate and then use deadly force. THEN there should be riots in the street. If the witnesses, ALL OF THEM, taken into account aren't being listened to, and the dash cams are destroyed, and radio communications aren't given to the public, or maybe they all are, and it points to a bad cop and they do nothing to him, THEN RIOT till it's all burned down.

People should be looking for answers, they should be holding people to the fire and making them accountable, where accountability is needed. Instead they give air play to talking heads to create a firestorm. Lots of eyewitnesses say he ran away and was shot, and then background conversations on video capture others talking about Brown fighting the cop in the car, going away, then turning and charging even after a freeze command. They even discuss to themselves, "what's the cop supposed to do, stand there till he connects?" who cares which one is an accurate account, let's just riot and loot.
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