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  #41  
Old 02-12-2014, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Elrohwen View Post
I see this a lot in the "slightly longer than tall" breeds. If it's not supposed to be square, it's going to be bred too long by somebody.
Yep. I was just complaining to some friends about this phenomena in my area, and then lo and behold, this male was the BOB at Westminster.



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  #42  
Old 02-12-2014, 06:06 PM
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I don't care for show line BC's.



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  #43  
Old 02-12-2014, 07:35 PM
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Hmm, well, the tail isn't supposed to curl over the back...


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  #44  
Old 02-12-2014, 07:45 PM
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Woah....confession time, those Czech smooths are GORGEOUS to me! I would actually consider getting a smooth that looked like that (not a big fan of Collies, rough or smooth, generally). The one on the left in particular...just breathtaking.
But they don't look like collies (and that's probably why you like them lol).
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  #45  
Old 02-12-2014, 08:29 PM
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There's variety in the ring in AKC in the Belgians. I like that and think its good for breeds to have variety. UKC though... There's definitely a trend of extremely refined heads, squareness and not enough concern with movement or trkperament with some of the judging. And to answer the squareness question - You do see some lines tending to be almost taller than long. But sometimes a "square" look is achieved by breeding dogs with too little angles.

Pyrsheps - the only thing I don't like is seeing more grooming being "needed" in the specials. I love the variety in the breed and that natural, cropped, docked/bobbed are all equally acceptable. I personally think it's sort of funny to allow cropped and uncropped equally but be picky about what the ears should look like. According to who and why? The ears are historically cropped for functional reasons, if they're not I think they shouldn't really be a huge concern in judging. Same with docking. I know that's not a popular opinion though

Those Russian rough collies are interesting. It's like they never bred for the show type head but have tons and tons of coat. The overly tiny eyes on some show collies bothers me, as does the emphasis on head type over everything else. Although being a "head breed" or a whatever one trait breed isn't only an issue in the collie breed.
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  #46  
Old 02-12-2014, 08:35 PM
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I'll admit that I actually like the look of show bred border collies. I've never met one so I can't comment on drive and temperament, but I think they're pretty with their symmetric markings and fold over ears, and they are definitely less exaggerated than many in the show ring.
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  #47  
Old 02-12-2014, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sekah View Post
Yep. I was just complaining to some friends about this phenomena in my area, and then lo and behold, this male was the BOB at Westminster.







Ridin' long 'n loooooooow.

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  #48  
Old 02-12-2014, 10:04 PM
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The Russian smooth collies are interesting to me... I think the tri looks like a collie (I kind of like that one), but definitely not the sable.

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Originally Posted by kady05 View Post
I mean.. while the standard says that natural ears are preferred, for many, many years, cropped have been "in". And everyone knows that just because the standard says so, doesn't mean that's what the dogs are going to look like. Maybe one day natural ears will make a comeback, but until then, I don't have a problem with breeders not really worrying about ears. We have other issues we need to worry about, ears are a "simple" fix.
I guess that's my problem with it, overall, and definitely not just in AmStaffs. At that point why even bother with a standard if people are going to breed whatever they want/what's in fashion/etc anyway?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzyTheSibe View Post
I don't care for show line BC's.
Show BCs are interesting to me. Some I can't stand, but some I love. Depends on the lines and goals in breeding I guess. I didn't like the overdone (IMO) BC at Westminster:



...which seems to be the popular show look.

but I love Brigadoon's dogs. I mean, Fiona is beautiful. She has British/Scottish lined dogs though. Honestly I kind of disliked show BCs too until I found out that there are dogs like Pirate out there too. I guess I'm kind of a broken record on moderation, lol. I also see how someone who is hardline working BCs only might dislike them, either for what they are or just because there are show BCs at all.
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  #49  
Old 02-12-2014, 11:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paviche View Post
Show BCs are interesting to me. Some I can't stand, but some I love. Depends on the lines and goals in breeding I guess. I didn't like the overdone (IMO) BC at Westminster:



...which seems to be the popular show look.
Wow... kind of reminiscent of a black and white golden retriever... or something. Maybe its all the hair, or the show grooming, but the dog in that pic looks stocky compared to what I think of when I think border collie. The dog you linked to (Fiona) has a nice look. I really like how her face is asymmetrical. It makes her eyes stand out more.
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  #50  
Old 02-12-2014, 11:34 PM
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Not to be a fuddy duddy... but let's maybe try to remember that even if they aren't members, these are peoples loved dogs you are talking about. (and people on this board, myself included, own show line dogs)

No personally liking the way they look or the route their breeder took (I don't like the coat, too much slope, etc..) is one thing but perhaps a little sensitivity? Not saying anyone has said anything but seems to be the general direction this is headed.
Just maybe perhaps think what it would feel like to find a bunch of people posting a picture of your very loved dog like "EW THAT IS GROSS!"
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