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  #1  
Old 07-19-2013, 07:02 PM
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Default Fromm?

I am having very poor luck in firming up Abrams' stool. First thought maybe it was parasites, but two fecals were NPS. No giardia, either. Did a bought of metronidazole just in case and they mostly firmed up while on the meds, but even then were never completely solid. He's been on probiotics for about a week or two now and I thought I was noticing a difference, but now we're back to sloppy poo and waking me up a 4am to go out to go to the bathroom.

Next step is switching foods to see if I can find something that helps firm his poo up. I'm tired to trying to clean up loose stools in the yard!

What I am feeding:

Quote:
Ingredients:

Chicken, chicken meal, whole grain brown rice, white rice, cracked pearled barley, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), oatmeal, dried plain beet pulp, egg product, flaxseed, natural chicken flavor, fish meal, salt, potassium chloride, choline chloride, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.

Guaranteed Analysis:
Protein: 26%, Fat: 16%

Caloric Content:
3,708 kcal/kg (368 kcal/cup) Calculated ME
I'm broke and can't afford much for dog food, unfortunately. I'm most likely going to try out 4 Health Salmon and Potato with him, as I had really good success with Chloe and Gracie on that flavor. BUT, I have to purchase that at Tractor Supply, which is on the complete opposite end of town.

Quote:
Ingredients:

Salmon, ocean fish meal (a source of fish oil), potatoes, peas, cracked pearled barley, egg product, millet, canola oil, tomato pomace, natural flavor, flaxseed, salt, choline chloride, dried chicory root, glucosamine hydrochloride, dried kelp, carrots, apples, tomatoes, blueberries, spinach, dried skim milk, cranberries, rosemary extract, parsley flake, yucca schidigera extract, L-Carnitine, chondroitin sulfate, dried Enterococcus faecium fermentation product, dried Lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried Lactobacillus casei fermentation product, dried Lactobacillus plantarum fermentation product, dried Trichoderma longibrachiatum fermentation extract, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.

Guaranteed Analysis:
Crude Protein 25.0% (min.), Crude Fat 14.0% (min.), Crude Fiber 3.0% (max.), Moisture 10.0% (max.), Zinc 150 mg/kg (min.), Selenium 0.4 mg/kg (min.), Vitamin E 150 IU/kg (min.), Omega-6 Fatty Acids* 2.5% (min.), Omega-3 Fatty Acids* 0.5% (min.), Glucosamine* 300 mg/kg (min.), Chondroitin Sulfate* 100 mg/kg (min.),

*Not recognized as an essential nutrient by the AAFCO dog food nutrient profile.

Caloric Content:
3,500 kcal/kg (327 kcal/cup) Calculated Metabolizable Energy
We have a Pet Supplies Plus near me that sells Fromm. And since I have heard a ton of good things about it, if the price isn't through the roof, I was thinking about trying it. There are so many options, though! What would be a good (cheaper) starting point for a growing, large breed puppy and a medium size adult dog? I'm hoping to maybe try a different main protein source other than chicken, and maybe get away from rice as the primary grain.
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Old 07-19-2013, 08:44 PM
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Our dogs did good on Fromm but I know many that got nasty poops and/or itched.

I have never had all of my dogs on a single food that everyone did awesome on...until Merrick.
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Old 07-19-2013, 09:23 PM
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Any chance you're overfeeding? Juno had chronic loose stools as a pup and we tried brand after brand, courses of metro, bland diets... things would work for a little bit and then she'd revert back to the runs. I eventually decided maybe I was feeding her too much - even now she'll get loose stools here and there if she eats a lot.

I think Fromm is fantastic though. Not sure what about it would help with the poop though.
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Old 07-19-2013, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Southpaw View Post
Any chance you're overfeeding? Juno had chronic loose stools as a pup and we tried brand after brand, courses of metro, bland diets... things would work for a little bit and then she'd revert back to the runs. I eventually decided maybe I was feeding her too much - even now she'll get loose stools here and there if she eats a lot.

I think Fromm is fantastic though. Not sure what about it would help with the poop though.
I don't *think* I'm over feeding. He only gets ~ 4 cups of food a day, if he eats it all. He's all ribs and extra skin, too, so he's not at all too portly.

He's almost 14 weeks old and is around 30 pounds - so 4c a day sounds about right...?
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Old 07-20-2013, 07:06 AM
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To me 4 cups seems like a lot! But I don't have a growing large breed puppy, either.

24lb Crossbone gets 1 cup of Fromm per day.
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Old 07-20-2013, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *blackrose View Post
I don't *think* I'm over feeding. He only gets ~ 4 cups of food a day, if he eats it all. He's all ribs and extra skin, too, so he's not at all too portly.

He's almost 14 weeks old and is around 30 pounds - so 4c a day sounds about right...?
Aikon is 40 lbs and 5 months and gets 1.25 cups per meal...I judge how much to feed him by his poops alone. Yup, he goes through some rib-y, scrawny phases, but if his poops stay firm, I up a little. If they go to smooshy, I decrease a little. They're growing babies, I expect some weird skinniness (and I prefer a touch too thin to a touch too fat, but I have GSDs vs Lab/Chessies that are notoriously chubby pups) and I'm ok with it.

ETA: If he's not eating it all, it's too much. On the other hand, if he "needs" more food then I would split it into another feeding. I don't know if you can do a "lunch" feeding, but if not, do breakfast, dinner as soon as you get home, and then a small meal before bed. Our work Mals that won't eat a lot in one sitting gain and maintain better on multiple meals.
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Old 07-20-2013, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FG167 View Post
Aikon is 40 lbs and 5 months and gets 1.25 cups per meal...I judge how much to feed him by his poops alone. Yup, he goes through some rib-y, scrawny phases, but if his poops stay firm, I up a little. If they go to smooshy, I decrease a little. They're growing babies, I expect some weird skinniness (and I prefer a touch too thin to a touch too fat, but I have GSDs vs Lab/Chessies that are notoriously chubby pups) and I'm ok with it.

ETA: If he's not eating it all, it's too much. On the other hand, if he "needs" more food then I would split it into another feeding. I don't know if you can do a "lunch" feeding, but if not, do breakfast, dinner as soon as you get home, and then a small meal before bed. Our work Mals that won't eat a lot in one sitting gain and maintain better on multiple meals.
He only likes to eat around 3/4-1c. per meal. I put 2 cups down in his bowl in the morning. He eats a bit of it, then becomes ADD and wanders off. He typically finishes up the bowl late morning. He gets another 2 cups put in his bowl in the evening when I get home from work, and typically eats half of it then and the other half a few hours later before bed.

But, depending on our schedule, he may or may not have access to that late morning feeding. It may become an early afternoon feeding, or no food at all until evening. Some days I don't get home until almost 9pm, so his dinner is given right before bed and he doesn't have time for "two" evening meals. When that is the case, he eats less, because he doesn't like to eat more than 1c. per sitting and I just can't give him enough opportunities to finish the food.

(He is a broken retriever. He doesn't chow down on meals! When I first brought him home, he wouldn't eat at all. Then he would just graze the entire day. Now he'll sit and eat, but only a cup at a time.)

I don't know if I notice a stool difference on days he eats less, but I'm all for not feeding him as much food if the extra is just being pooped out! Overfeeding was something that didn't even cross my mind.

ETA: The feeding guidelines for a puppy his size/his age says 4 cups a day. So at least I know I'm not too off.
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Old 07-20-2013, 09:45 AM
ruffiangirl ruffiangirl is offline
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I had the smae problem with Gage when I got him, didnt matter what I fed him he had puddles, not piles, it was over feeding. Even then Gage was 70lbs and every thing said he should be getting 5-7 cups a day, I cut him back to 5, when that didnt fix it, i cut andother 1/2 a cup, finally he was getting 3-4 cups a day and was pooping fine. (I was feeding Orijen). Even now at 165-170lbs he gets 2 feedings of 2 cups each.
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Old 07-20-2013, 06:23 PM
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I'd try decreasing a little and see how it goes, with Juno I was always feeding to the guidelines as well but I noticed a big improvement in her poop once I started cutting back a little. Something to try since you should know relatively quickly if you see an improvement or not.
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