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Old 10-10-2014, 10:14 PM
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Laurelin Laurelin is offline
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Default Wild young dog + old dog + grumpy dog

How do you guys handle one bigger really rowdy dog who just seems to hit all the buttons of the resident grumpy dogs. Mia does NOT like Hank's mannerisms. And Hank gets crazy zoomies often. But he has to try to pounce on papillons while doing so. I've been doing my best trying to redirect him, also giving the paps ample time behind a gate that he's finally sort of respecting. He's about thiiiiiis close to getting tethered inside again.

Mia makes it worse because Mia will shriek at him even if he's nowhere near her.

They are all FINE when he's calm but he goes from total calm to 100 mph crazy in a blink of an eye. I've been praising him for being calm indoors.

Do you think letting him play with other dogs (willing dogs) is good or bad? I've been letting him have play dates and we even checked out the dog park a couple times. Not sure about the dog park, he's really rough with the small dogs but under the size limit with the big dogs. But he has played there really well with dogs his size and energy level.

I think it is partially this cold front. I really do. He's SO WILD today despite getting a couple hours of exercise and a pet store trip. The other time he was this wild was the last big temp drop.

Is there a way to train a body slamming and just generally obnoxious dog to just... not be that way except in play?

I do think he's probably at the peak of his obnoxiousness- being a teenager and all. He also bites a lot. Will just shark you or other dogs out of nowhere.
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Mia CGC - (5 year old Papillon)
Hank - (approx. 10 month old Spotty Dog)
Summer TG3 TIAD - (10 year old Papillon)
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Old 10-10-2014, 11:16 PM
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CharlieDog CharlieDog is offline
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Harrison is on a leash or a tab at all times in the house, because Ozzy is both old AND grumpy, and will also growl even if Harrison is just walking by him (well, Harrys a six month old Malinois. He doesn't really WALK anywhere) so far, if Harrison is too interested in what Oz has to say, I redirect him with the drag line. I've got him on a six foot leather drag from Leerburg in the house that I LOVE because it's quiet lol, and then I have a biothane I bought from someone on here (I'm terrible and can't remember who) but I think it was made by Fraggle Rock, and it's perfect for outside.

Anyway, he's on one of those at all times. If he's getting too rowdy in the house usually with Indy, I will grab and stop it. If he persists, I put him in his crate. Playtime is ONLY outside. ONLY. And Ozzy has made it perfectly clear he wishes Harrison would fall into a pit of snakes, so Harry will bounce riiiight up to him and stop a couple feet away, and then play bow. Harry probably already has twenty pounds on Oz, I'm not sure what Hank weighs vs Summer and Mia, but Harry is close to twice Ozzys size, and gaining every day.

We haven't had a cold front here, it's been pretty warm (thank god and you keep that cold front right where it is, thank you) but still, a four year old Dutch and a six month old Malinois plus an eight year old Lab and a nine year old grumpy ass Aussie/JRT is a balancing act. Especially now that the pointy two are my dogs to deal with, and the floppy two dogs aren't except to supervise when everyone is out together. The pointy dogs like to make it a point (haha) to annoy the other two as much as possible.

I redirect, crate, and correct when appropriate basically

ETA, I will also correct Ozzy for being a jerkwad for things that should NOT be a big deal, like Harry walking (okay, trotting) past him in the hallway. I would probably correct both Hank AND Mia for her shrieking and him for reacting to the shrieking. If any dog here shrieks or screams for anything other than being in actual serioud pain, they either get yelled at, or crated. Ozzy will get a physical correction for barkscreaming like an idiot. I do NOT play about that, because I've seen it happen entirely too often, where a dog screams, and the other dogs, a switch flips, and they attack. It's instinct, and it can happen out of the blue. Even between two dogs that know and hang out with each other all the time. Enzo screamed once because her toe got caught in the door jam before we had new thresholds put down. Ozzy was going out of the house in front of her, and when she screamed he immediately turned around and went for her.

It's probably 99% the terrier in him, but I've had it happen in doggie daycare where a dog will get hurt, usually something minor but they scream, and every. single. dog. will come running, and nine times out of ten, someone will try to attack the dog that's screaming. Not always a terrier either, though they're the most prone to doing the attacking. It can turn ugly quickly.

So yeah. Shrieking at him is not going to help. I would kill that behavior with a quickness. And harshly. I'm not trying to offend, or hurt your feelings, but I've seen it happen entirely too quickly where a dog will end up hurt really really badly because the dog was a drama queen about something, and got attacked.
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Last edited by CharlieDog; 10-11-2014 at 12:15 AM.
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Old 10-11-2014, 09:18 AM
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*blackrose *blackrose is offline
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Cynder is an angel and does nothing at all to trigger/annoy Abrams, so Abrams it he one that gets a lot of telling off her. But he knows, now. He plays with her differently than with other dogs (no body slamming, no wrestling, just bitey face) and while he's a butthead initiating it sometime, it's because she doesn't tell him off. If he gets too intense and we can see Cynder is starting to get fed up, we tell him to knock it off and he does.

When he was a pup, we did a lot of redirection/removal if he did not leave her alone when told. It did take some time (and for him to grow a brain) for it to sink in, but he really does know that Cynder is different and that he can't play with her the way he does other dogs.

I definitely agree that excess energy + bratty teenager is a bad combination, and even now if Abrams has WAY too much energy I have to take him out alone for exercise so he can be with Cynder without bothering the ever loving crap out of her. A tired dog is a good dog!
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Old 10-11-2014, 10:14 AM
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sassafras sassafras is offline
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So. Much. Management. Drag line/long lead, baby gates.

Also we did a lot of "three strikes" with Squash. Verbal warning to chill ("enough!") with a short (30-60 seconds) time out x 2, if a third warning was needed then away to No Fun Land with you (inside if everyone was outside, crate if everyone was inside).

Lots of treats and jackpots to grumpy dog for ignoring/calm behavior around wild young dog - I used a Manners Minder for this for Pip until Squash broke it. :/

The other thing that helped a lot was training and walking side by side to condition some fun associations.

And time. He'll mature eventually. Pip and Squash are practically friends now, at least outside. Indoors quarters are a little cramped for that still.
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Old 10-11-2014, 10:27 AM
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Laurelin Laurelin is offline
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Right now everyone is asleep in crates. So peaceful.

So far Hank has not shown any aggression but he tends to read Mia being shrieky and angry as 'Oh yeah, let's play more!!!' which of course makes Mia more angry. We're doing the drag line again to redirect him and it's helping. I'm going to try walking them together too. Maybe that will help...

I have been correcting both Mia and Hank because imo they are both feeding the problem. Her by shrieking and him by being obnoxious and getting riled up by her shrieking.

Summer is a good dog though and Hank really leaves her alone for the most part. He sometimes will try to play but mostly reads her signals.

Hank is currently 16 lbs. Mia is 8 lbs and Summer is 7.5 lbs. So he's basically 2 x their size.
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Mia CGC - (5 year old Papillon)
Hank - (approx. 10 month old Spotty Dog)
Summer TG3 TIAD - (10 year old Papillon)
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Old 10-11-2014, 12:44 PM
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amberdyan amberdyan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
So far Hank has not shown any aggression but he tends to read Mia being shrieky and angry as 'Oh yeah, let's play more!!!' which of course makes Mia more angry. We're doing the drag line again to redirect him and it's helping. I'm going to try walking them together too. Maybe that will help...
This is where doggy play dates actually REALLY helped Hugo. When we first got him it was like he didn't speak dog at all... he would try to initiate play and another dog would growl/snark at him and he thought that meant "I love you let's play!" We would take him to this big unfenced dog park on a long line to work on him ignoring other dogs and focusing on us, which worked when we didn't want him interacting, but several of my family members have small dogs and I needed him to understand what no means in "dog speak" so that I wouldn't have to constantly correct him. We ended up enrolling him in doggy daycare which has a "special pack" on wednesdays. It's full of stable staff dogs who will correct him appropriately if he gets too rowdy. It took 3 weeks (with one day per week) and now when one of the small family dogs snarks at him he kind of just rolls his eyes and finds someone else who will play with him.

ETA: These "family dogs" don't live with us or anything, it's just when we go to visit ever few weeks, so I don't know how helpful this is to you. I just thought I'd throw it out!
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