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  #41  
Old 04-25-2013, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Equinox View Post
ETA: For example, this photo? There could be a million reasons behind the child's expression:

In this photo, I see a sad woman sitting on a swing alone. I think that's reason enough for the little boy to be looking at her. It's not common to see adults sitting on swings, first off, which would easily make children stare.

Anyway, I think the project is very interesting. However, I think there are a ton of flaws. If someone had a camera set up at them in a crowd, I'd look that way. Heck, even when people are surveying the roads, I look their way. I think it's just human nature to look where a camera or other equipment is pointing.
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Old 04-25-2013, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by ~Jessie~ View Post
If someone had a camera set up at them in a crowd, I'd look that way. Heck, even when people are surveying the roads, I look their way. I think it's just human nature to look where a camera or other equipment is pointing.
It's human nature to look at other people, period. This woman has photos where she's bent down tying a shoe and some kid is glancing down at her as he's walking past. Everyone does that, it's human nature.

There's another photo where she's eating icecream, and some guy seems to be looking at her. I do that too! And it's not because I secretly think the person eating the icecream is a fat disgusting slob, it's normally because I'm curious about what flavor the icecream is, and I'm trying to catch a glimpse of what the bowl says so that I can find the shop and get myself an icecream too!

*sigh*
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  #43  
Old 04-25-2013, 09:49 AM
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Count me among those who think she's reading a LOT into a number of those "looks". In almost every photo I see a sad woman with a camera being pointed at her - I'd look!

In a number, she's also stopped in the middle of the flow of traffic on a side walk - I might look snotty in a photo taken at that moment, but not because of how she looks, but because she's stopping the flow of people and that sort of thing drives me nuts! If you want to take a photo, read a map, or tie your shoe, move to the side!! LOL

None of her photos show joy and I hope that's just for art's sake, not because she's unhappy in general.
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  #44  
Old 04-25-2013, 10:07 AM
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I don't know if I agree that genetics and thyroid get too much attention these days. Maybe because I am on the other side of it I see a lot more people saying things like 'just eat less' or 'maybe you shouldn't eat a Big Mac every meal'. I am sure there are many people that eat that way and are fat but there doesn't seem to be much thought for the fact that a person could eat 'normally' by western standards but still be fat. I honestly think most people think the only way you are fat is if you eat sweets and fast food all day long. Just looking at articles on yahoo or CNN that touch on weight and you see that. Comments made by friends and even doctors say the same thing. You are fat because you are lazy. It is frustrating to hear especially from people who eat the same way I do.

I am not trying to dissolve myself of any responsibility because I know I could do better and be skinnier. And that would be healthier for me. But 'better' isn't what a lot of people think it is. It isn't eat whole grains and low fat.
It's true to a point, but our genetics have not changed that much in 50 years, neither have our thyroids. One only has to go back 20 years and look at family photos to see that this nation has changed drastically.

Eating a normal "western" diet will make most people heavier than they should be. That's my point, we eat calorie rich food that is nutritionally void and we eat a lot of it for decades. It messes with hormones, it messes with organs and glands, it messes with our body composition.

Our views on nutrition absolutely need to change. And for some people, yes, no matter how they eat, they are probably going to be heavier than most other people. Those people exist.

BUT we're living in a country where over 60% are overweight or obese. It is a general rule in this country and nobody has to look to far to see it. Even if one is eating a normal "western diet" if they are that overweight, i'd become a rich man betting they were very overweight because of decreased activity or eating too much. We went from having 10% or less of overweight or obese population to over SIXTY % in 30 years.

it's not an thyroid or gene issue.
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  #45  
Old 04-25-2013, 10:19 AM
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It's human nature to look at other people, period. This woman has photos where she's bent down tying a shoe and some kid is glancing down at her as he's walking past. Everyone does that, it's human nature.

There's another photo where she's eating icecream, and some guy seems to be looking at her. I do that too! And it's not because I secretly think the person eating the icecream is a fat disgusting slob, it's normally because I'm curious about what flavor the icecream is, and I'm trying to catch a glimpse of what the bowl says so that I can find the shop and get myself an icecream too!

*sigh*
Exactly. If a little girl is wearing a cute dress, I'll look her way. If there's a dad playing with his kid, I'll look. Person with a patterned shirt- yep, I'll look. I don't care if they're fat, skinny, black, white, tall, short, etc... I don't hardcore "stare," but I do glance.

Some cultures stare more as well. From a website about India:

Quote:
Staring is okay - Staring at strangers is a Western cultural taboo that does not carry the same weight here. Many people feel quite free to stare at anything, or anyone, different. Most Western visitors, at some point in their time here, will experience intense, and disconcerting, staring. Interpreting this as rudeness is unproductive. Remember, you are quite an unusual creature in this setting. Many people on the streets will have had little contact with foreigners. What you look like, what you do, and how you behave will generate intense interest. Don't get angry or try to "educate" people on the idea that staring is rude. It will only increase curiosity, and frustrate you. Relax. Let people look. After all, you are doing your own exploration of the people and places here. What you are reacting to is not so much the staring, but your cultural interpretation of the action.

http://www.indax.com/trculture.html
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  #46  
Old 04-25-2013, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
I judge, in a way when I see someone very overweight, my eyes and mind tell me they are very overweight, but that's all it tells me. I have plenty of overweight friends. Some of them smoke too much too. Doesn't mean I agree with their choices by being friends with them, but they have other much more redeeming qualities that I admire.

Being overweight doesn't stop them from being good, productive, respectful, loving people. I don't care if they have a medical condition, don't care if they just eat poorly. Well I do, I try to get everyone to make more healthy decisions, but what they eventually choose isn't my main priority in life.

But I think genetics and medical conditions get far, far, too much credit in this country. We live like crap. We do. We eat like crap, even when we eat "healthy" we're are usually eating like crap. Thyroid conditions are awesome cause you can blame something else. They are as much a function of diet and exercise as anything.

our Thyroids and genetics have not changed in the past 50 years, but our lifestyles sure have. Diets based on cheap nutritionally defunct food and convenience have not been kind to our waistlines or our health. You can certainly give yourself a thyroid condition, and in fact many have. Not because their thyroid was broken, but because their lifestyle made it dysfuctional over time. They weren't given a bad thyroid or bad genes.

Sure it can be tested for and given medication to treat. Normal function can also be achieved with different lifestyle choices.
I'm the exception to your "rules" above
I grew up outside the US, I have always been skinny, like spine and ribs visible skinny. Not in a bad way, just the way I'm put together. For nearly 4 decades I never had much issue keeping a healthy weight. If I gained, I just upped the exercise, ate 1 cookie instead of 3 and that was that.
In my 20's I was diagnosed with an enlarged thyroid that became nodular in my 30's. Eventually it turns out it had grown around some rather important parts in my neck, so I had to have it removed.
I did not create a thyroid problem in myself. I lived in 3rd world countries and one of the things my parents used to do was drop iodine tablets in the water so they wouldn't get sick from it. My maternal grandmother also had thyroid problems and seeing as she was born in 1903, and worked on a farm most of her life, I don't think it was lifestyle related.
When my thyroid was removed, since it was growing all around different structures in my neck, the surgeon accidentally nicked one of the nerves in my neck that controls the vocal cords and things like breathing and swallowing. Long story short, even after I had healed from surgery, the damage to that nerve made it so that when I exercised, my airway would seize up much like when you're about to cry and you feel like you can't breathe. Even longer story short, I gained over 50 pounds in 3 years.
I don't live like crap or eat like crap any more than the next mostly aware american who tries to be healthy. I just suffer way more consequences than they do. Yet folks will look at me and assume I don't exercise and assume I don't eat healthy. I do both.
I know what I need to do to get the weight off, it's just not a priority for me as I'm very healthy otherwise. I run and play with the kids and dogs, (can't do the trampoline with them, but that's not a weight thing, it's a mommy bladder thing ) My BP is perfect - sometimes even in the low range of normal, my bloodwork is great. I'm perfectly healthy, just fat. If I lost weight, absolutely nothing about me would change, nothing in my life would change, I would just wear smaller clothes. There is a lot more to people than what size they are.

As for the blog, I think she's reading way too much in to folks' expressions and what they're looking at. I'm one of those people who stares off in to space thinking about something and looks like I'm looking at a person, when really I'm off in my own mind, not thinking about what I'm looking at at all.
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  #47  
Old 04-25-2013, 10:42 AM
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Yes, yes, and yes. Absolutely agree and am glad that others have said this in better words than I could manage.

In this context, ANY sideways glance could be seen as "judgemental". I could have easily been one of those people pictured "mocking" her because my eyes stray like crazy. Seriously. Whether I am holding a conversation or simply walking down the street, my eyes are practically darting everywhere and looking at everything. I will probably glance at every single person within five feet of me, and I sincerely hope that no one thinks I'm judging them by that glance.

Additionally, if I saw a camera set up on a tripod (or being held by a photographer) and someone standing in front of that camera, my eyes would be naturally drawn in that direction. If I just happened to be looking to see what was going on, and was not consciously putting a smile on my face, then maybe my expression could be interpreted as mockery as well. And I do find that a little unfair.

I do think it's an interesting idea for a project and I am glad that her photos have helped others feel more comfortable about their body. However, I don't really agree with her analysis of the people around her at all.

ETA: For example, this photo? There could be a million reasons behind the child's expression:

I think her posture invites a lot of odd looks, simply because of how bizarre she is acting. sitting on a swing, not swinging, not looking at anything, hands in an artificial pose on her thighs, i would look at her like "wtf?" myself, not because shes fat, but because shes in public and behaving very oddly.

I think shes reading way too much into how others behave to her, and I think shes creating most of it with her own behavior *shrug*
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  #48  
Old 04-25-2013, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
BUT we're living in a country where over 60% are overweight or obese. It is a general rule in this country and nobody has to look to far to see it. Even if one is eating a normal "western diet" if they are that overweight, i'd become a rich man betting they were very overweight because of decreased activity or eating too much. We went from having 10% or less of overweight or obese population to over SIXTY % in 30 years.

it's not an thyroid or gene issue.

I completely agree. The USA has the 6th highest obesity rate in the world.

https://www.cia.gov/news-information...-factbook.html

When there are more McDonalds than grocery stores in a 5 mile radius, you know there's a problem. You can get a few cheeseburgers and a soda for less than the cost of making a healthy meal at home.

Besides that, many people don't understand what "eating healthy" means. For instance, Special K cereal is toted as a "healthy" meal option. The ingredients are:

Quote:
Rice, wheat gluten, sugar, defatted wheat germ
Take a walk down the cereal aisle in your grocery store. It's insane. If the "healthy" cereals are bad, we're doomed. Look at the ones we buy for our children. Fruity Pebbles doesn't even contain fruit!

Quote:
Rice, Sugar, Hydrogenated Vegetable Oil (Coconut And Palm Kernel Oils), Salt, Contains Less Than 0.5% Of Natural And Artificial Flavor, Red 40, Yellow 6, Turmeric Oleoresin (Color), Blue 1, Yellow 5, Blue 2, Bha (To Help Protect Flavor).
There are SO many foods that give the illusion of being healthy. Frozen yogurt isn't a health food. Most salads at restaurants are worse than burgers and fries. People think they're making a healthy decision when they order "just a salad," but in reality they're eating just as many calories than the "bad" foods on the menu.

We have a place called the Ale House that we occasionally go to for happy hour. There are literally a small handful of items on the menu (besides steak) that are under 500 calories. And these are BEFORE sauces and sides are ordered. Even their tossed salad has over 300 calories and 17 grams of fat. Their Southwest Bistro salad has 1520 calories- BEFORE dressing is added.

http://www.millersalehouse.com/media...-14-12_new.pdf
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  #49  
Old 04-25-2013, 10:52 AM
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I will never be a skinny person. I could be skinnier than what I am now and have been. My main problem is I tend to only eat dinner and no matter how healthy dinner is, it is unhealthy cause I just don't eat enough. So, my body is constantly in starvation state. I have been trying to eat something for breakfast lately and it has been helping.

So, I do agree that diet plays a role right along with genetics.
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Old 04-25-2013, 11:06 AM
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The illusion of health food is a major issue, like Laur said, the kneejerk is "Eat whole grains and less fat!!" Uhhh. They've even done that with kid's cereal - slap a "NOW MADE WITH WHOLE GRAIN!" logo on it because that's 'healthy!!' Sigh.


Really, what bothers me about this project is that she claims to not care what people think about her, but she clearly does. She very obviously minds because she looks at these photos and what she sees is "this person is judging me because of my weight" rather than "this person is looking at the same shop window I'm standing in front of" or "these people are looking at me because I'm sitting on a swing looking sad."
What bothers me is that no matter what she claims, she feels bad about herself, SO BAD that she's created an entire art project devoted to highlighting how bad she feels about herself.

Even worse, it seems there's some kind of twisted joy in "these people are judging me" so much that she specifically goes out and sets up scenarios to bait people into looking at her in a less-than-positive way... because somehow it validates how bad she feels about herself if she can "catch" other people judging her? "See, they're looking at me and mocking me because I'm fat. I'm such a fat slob."


Her emotional state related to this project just makes me really sad. It's not like she's even really unattractive, though the fact that she's scowling or looking sad in most of these photos doesn't help. I bet she's quite pretty when she smiles or laughs.
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