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View Poll Results: Would you co-own a dog?
Yes 27 58.70%
No 13 28.26%
Other - Please explain 7 15.22%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

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  #41  
Old 03-11-2013, 01:59 PM
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Gypsydals Gypsydals is offline
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I said yes. I will co-own if I like the co-owner and the agreements that come with co-owning.
I currently co-own Ivan. And will continue to do so until I get him neutered. She currently doesn't have a say in what I do with him other than breeding. And we both are good with that. I will also be co-owning the next one from the same breeder. I like the co-own agreement we have with Ivan. I have on the other hand passed on other co-owned dogs. I didn't like the co-owned agreements that came with the dog.
The only thing in Ivans co-own contract that many people I've talked to didn't agree to was the fact that his breeder had the final say in who got bred to him. BUT keep in mind when I signed that contract almost 8 years ago, I had no idea what I was doing really. I had pet dalmatians up to that point.
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  #42  
Old 03-11-2013, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gypsydals View Post
The only thing in Ivans co-own contract that many people I've talked to didn't agree to was the fact that his breeder had the final say in who got bred to him. BUT keep in mind when I signed that contract almost 8 years ago, I had no idea what I was doing really. I had pet dalmatians up to that point.
As a breeder, that sounds reasonable to me. The breeder should (I would hope) know their lines and how best to breed them a whole lot better than someone relatively new to the breed.
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  #43  
Old 03-11-2013, 02:17 PM
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you really are one of those people aren't you?

a co-ownership agreement IS a legal agreement. It MAY and most likely does contain a lot of other stipulations that all pertain to maintaining co-ownership of the dog in question.

Because a buyers contract might contain a clause similar or identical to what you might find in a co-owners contract doesn't make that portion null and void. It makes it part of your agreement, if that is a seller's contract or a co-ownership contract, whatever is contained IS a part of that contract.

and Adrianne asked this "I am currently discussing an option of co-owning and while we haven't discussed what that would mean exactly in this case, except a breed back, I am curious how people feel about this. I have friends who co-own and friends who've walked away when offered only a co-ownership.

Do you like Co-owns? Why? Why not?"

and also stating clearly they haven't talked about other stipulations of the agreement other than a breed back as being part of that co-ownership agreement. I guess you're also one that likes to cherry pick as well and then re-define and exclude whatever is pertinent or not to your position.
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  #44  
Old 03-11-2013, 02:17 PM
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I will only co-own with a highly trusted friend, and with a detailed contract. I like to do it, because I will become a hoarder if I continue keeping a puppy out of every litter I breed LOL.
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  #45  
Old 03-11-2013, 02:24 PM
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Yes - but my co-owns have always been with other people who went in to purchase the dog with me, not a breeder. I will say I will probably never co-own with an SO again - it made my last breakup ugly. It would've been uglier anyway, but instead of just making a clean break, we had to deal with the dogs' papers. I co-own swagger with my friend Andy, we bought him together, and he switched houses a lot as a pup. When we moved to Cali, the boys stayed with Andy. Mostly our co-owns just said that I got to take off with the boys & show them when I felt like it, but it was on my dime.
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  #46  
Old 03-11-2013, 02:28 PM
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Things I would want ironed out: what happens if the dog is not finishable in the desired ring? Who decides about breeding the dog? What are the requirements - age, health tests, titles. If one co owner disagrees about the breed ability of the dog then what? Who gets to pick the stud / dam for the breeding? Does only the breeder get the say or does the other co owner get input? What happens if new information comes to light ( ex I know: health problem pops up back in the line).
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  #47  
Old 03-11-2013, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by release the hounds View Post
you really are one of those people aren't you?
Someone who hates it when people misuse certain words or terminology long enough that they think they get to change the meaning of them? Yes. Using "co-own" to mean "agreement" grates on my nerves almost as much as using "literally" to mean "figuratively."

Quote:
a co-ownership agreement IS a legal agreement. It MAY and most likely does contain a lot of other stipulations that all pertain to maintaining co-ownership of the dog in question.
A type of agreement that I would consider to be an actual, legally-binding "co-ownership agreement" are those that stipulate conditions that must be met prior to one party or group signing full registered ownership over to another party.

That is not what most people refer to when they're discussing whether a "co-own" is good or not, including your own examples.

That said, I've seen a whole...darn...lot...of dog agreements. Most of which contained so many legal loopholes and unenforceable content that they were beyond laughable. I can count on one hand the number of those I've seen that were actually worded in such a way as to make one lick of difference legally as to whether or not the persons involved were actively maintaining a co-ownership of the dog. If you really want to get technical, most dog agreements are barely legally binding in the first place. Sometimes, a single word out of place will make a difference as to whether a contract (and by extension, whether that single word only voided one portion or the entirety of it) is legally enforceable or not.

If it isn't legally binding, I don't much care what someone calls it, it's pretty worthless to me. Maybe we should split the thread off into a second part... "What can you/can you not legally get away with asking for in a dog agreement?"
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  #48  
Old 03-11-2013, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenSins View Post
As a breeder, that sounds reasonable to me. The breeder should (I would hope) know their lines and how best to breed them a whole lot better than someone relatively new to the breed.
That is exactly why I didn't have a problem with it. I knew and know she is not going to do something with Ivan with out explaining it to me. That way I learn as well. Just like when I get my girl she will have breeding rights to her as well and will probably whelp the first litter with me hopefully being there. That way I can continue to learn.
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  #49  
Old 03-11-2013, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gypsydals View Post
That is exactly why I didn't have a problem with it. I knew and know she is not going to do something with Ivan with out explaining it to me. That way I learn as well. Just like when I get my girl she will have breeding rights to her as well and will probably whelp the first litter with me hopefully being there. That way I can continue to learn.
Sounds good. Honestly wish my own breed had more breeder-mentors like this.
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  #50  
Old 03-11-2013, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenSins View Post
Sounds good. Honestly wish my own breed had more breeder-mentors like this.
Ivans breeders are great and have great looking dogs. Which is part of the reason I haven't gotten my liver girl yet. I keep comparing the dogs to what I already have and to Ivans breeder. Needless to say I have found a look and a breeder I like. And I will be going back to what I'm comfortable with and know. She has been very patient and very willing to answer any and all questions I have. Even if they seem stupid.


So I think that in a nutshell is what encompasses a good co-ownership agreement. Make sure you understand everything in the contract (because to me they are entwined, you can't have one with out the other), make sure each party is comfortable with everything, and make sure the other party is someone you are happy to have as a part of your life for the next X amount of years. Because even the most hands off co-owner/breeder is going to be a part of your life in some shape or form.
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