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  #11  
Old 01-27-2006, 08:38 AM
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Amstaffer Amstaffer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kittana
Designer mutts make me want to puke, and people supporting this... foul breeding makes me want to shoot myself.




It's a cocker spaniel cross poodle, not a cokapoo.
I don't think anyone said they are breeding them. If they are in a shelter what are we supposed to do? Whatever you call them they deserve a loving home and to be treated as well as any other dog. You might want to take to some one about the "hurting yourself thing".
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  #12  
Old 01-27-2006, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Madaline
Cockapoos have been around for donkeys years, they are lovely little dogs.
Great with kids, I know quite a few people that have them. If you want a great dog get a mutt, there are loads of them out there and all dogs purebreed or mutts need someone to love them, thats all that is important.

It doesn't matter if you get a mutt or a purebred if you want a great dog. Just don't get them from places that only care for selling puppies for a quick buck without any care of health or temperament (and I'm sorry but it's the case of *all* mutt breeders), when so many (purebred and mutts) need a home in shelters.

That being say, I love cocker/poodle mixes, at least the look of them. Can't say I like their personality though as they can have a wide range of personalities, so it's impossible to know (no matter what they say), especially when they are bred by breeders who don't care for temperament when they breed.. you can end up with anything. Like for every mutt, and like lots of badly bred purebreds.

So I guess it's more about falling in love with a specific dog than a breed or mix, in my opinion.
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  #13  
Old 01-27-2006, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran27
It doesn't matter if you get a mutt or a purebred if you want a great dog. Just don't get them from places that only care for selling puppies for a quick buck without any care of health or temperament (and I'm sorry but it's the case of *all* mutt breeders), when so many (purebred and mutts) need a home in shelters.
I think you're going a little far there. I got my dog (labradoodle, ya ya) from a breeder who does PENNhip testing, elbows with OFA testing, brucellosis testing, VonWillenbrand Disease through DNA testing also, and CERF testing. All of which I've seen the original result papers of.
Just because it's a mix breed doesn't mean that people can't be as passionate about them, as you are a pure-breed.
Not to mention, I paid $550 canadian dollars for my pup. I think it's safe to say the breeder I used, not only didn't make money, but probably lost money, considering all the testing.
I've said my peace about this now, and won't mention it again.
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  #14  
Old 01-27-2006, 10:27 AM
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Well, at least that's something. I still don't see any good reason for breeding them though.
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  #15  
Old 01-27-2006, 11:50 AM
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All purebreed dogs were mutts at one point in time, I think down the road alot of these "designer breeds" will actually become very popular and they will be more strict rules put on their breeding, you just need some good people to put the effort into breeding these dogs, to make sure they dont end up with health and behavioral problems. Alot of purebeed dogs are inbreed and have alot of problems too. You can spend a fortune on a purebreed dog and it end up in the pound also. I was going to get a purebreed poodle not a maltipoo, but there were none to be found in my area at the time, but one of the breeders I know told me that they are having alot of problems with the poodles right now with leg problems that is why there were none around. I already have a 13 yr old purebreed poodle and so does my mother, she got hers from a very good breeder, but she is 8 now and has quite a few health problems.
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  #16  
Old 01-27-2006, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran27
Well, at least that's something. I still don't see any good reason for breeding them though.
Do you use your golden for retrieving water fowl? If not, then you aren't using it for what it was originally bred for, and I see no point in carrying on that breed. (I say this with great sarcasm as I love goldens, along with every breed, or "non" breed of dog.)
All of the purebreeds were bred for a job of some sort. Do we not mainly bred now for companion animals (with a few exceptions to working dogs)? If we do breed for companions, which is quite evident with the temperments that are being produced and preffered, trying to maintain the puppy attitude throughout their lives, loyalty, friendliness, gentleness etc... then I see no reason in continuing to breed the purebreds that are made for a specific job. Why have a border collie in the home, if you don't have a field full of sheep to occupy them? Why have a Saint Bernard unless you go on mountain rescue missions? I am in no way saying these aren't fabulous breeds, but I am trying to be devils advocate here.
We as a society breed dogs to be our friends, not our employees anymore.

Whatever you say about a mix breed can be said about a pure-breed. Either way you look at it, it's mean to say something negative about a persons preferred (and owned) breed.
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  #17  
Old 01-27-2006, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinaweena
I think you're going a little far there. I got my dog (labradoodle, ya ya) from a breeder who does PENNhip testing, elbows with OFA testing, brucellosis testing, VonWillenbrand Disease through DNA testing also, and CERF testing. All of which I've seen the original result papers of.
Just because it's a mix breed doesn't mean that people can't be as passionate about them, as you are a pure-breed.
Not to mention, I paid $550 canadian dollars for my pup. I think it's safe to say the breeder I used, not only didn't make money, but probably lost money, considering all the testing.
I've said my peace about this now, and won't mention it again.
But you still can't get around the fact that they aren't a breed and therefore can't be shown, and have no standard to follow.

That's not to say no one should have one. If you want one just get it from a shelter or rescue.
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  #18  
Old 01-27-2006, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackDog
But you still can't get around the fact that they aren't a breed and therefore can't be shown, and have no standard to follow.

That's not to say no one should have one. If you want one just get it from a shelter or rescue.
I don't want to show my dog....I want it to be my companion.
I'm just trying to say that dogs are bred for different reasons than they used to be. There are standards to follow, and if you would do some reasearch instead of sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "LA LA LA LA LA" then you would learn that it is trying to be developed...much like any other new breed that probably had the same warm reception way back in the day that labradoodles are getting now adays.
I totally agree that some breeders are jerks, some puebred breeders are jerks also. A bunch are in it for the money. Just because somebody likes a certain breed and continues it on doesn't make them a good/bad person. This being said, it is the buyers responsibility to do research about the breeders, ask to see health testing papers, spend time with the parents, take a look at the kennel conditions. You find just as many purebred dogs in shelters as you do mixes.
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  #19  
Old 01-27-2006, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinaweena
I don't want to show my dog....I want it to be my companion.
I'm just trying to say that dogs are bred for different reasons than they used to be. There are standards to follow, and if you would do some reasearch instead of sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "LA LA LA LA LA" then you would learn that it is trying to be developed.
I meant there is no official breed standard becuse they aren't recognized. You say yourself they are "trying" to be developed. That shows that they aren't uniform enough to have a breed standard yet because they aren't developed. By the way, I've done research on many mix breeds as well as seen first hand the results of their litters. Most of them have behavior and/or health problems. And at the very least, there is very little to no uniformity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinaweena
Just because somebody likes a certain breed and continues it on doesn't make them a good/bad person.
Who said they are a bad people? I didn't.
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  #20  
Old 01-27-2006, 01:54 PM
Fran27 Fran27 is offline
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Guess we're going to talk about breeding again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madaline
All purebreed dogs were mutts at one point in time, I think down the road alot of these "designer breeds" will actually become very popular and they will be more strict rules put on their breeding, you just need some good people to put the effort into breeding these dogs, to make sure they dont end up with health and behavioral problems.
In a perfect world yes, but so far I have yet to find breeders of mutts who really care about making a standard. Tinaweena has a point, which is that some of them at least try to make healthy puppies (meaning testing the parents), but it's still a long shot from creating a standard for a breed. Let's face it, the big majority of people who sell those mutts do it because they are so popular and they can use lies to sell them easily (they don't shed, they're more healthy than purebreds etc etc).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madaline
Alot of purebeed dogs are inbreed and have alot of problems too. You can spend a fortune on a purebreed dog and it end up in the pound also.
This is true that purebreds can have lots of health issues also. It's less likely though if they come from a good breeder, although it can still happen. If you get your purebred from a bad breeder, you're very likely to have some sort of problem though. But good breeders will make sure that their puppies never end up in the pond, by making the buyer sign a contract about returning the dog to them if they can't take care of it anymore. I'm sure some people still get away with it, but it's much less common than for puppies brought without such a contract. Again, it's the difference between good breeders and backyard breeders.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinaweena
All of the purebreeds were bred for a job of some sort. Do we not mainly bred now for companion animals (with a few exceptions to working dogs)? If we do breed for companions, which is quite evident with the temperments that are being produced and preffered, trying to maintain the puppy attitude throughout their lives, loyalty, friendliness, gentleness etc... then I see no reason in continuing to breed the purebreds that are made for a specific job. Why have a border collie in the home, if you don't have a field full of sheep to occupy them? Why have a Saint Bernard unless you go on mountain rescue missions? I am in no way saying these aren't fabulous breeds, but I am trying to be devils advocate here.
We as a society breed dogs to be our friends, not our employees anymore.
Not always true, as some dogs are still used for whatever job they were created for, but I agree. But again it's not a debate vs purebred vs mutt. I'm not much more in favor of breeding purebreds than mutts to be honest, mostly for the reasons you gave. However, I do have some respect for breeders that breed their dogs in an attempt to improve the breed, while I have no respect for any breeders that just breeds dog for fun or money - and that goes for purebreds as much as mutts. The difference is that there is just no reason to breed mutts, as there is no breed to try to improve.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinaweena
There are standards to follow, and if you would do some reasearch instead of sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "LA LA LA LA LA" then you would learn that it is trying to be developed...much like any other new breed that probably had the same warm reception way back in the day that labradoodles are getting now adays.
This is where you're wrong. None of those 'breeders' is trying to develop a breed. They just want to sell cute and popular puppies. Furthermore, making a breed involves lots of 'testing' breeding, and when 5 million dogs are killed every year, I don't think there is any excuse to even try to make new breeds now... none.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinaweena
This being said, it is the buyers responsibility to do research about the breeders, ask to see health testing papers, spend time with the parents, take a look at the kennel conditions. You find just as many purebred dogs in shelters as you do mixes.
I totally agree, unfortunately lots of people are misinformed or just not informed at all and keep buying from those breeders (or petshops). It just happens that more threads have been done about mutts lately, but we just say the same things when someone wants to buy a purebred dogs and is asking for advice. It's never been a mutt vs purebred debate, it's just some people that want to make it one.
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