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  #71  
Old 09-20-2012, 12:19 AM
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Sorry, but I don't agree with "if a dog has food aggression, kill it". That sentiment seems like one of someone who is too lazy to rehabilitate the animal.

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Originally Posted by rubygirl View Post
Thankfully some people are of sound mind enough to believe this^^
Not so much in another forum I was part of *cough*
Are you suggesting that those who DON'T believe that aren't of sound mind?
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  #72  
Old 09-20-2012, 12:31 AM
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Yes, if a dog I raised and worked with daily OUT OF THE BLUE reacted like this and bit, I would probably PTS. This is NOT the case though. This is a dog who bit AFTER being pushed into it and really not being left any option.

(honestly, for the poor dog's sake it would probably be better off PTS than to be living a life in fear)
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  #73  
Old 09-20-2012, 05:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
I keep thinking of something that happened when I was in high school. There was this guy harassing me. At first I asked him nicely to 'please leave me alone'. He didn't and kept on. 'Go away'. He kept on. 'Get the **** away from me.' He didn't. So... I slugged him darn good and made him bleed. He finally left me alone.
Exactly. Does the fact that you slugged some guy make you a violent sociopath? Does it make you an unstable person, unfit to be in a public setting because you might snap at any moment? Does it mean you need to be locked up for the sake of keeping society safe? Of course not.

Same idea here.

When I watch the clip, I don’t see a dog who is willing to bite. I see a dog who is is very reluctant to bite. A dog who tried every way she knew how NOT to bite. To me that makes for a very fixable problem.
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  #74  
Old 09-20-2012, 05:36 AM
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Originally Posted by rubygirl View Post
This.
I don't know how many people on this forum have children but I do . If a dog of mine did this to a human being it would be dead. Period.
I don't think anything that Katy said was smug. She was giving her opinion which is exactly what forums are specifically created for.
If you’d actually read what I wrote, you’d know that
a) I do have children, we did take on a dog like this, and we did not PTS. In fact said dog is now a therapy dog. When I say this sort of thing is fixable, I mean it is *really* fixable.
b) I never said Katy was smug. I said “I don’t know if you mean to, but it SOUNDS smug.”


I wish people calling for these dogs to be PTS would put themselves in the shoes of folks like me who own and love these dogs. Its incredibly hurtful to repeatedly listen to “the dog should be dead” when said dog is right next to you snuggled up safely with two kids and a cat and clearly NOT better off dead.

To be clear, I have no problem with euthanasia for behavioral reasons, but when someone says “I have a former resource guarder” or “I have a dog who has bitten” and the next post says dogs like that need to be dead, its pretty insensitive. These are MY dogs we’re talking about here folks, saying that in your opinion my dogs need to be dead is not something anyone wants to hear.
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  #75  
Old 09-20-2012, 06:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenmagick View Post
Yes, if a dog I raised and worked with daily OUT OF THE BLUE reacted like this and bit, I would probably PTS. This is NOT the case though. This is a dog who bit AFTER being pushed into it and really not being left any option.

(honestly, for the poor dog's sake it would probably be better off PTS than to be living a life in fear)
Yes, I see a big big big difference between a provoked bite and just random aggression.

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Originally Posted by Danefied View Post
Exactly. Does the fact that you slugged some guy make you a violent sociopath? Does it make you an unstable person, unfit to be in a public setting because you might snap at any moment? Does it mean you need to be locked up for the sake of keeping society safe? Of course not.

Same idea here.

When I watch the clip, I don’t see a dog who is willing to bite. I see a dog who is is very reluctant to bite. A dog who tried every way she knew how NOT to bite. To me that makes for a very fixable problem.
Yep. You push any being long enough, they will defend themselves from a perceived threat.

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Originally Posted by Barbara! View Post
Are you suggesting that those who DON'T believe that aren't of sound mind?
And that. Honestly, I think it's absolutely CRAZY to expect a dog to just sit there and take what Cesar was doing to that dog without the dog reacting back.

I will go even farther. I would bet money if you put Mia in that situation, she would have bitten Cesar. I don't think she would have landed multiple bites or broken the skin like this dog, but I think she would have bitten. Would she bite me for doing the same thing? Not likely. But a stranger coming up and posturing over her then hitting her in the side, pursuing her, putting his hand on her muzzle, staring her down- she would at least probably have snapped at him. I would not expect any dog to tolerate that behavior. I know some would. Summer would- she'd be up in Cesar's face trying to give him kisses but she's an exceedingly friendly dog to a fault. Most dogs I've had would not have tolerated that behavior.

Someone on another forum put it quite succinctly.

Quote:
Sometimes when you aggress a dog they aggress back.
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  #76  
Old 09-20-2012, 06:33 AM
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I think if you can't handle fixing the problem sure putting the dog down is an option. But I think what makes Danefied upset is the idea 'that of course the dog should be put down' as if the dog will be a constant threat to those around them and those who keep them are housing a menace to society.

It is very fixable, and like things that are FIXable they stay fixed. A dog that was once a food guarder is no more likely to revert than a dog who has never been a food guarder. In fact less likely to become food guardy again due to the training.

I agree of all the behavioural issues out there its probably the easist to 'cure' the dog of.
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  #77  
Old 09-20-2012, 06:35 AM
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The dog didn't react like that to some random person though. She reacted like that to a person whose job is to 1. make aggressive dogs behave aggressively so that he may punish them, so he would have pushed and pushed until he did get a reaction, and 2. Make dramatic TV by showing the dogs do insanely out of control things.


He does everything in his power to make dogs go after him. I would never ever use a dog's reaction to him as a true test of a dog's temperament.
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  #78  
Old 09-20-2012, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post

I will go even farther. I would bet money if you put Mia in that situation, she would have bitten Cesar. I don't think she would have landed multiple bites or broken the skin like this dog, but I think she would have bitten. Would she bite me for doing the same thing? Not likely. But a stranger coming up and posturing over her then hitting her in the side, pursuing her, putting his hand on her muzzle, staring her down- she would at least probably have snapped at him. I would not expect any dog to tolerate that behavior. I know some would. Summer would- she'd be up in Cesar's face trying to give him kisses but she's an exceedingly friendly dog to a fault. Most dogs I've had would not have tolerated that behavior.

Someone on another forum put it quite succinctly.
I am pretty sure every JRT I have ever owned would have bitten him! I would put money that Sport would take his face off if he behaved that way (and this is a kids dog that is very reliable around people who are acting in non agressive ways. To the dog, kids can wrestle etc and he is fine) I think even the whippets would bite.
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  #79  
Old 09-20-2012, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbara! View Post
Sorry, but I don't agree with "if a dog has food aggression, kill it". That sentiment seems like one of someone who is too lazy to rehabilitate the animal.



Are you suggesting that those who DON'T believe that aren't of sound mind?
I would say IMO yes. If a dog who has food aggression (more accurate food guarding) behaviours that is 'normal' Ie not out of the blue rage type, as that indicates a larger problem. (Ie tumour etc)

Ok well maybe not always lazy, but not commited, not educated, etc. Its such an easy fix to kill a dog over. Yes that is a person's right but to assume its a good choice, or a first choice or more astounding (to me) an obvious choice to me is pretty horrifying.
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  #80  
Old 09-20-2012, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dekka View Post
I am pretty sure every JRT I have ever owned would have bitten him! I would put money that Sport would take his face off if he behaved that way (and this is a kids dog that is very reliable around people who are acting in non agressive ways. To the dog, kids can wrestle etc and he is fine) I think even the whippets would bite.
I bet you at least Mia, Nikki, Trey, probably Rosie, and Shack would have all bitten him.

The idea that all dogs must be as passive as a dog like Summer is ridiculous to me.
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