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  #11  
Old 07-12-2012, 07:31 PM
Jynx Jynx is offline
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My sister has two paps that she does agility with, Jacque is a son of the westminster winner, and definitely out of show lines, he's a poofy boy, but not "overly" poofy..
He's got a ton of agility titles, and really does love it.

Her other pap came from not the 'greatest' of breeders, he's oversize, definitely not as poofy, and I'd say not as "pretty" as Jacque..But, that dog can run, he is a wild man, and can do 50 sec courses in 13.

Jacque is more 'stuck up" I'd say) PeeAire (and yes that's how she spells his name!) is much more outgoing, has HUGE prey drive, and quite the little comedian.

I see alot of people in agility getting into paps, they are small, compact and can run like the wind, but I do see alot of variety when it comes to structure.
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Old 07-12-2012, 07:34 PM
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I've seen a lot of them but never met/pet one. Are they pretty sturdy dogs? They don't look like it but I'm not imagining much 'sturdy' build under all the fur. I could be wrong.

The only issue I've had with smaller dogs is that I always feel like I'm going to break them so I end up being kind of paranoid
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:59 PM
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They're not 'sturdy' like say a bulldog. Under that fur they are lanky little dogs. I watch mine closely around rough children and big, unruly dogs. My dogs HATE boxer/retriever/pit bull type play. Most mine are good with children though but I do keep a close eye on them.

They are sturdy in that they're built to run and jump and a lot have way more drive than most toy dogs. They are really fast for their size. My dogs fool everyone. It has been very consistent at agility class that my guys are among the fastest dogs both in speed but also in picking up he exercises in the classes. Today the people in Summer's class were amazed she was 8 and the oldest dog there by far. That's what keeps me coming back to these guys above all else. They are just so much fun to work with. Very intuitive, a little bit crazy, and always having a grand old time.
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Old 07-13-2012, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
They're not 'sturdy' like say a bulldog. Under that fur they are lanky little dogs. I watch mine closely around rough children and big, unruly dogs. My dogs HATE boxer/retriever/pit bull type play. Most mine are good with children though but I do keep a close eye on them.

They are sturdy in that they're built to run and jump and a lot have way more drive than most toy dogs. They are really fast for their size. My dogs fool everyone. It has been very consistent at agility class that my guys are among the fastest dogs both in speed but also in picking up he exercises in the classes. Today the people in Summer's class were amazed she was 8 and the oldest dog there by far. That's what keeps me coming back to these guys above all else. They are just so much fun to work with. Very intuitive, a little bit crazy, and always having a grand old time.
I'd say Laurelin did a pretty good job describing them right there.. as that sums Cali up to a tee (aside from the overly affectionate, eager to make new friends part). She's ridiculously fast for a 5lb dog, sometimes we'll be playing fetch and I'll be waiting for her to come back and then I'll look down and notice that she's already returned with the ball haha. I really think that if anybody wanted a "big dog in a small package", then a Papillon would be the way to go.

I can't really say much about lines and such, but if you were looking at a breeder, just look at the future pup's pedigree and look at their coats. And yes, altering does seem to affect the majority.. Cali has a fair bit of ear fringe but not a whole lot of fur on her body. Her tail is pretty long though.
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Old 07-13-2012, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
They're not 'sturdy' like say a bulldog. Under that fur they are lanky little dogs. I watch mine closely around rough children and big, unruly dogs. My dogs HATE boxer/retriever/pit bull type play. Most mine are good with children though but I do keep a close eye on them.

They are sturdy in that they're built to run and jump and a lot have way more drive than most toy dogs. They are really fast for their size. My dogs fool everyone. It has been very consistent at agility class that my guys are among the fastest dogs both in speed but also in picking up he exercises in the classes. Today the people in Summer's class were amazed she was 8 and the oldest dog there by far. That's what keeps me coming back to these guys above all else. They are just so much fun to work with. Very intuitive, a little bit crazy, and always having a grand old time.
Thanks! I really do think I would love them. Just wish I had more hands on experience with them.

I'm so hesitant to stray far from what I know... but at the same time, I think I got really really lucky with Jackson and I really think if I get another terrier, and expect it to be like him, it's not going to happen and I'll end up with a gazillion terrier qualities that I hate So I kind of just want to try something else out. It's why I've been looking at some herders lately that I never would have before. I want the loyalty, the devotion, the ease to train, and drive, and also want a dog that is somewhat aloof yet friendly enough (but not necessarily timid) AND can be a fairly good "bombproof" dog that is able to go anywhere (and not worry too much about DA/DR, etc). That's what I have with Jackson... the only thing I really want is a fetching dog LOL... I really want a dog who will love to play fetch. I have to really get Jackson into it by myself being excited too.

At this point, another dog is at least 1 year away but probably more like 2. So just like exploring some other options... and Paps always end up back on my list. It's just their darn size. I just kind of want a dog as much as Jackson (16lbs), or bigger (or only a tad smaller). But their drive is what keeps pulling me back to them, irregardless.
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Old 07-14-2012, 01:26 PM
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Some of the photos you posted are of young papillons, which is why they have shorter coats and less fringe. They don't tend to get their full coat until they're almost two.

My Crystal weighs 9-10 lbs at a good, healthy weight. She's a little tall for a papillon at 11.75 inches -- tall enough to be faulted in the ring but not disqualified. She came from a very good show breeder. I don't think it's too hard to find slightly oversized papillons from good breeders. In my case, Crystal was held back as a show prospect but ended up having a growth spurt. I got her when she was a year old and I got a nice discount on the price, too.

I've also found that the American lines have less fringe and might be more like what you want. Keep in mind that the ears are not supposed to be pointy, so if you like that look you might be better off going through a rescue because a good show breeder probably won't have many like that.

I also think that papillons in photographs tend to look like they have more fringe and coat than they actually do in real life. Crystal sometimes looks like she has quite a bit of coat in photos:



But really her coat and fringe are not profuse and are extremely easy to care for. I run a pin brush through her coat once a week and I bathe her once a month. I trim her feet and hocks around bath time, and that's it.

It's a little easier to tell that her fur's fairly short when she's damp:



I hate seeing papillons clipped. It won't really hurt them (unless it's too short and they can sunburn), but it just looks stupid to me. Personal preference.

Also, in general, the red and whites (not sable like Crystal and Summer, but true red and whites) seem to have less coat and less fringe. Females, like Laurelin said, also have less fringe and coat. Keep an eye out for an American line red and white female.
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