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  #21  
Old 06-07-2012, 12:26 PM
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I quite like my Toller/Doberman pairing. Dance is serious enough to not put up with their crap but fun and tough enough to enjoy playing with them. She and Ripley are awesome together. He likes both of the girls but seems to favour Dance over Keira. I know a couple other people with the same breed pairing and they seem to enjoy them as well. I don't really find many benefits to having the same breed vs. different breeds. Ripley and Keira are very opposite in a lot of ways. But they look pretty together and Ripley thinks Keira is nice to cuddle with in the evenings, even if she looks like she just wants to roll her eyes at him.

So yeah, I'm not really sure which breeds or types get along the best. I've always had quite a mixed bunch with never a problem. Rottweilers/Dachshunds, Bichon/Rottweilers, Border Collie mix/Dachshunds/Rottweiler, Toller/Dobermans.... none of which are overly similar in comparison to one another, but it worked well for us.

None of mine have ever reacted really poorly to certain types of dogs, though they definitely prefer not to be around rambunctious, in your face, body slamming types. Like most of the pit bull types we meet are and also a lot of Labs and Goldens too. They don't seem to know how to act around really stalky herding dogs ("are you playing? Why are you staring? You're weird."), but they don't really appear to have a problem with it either. That said, Dance appears to not be a big fan of retrievers in general. Flat-Coats drive her nuts, she's not a fan of being around a lot of Tollers, and most Labs and Goldens bring out the snark since they seem to enjoy wrestling rough a lot. And Dance does not generally play with other dogs that are not Ripley.

Next year I will have a working/sporting/herding group crew so we shall see how it goes as the new puppy grows up. I have a feeling Ripley is going to *love* her, Keira's going to be like "wtf. did we really need another crazy dog around here?" and Dance is going to like her but probably ignore her for the most part. And she'll probably be happy that Ripley has a new play buddy so that she can nap a little more.
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  #22  
Old 06-07-2012, 12:41 PM
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I think it really varies. If I was going from a border collie perspective, I'd say herding breeds HATE bully breeds and their play-styles mesh horribly, but I know lots of people with dogs like Malinois that mesh quite well with pit bulls and bully or mastiff breeds.

Border collies are a weird breed, kind of snobby and also kind of offensive to other dogs who are bothered by predatory, stalk-and-watch behavior. Eve doesn't like playing with other dogs, their bouncing and barking disturbs her a bit. Dakota, however, LOVES playing with other dogs, and he's bouncy and barky enough to not care about anything like that. Lots of variety within a breed.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:16 PM
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All I can say is Traveler adores Northern and Spitz type breeds. Husky? Traveler will love you. Shiba? New best friend.

Traveler plays harder and rougher than lot of the similar herding breeds. He uses his body to slam hard into dogs. But his favorite game is chase as long as he's the one chasing.

And I agree about them and small dogs. Traveler would take one home in a heartbeat. Especially if it's fluffy and white. And honestly thinks he should be able to since he likes to pee on those and only those.
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  #24  
Old 06-07-2012, 02:26 PM
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My guys are, for the most part, BFFs with other Nordic breeds. Especially other Finkies. However, Kimma's best friend is a Boxer and Bubbles the one day fell in love with a huge American Bulldog at the dog park. Both girls also loved playing with Xeph's GSDs. So yeah. It varies a bit

The only one I would worry about with, say, a fluffy toy breed would be Pentti. His prey drive is ridiculous. But I've also never put him in that position, so I can't be sure (I don't have any friends with smaller dogs, and Pen is not a dog park kind of guy).
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  #25  
Old 06-07-2012, 02:59 PM
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I have the original odd couple in my house It works great. They love each other. Basenji a sight/scent hound bred for running and has a play style that is all praying mantis...and Shar Pei a regal, serious breed that likes to bodyslam you and run into you like a bull! Surprisingly haveing Watson as a brother has brought the athletic side of Menchi. She will run with him and at times keeps up pretty well.

At the dog park Watson adores dogs that like to run with him...many herdbrains like to chase him so he loves them. Corgis are a big favorite with him. He also likes fluffy, nordic spitz types.

Menchi likes calm and polite dogs...she needs to get to know you to move past her pei snobbery.

They both made insta-friends with the most adorable Boston Terrier the other day.
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  #26  
Old 06-07-2012, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JacksonsMom View Post
Oh and I always forget GSD's are herders. And to me, they have an entirely different "prey drive" than, say, a Border Collie or an Aussie - just from the small amounts I've seen and been around.
I agree with this. Mals and GSDs are in between herding and working dogs, to me. Especially because both breeds do very little herding these days.

Some herding dogs have grip, but in general, a good herding dog (who is from herding lines) will go through the stalking, circling, and chasing patterns, but should have strongly inhibited grab and kill instincts to prevent them from injuring stock.

I haven't met a dog with more all-consuming, intense herding drive than Gonzo. He's also very hard-mouthed, as he's from cattle dogs. However, he's been on sheep, goats and ducks and never gripped any of them. Neither of my dogs have hurt any kind of animal of any size, and they both exhibit stalking behaviors. I can trust them with small animals because I know they might scare/harass them but won't hurt them.

I agree with Linds, herding breeds and nordic breeds are usually amazing together! Gonzo loooves Huskies, and anything with a curly tail. Fozzie too, but he's part Husky.
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  #27  
Old 06-07-2012, 06:12 PM
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Shelties and papillons were a ridiculously easy combination even though the shelties didn't seem to quite like the papillons' sense of humor. But the paps could always out move the shelties so there was only minor bickering. But overall they got on fabulously and were close enough in size that that was never a problem. I think the two breeds share enough temperament traits to do well. My shelties never body slammed, they were all about the chase game. The papillon boys will body slam each other and Mia tail grabs but they're still more of a chase kind of breed imo.

Boxers, bullies, labs, that kind of play style is the kind that my dogs HATE.
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  #28  
Old 06-07-2012, 06:18 PM
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Quinn is a herding breed (obviously, LOL) and very typical soft herder in the way that she hates obnoxious, bouncy, goofy dogs in her face or trying to touch her. Many dogs in the sporting group she Does. Not. Like - example, Labs, many Goldens, Vizslas, Weims, GSPs, etc. Also any doodle. She also does not like Boxers, Danes, Standard Poodles, or anything large and silly. Of course all dogs are individuals though - I've never seen her take to a dog the way she did to a big young Swissy who was just a big marshmallow and very gentle and easy going.

I would say she does best with toy breeds (she even forgives any barking and jumping they may do) and other (gentle or indifferent) herders. She does very nicely at herding because the dogs are generally paying more attention to the sheep than they are to getting at her. There is another ES there who is the definition of easy going and has a very nice, calm aura to her - she may reach out to Quinn occasionally but other than that is happy to ignore her. Quinn is very comfortable with and trusting of her.

My ideal pack would be Quinn, a male ES and either a Cav or a Chihuahua! Would love love love a Cavalier but the initial price and health problems are very scary. Maybe in the future. I have a couple Chi connections and I am less worried about health problems with them!
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  #29  
Old 06-07-2012, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red.Apricot View Post
She doesn't like dogs that play by body slamming hard, and she doesn't like being hurt by other dogs. She's leery of boxers because most of the ones she's met have been pretty rough players.
Belgians seem to dislike Boxers in general LOL Really in general, I don't think Bully style play fits well with herding style play.

One of the only dogs Loki really, really liked was a Greyhound. She is not generally very nice to other dogs and often not remotely interested in playing with them (unless you count guarding her space, toys, stuff and anything that could become her stuff as playing) but she was extremely tolerant of this Grey and absolutely loved playing with her.

Whim is a lot more easy going and will play with just about any dog that wants to play...except Boxers LOL. She has a pretty high prey drive but really loves little dogs and plays very well with them.

Jagger doesn't play much with dogs outside of the family - he's too manly. His "play" with non-family dogs (and sometimes family dogs LOL) is more just flirting and always leads to attempts at other things He hates all Boxers without question, even girls! Like Traveler, he has a "thing" for little white dogs...boys or girls, intact or not, nice to him or not he loves them all very, very much.

Savvy gets along well with most dogs, in that he isn't aggressive. He's quite rough in his play and can be overwhelming though. His BFF is an intact male Brittany who is a year old than him - they play very rough, very wild games together. He is able to learn to play nicely with dogs. I taught him to play nicely to the Yokiepoo we found last summer. I taught him to play nicely with the Belgian puppies I had for awhile last year too - initially the game he wanted to play was to grab them by the head/neck/ear and pull them around. He was having a great time but it was not very fun for the puppies... Some dogs seem to bring out a herd-yness in Savvy though, at least at the grooming shop. Usually big, fat Goldens. I suspect it has to do with me wrestling to get a 120lb Golden into the tub or a cage or up onto a table. He wants to help by getting behind them barking and clacking towards them. He is of course, not allowed to do this but it is what he wants to do with those dogs. He is sometimes too rough with Whim and it makes her sad He's only just started being able to play with Jagger and Ziggy and he's very polite towards them because he is a bit intimidated by Jagger's manliness and Ziggy's snarkiness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihartgonzo View Post
I agree with this. Mals and GSDs are in between herding and working dogs, to me. Especially because both breeds do very little herding these days.
Honestly, that depends on who you get them from. My friend's Mal is from a breeder who uses her dogs daily on her ranch and quite a few Mals do herding. The things required for SchH and that style of herding are not actually that far off from each other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihartgonzo View Post
Some herding dogs have grip, but in general, a good herding dog (who is from herding lines) will go through the stalking, circling, and chasing patterns, but should have strongly inhibited grab and kill instincts to prevent them from injuring stock.
This really depends on the breed. It is nearly impossible to make generalizations about what a herding dog should or shouldn't do when herding varied so much in different areas when these breeds were developed. GSDs are supposed to grip. Their herding style involved extremely large groups of sheep that had to be moved all around and kept together without fences. ACD's herding style is defined by "hitting heads and heels". PyrSheps have a much more aggressive herding style because the sheep they were used on were extremely desensitized to the dog and shepherd because of the way sheep were raised in the area. So to get the sheep to move when they had to, staring or pressure from movement was often just not enough. BCs are a more "fancy" herding breed, developed for herding trials and what we would consider more traditional farm work. What is correct herding style for a GSD is not appropriate for a BC and what is appropriate for a BC is not appropriate for a PyrShep and so on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihartgonzo View Post
I haven't met a dog with more all-consuming, intense herding drive than Gonzo. He's also very hard-mouthed, as he's from cattle dogs. However, he's been on sheep, goats and ducks and never gripped any of them. Neither of my dogs have hurt any kind of animal of any size, and they both exhibit stalking behaviors. I can trust them with small animals because I know they might scare/harass them but won't hurt them.
IMO if a dog is willing to scare and harass a small animal, I would never trust them not to get overstimulated and injure or kill the small animal in the wrong circumstance. One of my ferrets was killed by an Aussie who lived on a farm with chickens, cats/kittens and went to a daycare with small dogs without issue for years. Also dogs who have excellent herding drive but no training, left alone with livestock may end up injuring, killing them or scaring them bad enough that they injure themselves. Like most behavior, things aren't always black and white. Sometimes dogs who are very talented can start off pretty...forceful with livestock before they get a good understanding of what they must do.
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  #30  
Old 06-07-2012, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
Belgians seem to dislike Boxers in general LOL Really in general, I don't think Bully style play fits well with herding style play.

One of the only dogs Loki really, really liked was a Greyhound. She is not generally very nice to other dogs and often not remotely interested in playing with them (unless you count guarding her space, toys, stuff and anything that could become her stuff as playing) but she was extremely tolerant of this Grey and absolutely loved playing with her.

Whim is a lot more easy going and will play with just about any dog that wants to play...except Boxers LOL. She has a pretty high prey drive but really loves little dogs and plays very well with them.

Jagger doesn't play much with dogs outside of the family - he's too manly. His "play" with non-family dogs (and sometimes family dogs LOL) is more just flirting and always leads to attempts at other things He hates all Boxers without question, even girls! Like Traveler, he has a "thing" for little white dogs...boys or girls, intact or not, nice to him or not he loves them all very, very much.

Savvy gets along well with most dogs, in that he isn't aggressive. He's quite rough in his play and can be overwhelming though. His BFF is an intact male Brittany who is a year old than him - they play very rough, very wild games together. He is able to learn to play nicely with dogs. I taught him to play nicely to the Yokiepoo we found last summer. I taught him to play nicely with the Belgian puppies I had for awhile last year too - initially the game he wanted to play was to grab them by the head/neck/ear and pull them around. He was having a great time but it was not very fun for the puppies... Some dogs seem to bring out a herd-yness in Savvy though, at least at the grooming shop. Usually big, fat Goldens. I suspect it has to do with me wrestling to get a 120lb Golden into the tub or a cage or up onto a table. He wants to help by getting behind them barking and clacking towards them. He is of course, not allowed to do this but it is what he wants to do with those dogs. He is sometimes too rough with Whim and it makes her sad He's only just started being able to play with Jagger and Ziggy and he's very polite towards them because he is a bit intimidated by Jagger's manliness and Ziggy's snarkiness.



Honestly, that depends on who you get them from. My friend's Mal is from a breeder who uses her dogs daily on her ranch and quite a few Mals do herding. The things required for SchH and that style of herding are not actually that far off from each other.



IMO if a dog is willing to scare and harass a small animal, I would never trust them not to get overstimulated and injure or kill the small animal in the wrong circumstance. One of my ferrets was killed by an Aussie who lived on a farm with chickens, cats/kittens and went to a daycare with small dogs without issue for years. Also dogs who have excellent herding drive but no training, left alone with livestock may end up injuring, killing them or scaring them bad enough that they injure themselves. Like most behavior, things aren't always black and white. Sometimes dogs who are very talented can start off pretty...forceful with livestock before they get a good understanding of what they must do.
Totally agree. My boy is from strict sch lines and is not at all small animal aggressive but he maintains a beautiful herding and excited prey drive.

I was told that herding is similar to stalking and hunting with a cap before the kill, I'm not sure how true that is but it makes sense in some ways.
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