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Old 02-22-2010, 06:11 PM
sammgirl sammgirl is offline
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Default What is the "right" thing?

Just curious on everyone's thoughts...

So, some breeds are really cool, but probably not for most people. Some breeds are def. more social and non-aggressive then others. I know there are individuals, but on the whole one can make generalization about breeds. For example, Akitas are aloof, poodles are smart, German Shepherds are police dogs...

Anyway, I was thinking and though I agree with trying to maintain the original intent of a breed, is it bad to "dumb it down" enough for John Q Public so that it doesn't go extinct?

At what point in time is a cardigan (for example) not a cardigan anymore? Is it when they lose herding ability? Is it when people keep breeding a basset sized cardigan, when the original breed standard topped out at around 32lbs for large males?

Why is a light eye worse then hip dysplasia?

For me, part of my love for this breed comes from their edginess and their intelligence. The looks, while I adore, for me come second.

Not to say I like a clunky cardigan, but I think you can breed some measure of refinement in your line and still maintain that great drivey attitude.

So what about you and your breed? How would you feel if it went extinct? Would you be surprised if it did, or do you think it's versatile enough to make it into the "future?"

Being realistic, SHOULD your breed make it into the future? If so, why?
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:28 PM
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Fran101 Fran101 is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Boston
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I dont believe breeds should be changed to be totally biddable, happy go lucky and fit for the "average dog owner". How BORING would that be lol

What makes people love certain breeds is more than just looks, its what makes their temperament special. Clingy, aloof, edgy, active, etc..

The owner should pick a breed based on breed traits. not pick on looks and change the dogs temperament to fit

TRUE Breed lovers (few or many) will stop the breed the love from going extinct. so in my eyes thats not even a problem. You dont need a bunch of eager puppy buyers to keep a breed going.. just a few people who love the breed. and ALL dog breeds have a club ready to do exactly that

As for my breed, the chihuahua. Ya.. Of course they will lol They are small ,portable, popular and people friendly. Apartment friendly and not to mention "fashionable" lol. and their size and temperament pretty much makes them a great dog for most people.. they are BRED to be companions & they are good at it.

I do worry about them being bred into tiny tiny shaking vicious little trolls..

Disclaimer: I work for Trupanion and love it/our policy! But I do not speak for the company or as the company.
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:43 PM
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PlottMom PlottMom is offline
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Location: SoCal
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I'm not too concerned about bassets going extinct... where there are people who want a couch dog, there will be bassets I DO worry about the working-bred basset going extinct... they're quite uncommon already, but thankfully there are some breeders out there doing their part. That being said, even with the rabbit hunting drive, most people can still handle a basset...

Plotts I'm not worried about going extinct - again, as a result of them being accepted into the AKC breed ring, I'm a bit scared we're going to lose the working aspect of the breed. While I appreciate a beautiful hunting dog (hey, you still have to look at it when you feed it, amiright?), traditionally they were bred coondog to coondog, without a thought for the aesthetics. However, for the most part, they are more "mountain bred dogs" than your English line coonhounds - they're much more loyal to "home and hearth", making them, IMHO, much easier for the average pet owner. The ones I've met have been pretty obedient (if time is spent with them) and they seem to bond better with one owner/family than some of the other hunting hounds... we're of the opinion that they're pretty much the best housepets ever.

Like the OP said, there's variation among individuals/lines...

The Plotts:
UKC GRCH 'PR' Hannas Creek Liz
GRCH FCH CCH CA 'PR' Jebb's Bayou Rage
OFA Hips: Good, Eyes: Normal
2010 & 2015 UKC Coonhound World Show Qualified

Midnight Brindle Bombshell - "Pink"
UKC GRCH CCH 'PR' Skyplott Teddy Bearhug (5/2004 - 3/2014)

And the "off-colored" hounds:
'PR' Dead River K-N-A Swagger (English coonhound)
Daisy Duke Garrett CGC, RA & my <3 dog. Forever "The Favorite", 5/25/2000 - 2/9/2015 (basset)
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:48 PM
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Lizmo Lizmo is offline
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I don't agree with 'watering down' a breed just so the avarage John Doe can own it. If anything, I'd want it to maintain it's high standard so the avarage John Doe DOESN'T want to own it.

For my breed, the Border Collie, I don't think it will go exstinct. I would be very, very disappointed and suprised if it went exstinct. The Border Collie is very versatile, so even if it wasn't working stock, I don't see it changing that much...since many working bred dogs also do things like agility, obedience, rally, flyball, therapy work, etc. The only thing you *might* loose over many, many generations is the ability to work stock. Even after many years I'm not sure how much you'd loose. It might become watered down, but I really don't know how much you'd loose that. Because if you're breeding a dog with tons of talent on sheep, but never take it to sheep and you breed that said dog for other reasons, you've still got that talent passed down.

The Border Collie should definitely make it into the future. They help many, many farmers, ranchers, cowboys, etc do jobs all over the world. They're an invaluable asset to any farm or ranch. One $800, trained Border Collie will do the job of few hired hands on a farm/ranch.

l ~Jennifer~ l
l Handler for Team Blazin' l Photographer at Joy Photography l Nikon D40X with 35mm 1.8 Nikkor Lens l
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:59 PM
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HayleyMarie HayleyMarie is offline
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I am not to worried about the Westie going extinct. It is one of the most popular terriers right now and they make great companions, what I am worried about it their drive being bred out of them. Their drive and spunk is what makes them a terrier. And its why I love the breed so much.

A big problem within the breed is that breeders are staring to breed them smaller and smaller I have seen some pretty small westies out there.

Teagan Westhighland White Terrier
Panzer South African Boerboel Mastiff
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Old 02-22-2010, 07:42 PM
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Laurelin Laurelin is offline
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Realistically many of our current breeds will either change dramatically or go extinct in the future. It's what has happened in the past and what will happen in the future. I don't know that this is bad, just the way things are. As our needs for dogs change, the types of dogs we have will also change.

Most of our current breeds are not very old. The papillon is considered 'old' and its only 500-600 years old. Breeds like GSDs, Shelties, even border collies are relatively modern creations in contrast. There are many breeds that were not rare not all that long ago that are gone today. I can only think of a handful of breeds that are thousands of years old and haven't changed hardly at all.

I do know that papillons will not go extinct in my lifetime. I wouldn't let that happen. Past that? Who knows honestly.

I feel my breed is starting to hit its prime as far as popularity. I have mixed feelings about it but I think in the future they'll be about as popular as poms and chis which makes me sad. I'm actually surprised they're not as popular for a variety of reasons. I see them nowadays out and about and people recognize them. Good and bad sign imo.

I think we have at least another 500 years left. I guess it depends on defining the 'future'. Forever? I highly doubt many or any of the breeds will be around forever.

Hank CA - (approx. 1 1/2 year old Spotty Dog)
Mia CGC - (6 1/2 year old Papillon)
Summer TG3 TIAD - (11 year old Papillon)
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Old 02-22-2010, 08:54 PM
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elegy elegy is offline
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this is something that's talked about constantly in the pit bull community with regards to dog aggression. there are those who are adamant that dog aggression should be bred out, period. dog aggression serves no purpose, it's inconvenient, it gets dogs dead. the only people who could possibly want a dog aggressive dog are dog fighting scum.

the problem with that is that it's not so simple. there is no gene for dog aggression. it's a side effect i guess you could call it of all the breed traits that make this breed the remarkable breed that so many pit bull lovers greatly desire. the drive, the tenacity, the confidence-- not uncommon in many working breeds, just as dog aggression is not uncommon in many working breeds.

is dog aggression a pain in the butt? yeah, sometimes. is it limiting? again, yeah, sometimes. but if the other option is a watered down shadow of the breed i love, i'm not interested. i'll look elsewhere.

there are so many pit bulls out there who are wimpy, excessively soft, and fearful. i saw two of them today at work. i don't want that as the future of my breed.
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Old 02-23-2010, 02:26 PM
Psyfalcon Psyfalcon is offline
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Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,434

With the Pits though, since their original purpose is illegal, I don't see the point in keeping ALL the dog aggression, it could be the end of the breed. But breed for the drive and strength. You might never get rid of all the dog aggression, or it might take longer.

I don't think the aggression is the same as tenacity. They might be linked now, but you should be able to carefully separate them.
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Old 02-23-2010, 02:42 PM
Saeleofu Saeleofu is offline
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I'm not worried about boxers going extinct because people don't want them. I think if they were to go extinct, it's because TOO MANY people want them, and their health has suffered. I have yet to see a boxer at work healthy after age 8. Between cancer, heart problems, arthritis/hip displaysia...yeah, it sucks.

Ideally, the GOOD breeders will keep the HEALTHY boxers going. They're hard to come by though. I'd love to get a boxer to train as my service dog, but I cannot find a breeder that is producing dogs that are high quality enough to be service dogs.
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Old 02-23-2010, 04:35 PM
Criosphynx Criosphynx is offline
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I could think of several traits that I'd like to see go away.
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