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Old 02-21-2010, 11:29 PM
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pitbullpony pitbullpony is offline
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Default If it shouldn't be named an alpha roll ... what should it be called?

Threw it in this section; since most people use the concept of an "alpha roll" in the process of training -- silly humans that's why you have thumbs.

However when your dog "alpha rolls" another dog; what would you call it.

Just curious, Kim is an artiste at this point; she's very smooth, Dora isn't quite so subtle.
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Old 02-22-2010, 01:31 AM
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wcladymacbeth wcladymacbeth is offline
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wrestling? I dunno. My dogs don't do that. They wrestle and sometimes roll onto their backs while they play but it's not anyone rolling the other one over. do some dogs do that when they play?
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Old 02-22-2010, 01:56 AM
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Fran101 Fran101 is offline
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Most of the time, id call it playing or wrestling.

but if it becomes something unfriendly/holding the other dog down, that is being a bully! and I correct that kind of thing, even though hes 5 pounds lol a bullys a bully
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Old 02-22-2010, 05:16 AM
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TheGoldenRetriever TheGoldenRetriever is offline
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Playing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wcladymacbeth View Post
My dogs don't do that.
Mine don't either, never ... good thing too!! One is huge and about 85 lbs. and the other is a little 12 pounder guy.

The little one tries mightily to play with the big one ... the big one completely ignores it, which in most cases gets the little one to stop. Occasionally it doesn't ... at which times the big guy gets a look on his face that says "Would one of you hoomans kindly get this mosquito offa me?"
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:16 AM
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yeah, here we call it wrestling as well.

although one time i brought luce into the petstore and she made eye contact with another dog on the other side of the room and he rolled himself. alpha luce!
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:40 AM
PoodleMommy PoodleMommy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elegy View Post
yeah, here we call it wrestling as well.

although one time i brought luce into the petstore and she made eye contact with another dog on the other side of the room and he rolled himself. alpha luce!
mine do this also... all Armani or Elle has to do is look at Bella and she flips over... its weird... Armani will go over and look at her like "get up I want to play with you, what are you doing on your back?!"

Otherwise they only get rolled over when they are playing and that's nothing serious.

No one here just rolls anyone over for no reason or tries to hold someone down for more then a second or two in play.
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Old 02-22-2010, 09:24 AM
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The term, "alpha roll" refers to the concept of showing the dog who's boss, a forceful, domineering, non-playful, aggressive disciplinary action. From a dog's point of view, it is an attack which threatenes the dog's safety or life, whether a human or another animal does it.

Quote:
since most people use the concept of an "alpha roll" in the process of training
I would hope that the concept of an alpha roll in the process of training is not used by most people and in fact, hope that education is causing this barbaric and stupid technique to dwindle.

What you guys are talking about sounds more like you're wrestling or playing, rolling the dog over with a playful demeanor, either the human or another dog is playing with the dog. This is not an alpha roll. It's just a roll. LOL.
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Old 02-22-2010, 10:05 AM
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In my house no one gets rolled.. ever. If dekka is annoyed she will grab the flattened (cause they see her coming) dog by the muzzle for a few seconds. BUT the puppies will flip themselves over in front of the adults.
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Old 02-22-2010, 10:22 AM
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K- so apparently I have an aberration? Kim has done it to numerous dogs that are inappropriately forward towards her; or they do not show the correct obsequious-ness to her; in her mind (I can only guess what is in her mind).

Latest episode was; neutered male dog - very friendly towards all other dogs on his property, he is big - goldendoodle and is very hairy -- all white. We were out walking in his woods; Kim is un-spayed Central Asian Shepherd; she claims land very quickly; the guardian perspective; so we made a campfire - 4 adults; 2 kids (Kim's) and Wally (male dog) and his owner were approaching the campsite; Kim alerted and when met by the owner; was fine with them joining us. Also at the campfire was an older beagle who Kim leaves alone (the beagle doesn't like other dogs) and an immature Springer; who Kim was attempting to mount and muzzle punch to get a reaction from.

Wally came over to say hi; no reaction to Kim; he went to see her; put his head above hers; and she reared up with great snarls and lots of teeth (I will not use the word attack; since there was no damage) and put Wally upside down in the snow, he resisted her; until she "won". I stepped in too early and when he got up without her permission; it started all over again. This time I left it for her to decide; it was very interesting. Wally was on his back, tail between his legs, front legs curled; no resistance; pacifying grin. Kim proceeded to get up in stages, one foreleg, then the next; when Wally didn't move until she had removed all her weight, she stepped aside; and "allowed" him to get up and go back to his owner. She proceeded to ignore him from then on; and still does; they can stand near to each other; she is "boss" what she says goes; if she wants to be near the door; he steps back and lets her go first.

If that's not an alpha roll; what would you call it?

Dora doesn't use her teeth like Kim; she bodyslams other dogs with the intent of knocking them off their feet; there is a distinct difference in mannerisms between play and "domination"; I know people don't like to believe in that word; but there is really no better way to describe it.

Curious.
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Old 02-22-2010, 12:28 PM
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Neither I nor my dogs have ever forcibly pinned another dog. We've had other dog's roll on their backs for us, by their choice.

The whole notion of another dog forcibly doing that to another is ridiculous. We've seen Millan trying that with dog's that he outweighs by 2-3X and even with 2 grasping hands it is not easy.
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