Ceasar M. has his own mag

[corgipower]

Originally Posted by Lolas Dad

Why not re-home the dog with someone that might be able to change the behavior?

The people who are able to handle such a dog often don't want to take on such a dog. Finding someone who is able to and willing to take on a dog like that is very difficult and sometimes impossible.

[Dekka]

We are not talking typical 'bad behaviours' for one. And two the sort of people who can handle extreme behaviour problems are very few and likely already have dogs (or don't want dogs with problems) And three, (and biggest IMO) In the year(s) it takes to maybe fix one dog hundreds (thousands?) die that could have been helped in that time. There comes a point when you need do save the most you can.

Let me tell you the story of Sammy...
Sammy was a young JRT who came into rescue. He had a conflicting story, he was supposed to be highly aggressive, and had bitten, but people who met him said he was sweet. Then he went to a foster home, where they said he was crazy. The person who transported him to me said he was adorable and sweet, he was fine with me on the way home. He was fine when he met hubby the first time.

Next morning he acted like he wanted to eat hubby. So we did TONES of work with him. He was fine with all women and kids just hated men. I had all food come from hubby. Sammy was fine as long as there was food. As soon as the food ran out he would freeze, and look up and thank doG I had him on leash!! He never got better.

To add to this he would shake, not the nervous dog shake, I have had a few JRTs come in that do that. This was like an excess of energy shake. He could do swimmers turns off walls at chest height. I could scale almost anything and what he couldn't scale he would attempt to chew through.

Then one day he decided he wanted to eat kids. NOTHING had changed. Bet my life sort of sure that nothing had happened. And when this dog hated things he lost his brain. He would foam and air bite and spin in his crate if he saw the object of his 'hate'. He would grab the bars and pull till his gums bled. He would fling himself at the door.. even after the person left he would continue for a while. It was scary.

So what would you do with such a dog? The rescue seriously though about seeing if they could adopt him out to a lesbian couple. But I said this dog is a high risk at getting loose, and unlike dogs with fear issues.. he would fixate on the first man or child he saw and attack. Even if someone wanted to take him he was too large a liability for the rescue to adopt out.

Taking him in to be PTS was heartbreaking. He was still happy with me....

[Lolas Dad]

Originally Posted by corgipower

We generally don't euth people who are old and ill and have zero quality of life either. Would you suggest we allow dogs to continue their life even though they may have terminal or crippling diseases that prevent them from enjoying their life?

That is an entirely different matter that has nothing to do with the present subject.

Originally Posted by corgipower

The people who are able to handle such a dog often don't want to take on such a dog. Finding someone who is able to and willing to take on a dog like that is very difficult and sometimes impossible.

There are many rescue organizations that would gladly take such a dog and re-train the dog. Again dogtown is one of them.

With your logic I guess you would think it is ok to euth all dogs in shelters to because a lot of them did not have the right training.

[Dekka]

Originally Posted by Lolas Dad

That is an entirely different matter that has nothing to do with the present subject.



There are many rescue organizations that would gladly take such a dog and re-train the dog. Again dogtown is one of them.

With your logic I guess you would think it is ok to euth all dogs in shelters to because a lot of them did not have the right training.

Once again I don't think we are talking the same level of problems. Food guarding is an easy fix, as are many typical behaviour problems. But the extreme problems that are likely genetic are not 'fixable'. And no rescues CAN'T take those dogs. The liability is too great. The JRTRO is the only rescue I know of that takes dogs with bite histories.

[Lolas Dad]

Originally Posted by Dekka

So what would you do with such a dog? The rescue seriously though about seeing if they could adopt him out to a lesbian couple. But I said this dog is a high risk at getting loose, and unlike dogs with fear issues.. he would fixate on the first man or child he saw and attack. Even if someone wanted to take him he was too large a liability for the rescue to adopt out.

Taking him in to be PTS was heartbreaking. He was still happy with me....

I would have gotten in contact with a rescue organization that would have trained him better and gave him more time.

[darkchild16]

Then you dont wrk many ue knowV few wh would deal with a dog of that magnitude and for it to be adopted out. Plus WHY WHY WHY would you torture that dog??? That IMO and most dog peoples opinion cruel to the dog. That dog was so upset if he saw them he could not FUNCTION properly.

What about if is dog was a 130 pound mastiff or 180 pound mastiff? Im sure you wouldnt want to be the one helping rehab him.

[Dekka]

Originally Posted by Lolas Dad

I would have gotten in contact with a rescue organization that would have trained him better and gave him more time.

hahahahahah

Well I AM one of the people rescues give dogs with problems too. The JRTRO is the main JRT rescue for all of Canada. Its a very active amazing rescue. I had him ~5 months.. how much time do you suggest?

AND IME most rescues know squat about rehabbing dogs. (there is a forum full of rescue types and they LOVE LOVE CM and BP they think its all alpha rolls and pack leader crap)

[Laurelin]

Originally Posted by Lolas Dad

I would have gotten in contact with a rescue organization that would have trained him better and gave him more time.

How would you have found a rescue organization to take him? Rescues are not clamoring to take in unstable dogs.

Sorry I've been lurking...

[ihartgonzo]

Originally Posted by Lolas Dad

I would have gotten in contact with a rescue organization that would have trained him better and gave him more time.

Places like Dogtown aren't on every corner, you know... that place is very very unique. And, I doubt that they would take on a dog that actually hurt themselves out of frustration of not being able to act out aggression. Every rescue I have known of, worked with, and adopted from does NOT take in any dog who has shown an inkling of HA, much less a biter, much less a dog who is hurting himself because he wants to attack people.

There are dogs that are afraid of kids and other dogs, who can be worked with and desensitized. A dog who is afraid and runs away is not the kind of dog that I worry about. Then there are dogs who are just too far gone or who are not wired right... and, as much as I love dogs, I feel it's selfish, pompous and insane to keep a dog alive who is at all times a real danger to society and who must be managed 24/7. Accidents happen, and when one little slip of a leash or door could result in a person's death or mutilation, society needs to be protected. Particularly when every dog attack makes it harder and more stressful to own a dog in this country. As Dekka said, we murder millions of dogs every year for no reason other than a lack of homes. Euthing a dog who wants to kill people doesn't seem that inhumane in comparison.

[Lolas Dad]

Originally Posted by Dekka

hahahahahah

Well I AM one of the people rescues give dogs with problems too. The JRTRO is the main JRT rescue for all of Canada. Its a very active amazing rescue. I have him ~5 months.. how much time do you suggest.

AND IME most rescues know squat about rehabbing dogs. (there is a forum full of rescue types and they LOVE LOVE CM and BP they think its all alpha rolls and pack leader crap)

Guess you think that maybe Dogtown should euth all the dogs they have as well then. There are some there that are never adopted out but they can lead a full life their with other dogs.

You said you took the JRT in to be eutherd. Did you actually watch the process? Have you ever seen a dog gassed that does not get PTS by the needle? It's very in-humane but I guess you think that is better in the long run.

YouTube - Davie's Law/ Humane Euthanasia in NC Animal Shelters

After you watch this entire video let me know how you feel. That is if you actually do watch it. If not then as far as I am concerned the matter is closed with you having your opinion and I having mine.