"Caesar methods" on BIRDS!!! What next!?

LauraLeigh

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#1
I don't understand people sometimes!!

I know I'll get some negative comments from this but it has worked for me. Years ago, I spoke to a bird trainer and she said that birds have a pecking order (no pun intended) like dogs and humans and dominance needed to be established. She told me that when he (my grey) bit me to put him in a submissive posture (on his back) and calmly tell him "no biting" a few times then release him. Obviously, since he was riled in the first place and to save myself from being bitten again, I would have to get a towel or something to protect my hand (much like you see them do at a bird grooming). When this is done, I would remain very calm, even though blood was spurting from wherever it was, and let him know I was in control. This isn't for everybody, and my husband is too afraid to do it but my bird and I have a very close relationship. He has gone from a bad bite every 3 or 4 months to maybe one a year. I think it's actually been more than a year now. It is true, they are very smart and cognizant of fear and will take any opportunity to nail someone they don't respect. My guess is that your husband needs to build up the respect between them. My bird is very well adjusted, exercises three to four times a day, and a non-plucker.
I'm not sure how this bird wound up well adjusted but can almost promise it was in spite of being Alpha rolled!!! Poor bird must have been terrified
 

sillysally

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#2
It's more likely that the rolling "worked" because it scares the bird, not because there is any actual respect being gained. I have two female white wings together and they do steal food from each other and squabble, but I have never seen either do anything close to "rolling over" in submission like dogs will do to each other. Having a bird lay on its back willingly for you is supposed to be a trust based exercise--they're prey animals--not a punishment based one.

This is an excellent way to seriously traumatize the bird, turn a bird into a defensive biter, and get a super nasty bit...
 

Emily

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#3
I don't have birds and I'm not a bird person but that seems like a good way to have your fingers amputated. :popcorn: Seriously, people? Have you SEEN the beak on an African Grey?
 
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#4
Or a good way to make your parrot fear and loathe you. And those suckers really know how to hold a grudge.
 

Beanie

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#5
Yeah, I think there's irony in the comment that "Oh birds understand fear!" and using it in a kind of "he can SMELL YOUR HUSBAND'S FEAR" type of thing, and yet missing the fact that, uh, yup - it's that understanding fear that has changed your bird's behaviour, because you terrified him.
 

SoCrafty

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#6
As someone who owns a bird with issues - this sounds like SUCH a bad idea. It takes patience and 'marking' good behaviors and ignoring (to the best of ones ability) the bad ones.
 

Romy

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#7
Somebody tried to "roll" my old boss' macaw one time. This was before he got the bird. He actually got it for free as a result of this incident.

Idiot got mad at Solomon for screaming and nipping at everyone all the time. He's kind of a sassy bird, I'll give him that. So they grabbed him and forced him onto his back. Yeah... 90-some odd stitches down the length of their forearm later, they realized that was a bad idea.

He never trusted adults to handle him after that. But he adored children and would tolerate all kinds of crap them.
 

LauraLeigh

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#8
It just blew me away, I've had birds a while now and recently adopted a 22 year old grey because since the fire the house has been too quiet.......

I joined a Facebook group where this discussion was happening and was floored.....
 

Gypsydals

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#9
WOW I would never ever think to roll Cleo as a punishment. Someone is going to get seriously hurt trying that.
 
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#10
Or a good way to make your parrot fear and loathe you. And those suckers really know how to hold a grudge.
This. Regardless of the fact that I disagree with Cesar methods/alpha rolling/whatever on dogs....DOGS ARE NOT BIRDS. I would never attempt to put a bird in a "submissive posture" - you could seriously injure a small bird, and a large bird could seriously injure you.
 

sillysally

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#11
I guess ultimately I'm not that surprised something like this would be tried. I can't tell you how many times people where shocked I didn't strike one of my birds for biting. Umm, it's a bird, it's body weight is measured in grams, if I didn't totally terrify it I would probably kill it!
 
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#12
I don't have birds and I'm not a bird person but that seems like a good way to have your fingers amputated. :popcorn: Seriously, people? Have you SEEN the beak on an African Grey?
Yep, but a Hyacynth Macaw's beak is REALLY scary. My friend had one for 55 years, named Fernando. He loved to climb up on my shoulder and play with my eyebrows. He would lick them and groom them. I got used to it after a while, but the first couple of times, I kept thinking I was about to get an eye pulled out. He could bite a 1" oak dowel in two without much effort. Watching him saw through a bag of Brazil Nuts was amazing. He had one foot holding himself up, and the other jamming the nuts into his mouth with the shells flying everywhere was impressive as hell. The one thing that kept me from ever getting one was the amazing mess he generated and his habit of chewing on all kinds of stuff..
 

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