Any other breeds I should be looking at?

okay, thanks
Are the WLHD whippets then usually just bred if they have good structure/temperment? Can they be shown?

Yes. At the last RBC show Rumour (don't know her reg name) a WLHD got reserve in show.

Hmm, interesting

A Chinook! Visit http://www.chinook.org/. Based on at least what you wrote, a Chinook girl may be a fit and would certainly color coordinate well with the Corgis.

Debbie

Those just look like youngun's to me. Especially the second one.

I can dig up some pretty awful pics of Nikki before she grew her adult coat in.This is the only picture I can find right now:



She grew into this:



Also, Nik actually has MORE hair than Trey it's just not as long.

Here's one. (I wish I'd taken more pics of these two before they were old!)



Here's Nik at her worst as far as coat goes.

if you think a PWD and a BC might be too much dog for you, I wouldn't bother looking at Malinois - while there may be a soft, mellow one in ONE class, in general that is not the norm for the breed and that dog is an abnormality and quite rare within the breed. Mals are BC's on crack.

along that thread, while engies are cute, english cockers are not performance dogs in the normal sense. They are quite happy to be couch potatoes and none of the ones I have met have a ton of drive - they are lovely sweet dogs, but they would be on the opposite ends of the Mal spectrum. They are definitely reliable off leash, get along great with everyone and everything - but working them isn't always a top priority with most breeders, so they aren't really looking for those temperaments. I know a few people doing some obedience and more doing agility, but they are still few and far between.

I know quite a few nice brittanys in the obedience world - some are a little crazy, but all work like little fiends and are great dogs to be around.

Another breed to consider would be a welsh springer, or a regular springer. ESS's can be a little more dominant, but welshies are much more laid back.

a Golden would be larger than your size requirement, wouldnt it? youd have an easy time finding a golden to fit your requirements .

i would also second the toller, or a PWD. I don't consider them nearly as dominant or pushy as some other dogs, and if thats the breed you want, why wait?

She looks more like the first one.
How long does it take them to grow in their full coat. I'm not positive, but I think this dog is 2 or 3.

That's why I would have been going through a rescue if I had decided on a Mal.

Never even thought about them, thanks!

Not sure, the only well bred golden I've ever met was much smaller than all of the BYB goldens I usually see. Weight isn't the biggest factor for me. My main concern is that I get a dog that is at least light enough for me to lift and carry it if it got hurt.

That's true. I would definitally have to spend a lot more time with the breeds if I decided on one of them, just to be sure. I've only met 2 or 3 of each.

What do you guys think of a standard poodle? Would they fit in my requirements?

Poodles sound good, I'd try to find a breeder that does a lot of activities instead of a show only breeder of course. I've actually seen one that breeds primarily for a good retrieving instinct, they way poodles are supposed to be!

This is pretty well true. I guess my point was that if there is any particular breed she wants, but isn't considering because of the general temperament of the breed being too much dog, she could always look into adult rescues and see if there is an individual dog that is out of standard temperament wise, and in such a way that they would fit together.

Years. Trey was really fluffy by the time he was 2. That second picture of Nik and Trey is when they are about two years old. But I didn't realize how much their coats have grown since then. Trey's coat is a lot longer now and a lot darker since we got him at a year. His coat probably wasn't the length it is now until he was 4+.

Honestly although Nik's coat is shorter its more of a PITA than Trey's. Trey's is long but a lot harsher. It's coarse and not as soft. Nik's coat is shorter and thicker and sheds all the time. trey just sheds a couple times a year. Nik's is finer hair and she mats a lot more often.

I totally understand if you don't want a BC... BUT they do look VERY cute with Corgis, yanno. ; D

PLUS, I honestly don't think the Border Collies at Flyball should be considered a "norm" for the breed, by any means. Gonzo, when we started Flyball when he was 1 1/2, was basically the dog you're describing. He would lay there, crouching, staring psychotically at the other dogs running around him, and literally trembling with excitement. He had/has never done this in any other setting, just Flyball! It is an incredibly intense sport, and a LOT of stimulus for a young, beginner, dog of any breed. There were Aussies in my class that would spin in circles and yap their heads off, and Brittanies that would zoom around, completely ignoring their owners. Flyball is loud, crazy, and incredibly fast-paced; it can make any dog, especially a high energy/high drive dog, go NUTS until they're accustomed to it and well trained.

If you want to get a good idea of the breed, go to a herding trial or a seminar where BCs are being worked on livestock. You will see calm (for the most part), collected, controlled Border Collies... rather than those that are intentionally worked up into a frenzy at Flyball tournaments. And watching BCs work, in person, is really magical. : )

Well, since how it looks with the corgis is the most important factor, I guess I'll have to get one

My mom's boyfriend has a BC who herds his sheep, maybe I'll see if I can meet her

I agree about the Malinois, honestly... All the ones I've met have as much drive as my BCs, with the added bonus of a stronger instinct to protect and the tendency to put their mouth on *everything*. They're a loooot of dog.

Erica is so very right about flyball. Even my well-behaved Dakota turns into a complete psycho spaz around flyball, even if he's not competing or practicing. And I also agree with her about the sheepdog trials or clinics - great place to meet well-bred border collies. Sheepdogs in USBCHA trials are usually not trained up the wazoo (don't ask me what a wazoo is or how you can train one) so what you see is pretty much what you get.

Also, IMO, if you're looking at Aussies... why not look at Porties?

I was under the impression that Aussies were softer and less independent that PWD's?
And I have looked at (more like obssessed over) PWDs, to the point that I had already talked to breeders, settled on one who told me to let her know when I was ready for a puppy, and then kinda called it all off when I found out I wouldn't be able to get another dog for a few years.

I kinda figured, guess it was just wishful thinking on my part.

Am I the only one with a relaxed flyball dog?
She gets really excited when we actually get on the lane, but as soon as we walk of she calms right down...