German Shepherd through the years

I don't mind the early dogs. Most of the before the 80s looked fine to me but I'm no expert. The recent ones just have me scared for the future of those lines.

This is overstated, but I am such a fan of Bodo Lierburg.

*grumblegrumble* I swear your Mals all have German Shepherd in them or something...

well, always knew I loved the way your dogs look!

Not sure if this is the same dog I was thinking of, but you should have seen that one puppy Maliraptor brought home around a year back. Stocky, hunky headed, sable thing, I swore up and down that dog was part German Shepherd!

Love Knox!! Seriously gorgeous guy. Angle of the camera makes it look a bit like he is all legs and a big head, but he's also a still a puppy with plenty of time to fill out. Love that dog.

What has changed about the hips themselves that is visible?

Well, Knox still has a big head lol, but he's filling out nicely. The ground is also sloped in that picture, I'm going to have to get some better ones soon.

That dog has to be part GSD. Oh my God.

I suppose if you're looking at the earlier dogs compared to show lines there is a big difference. That seems to be all people ever want to look at when talking about GSDs. The modern show lines (German or American) and how extreme they are and how "the breed is now ruined". It really does depend on where you're looking though. Photos showing those early dogs into modern working lines, you wouldn't see such a big difference.

FWIW in the very early pictures, those dogs were still kinda a work in progress...part of a vision but not quite there yet.

No leg pulling. That is a Malinois. FCI papered and DNAed.

Mom-



And dad-



That is her. She is Frankie's littermate. See Frankie posts to see the difference in type.

Yeah, it's pretty fascinating the difference the camera angle and height can make, and also the surface the dog is standing on and the way the dog is stacked. I have so many shots of Trent stacked but only three or four (of hundreds) that I like as a representative of his structure and overall build.


Crazy!! :yikes:

Yeah, the reason why I doubted it was the same dog I was thinking of is because I JUST saw Frankie photos/videos and thought "no way this is FrankenPuppy's littermate...

Their sire is STUNNING. Momma is gorgeous, too, love those solid Mals!

That is pretty awesome. I've never seen a mal sabled like that, or her sire, but I could see how those two coats could produce that. Gorgeous dog for sure.

my friends got a couple and one is a very black sable especially in summer and his other bitch looks just like my female GSD and they bite the same. Showlines have changed tremendously, working lines ,not a lot.

Wow, I actually wasn't flamed for saying I'd rather have a BYB GSD than an American show line GSD.
Of course BYB GSDs as a broad brush stroke don't follow any standard and they may be in worse health, but in general, I find the less extreme look much more pleasing to the eye and IME healthier.
The AKC needs to adjust their stack just a bit or something- it makes them look that much worse.
My opinion is that just because a dog fits the standard to a "T" doesn't mean it's not poorly bred.

I LOVE Knox. He's gorgeous now and as an adult he's going to be a jaw-dropper. <3

IMO There's really nothing wrong with the GSDCA (AKC) GSD standard. Do the dogs winning fit it to a T? Decide for yourself:

http://www.gsdca.org/Noframes/standard/IllStan1.htm

Oh, wow. Let me rephrase what I said. "Just because a dog gains it's Ch. doesn't mean it's not poorly bred."

How can those dogs who look like they can't even walk be winning when the standard calls for a non-extreme body like that?

Thank you. She's a bit of an anomaly, really. Is she a throwback or is there a GSD lurking in the woodpile? As long as she works well and has good health, my requirements are met either way.

Exactly. As usual, it comes down to individual breeder's interpretation of the standard.

I showed and bred American GSDs years ago. And while I thought at the time the dogs I finished were balanced and moderate, looking back, I'm not so sure. And I LOST a lot because my dogs did not have the necessary angulation in the rear to win, even in the all breed ring.

Here is my dog stacked three point


Here is an Irish Setter stacked four square


Many breeds that are stacked four square still have excessive rear, either as a by product or a direct goal of breeding. Not sure if changing the way a dog is stacked in the conformation ring will change that. Additionally, it is not just the AKC. The UKC, CKC, KC, and SV all require the German Shepherd be stacked the same. Different fads between the European and American showlines? Yes, definitely, but the dogs are still stacked three point.

Trent looks completely normal and gorgeous. He just look like he's stacked three point, whereas GSDs with such sloped rears that are stacked that way just look so much worse. I don't truly expect that people will change that tradition, it was just a bit of a musing of mine, since the three point stack exaggerates the already over-sloped hips.

Knox was stacked four point (square whatever) and you can still see his rear is not so extreme. I fully expect him to OFA good or excellent in August as well.

Im going to get a show lead tomorrow and take some better pictures of him stacked properly as well just to show the rear angulation difference.

That picture of him is also a few months old. Maybe two and a half I think.

Ok, here is my old Competition dog. 100% European working line GSD. Not as square a hind end as many would like...



Here is his son-



Here is my husband's first SchH3 GSD-



Again, all working lines.

*drools*

All of them are beautiful! (And sure the hips of the first 2 dogs are sloped but not ANYTHING like Am. show lines.)

Oh, absolutely. It's also for that reason that a lot of people focus on how much rear the German Shepherds in the show ring have, but NEVER seem to realize that other breeds (such as Irish Setters) have the same extremes. It's just not as accentuated as much as it is for Shepherds when they are stacked.

On that note, the hips aren't actually sloped Common misconception/misuse of terminology - the hips themselves are, well, just hips! The incline is in the topline relative to the ground, I don't think the hips themselves can be sloped.

Funnily enough, Trent does not stack four square (not certain of the correct terminology either, lmao) very comfortably. Both he, Knox, and the GSDs Maliraptor posted have sufficient rear. Trent is capable of being stretched out more than he is in the picture above, but I like Knox and Maliraptor's dogs better, to be honest.

I had a shot of Trent standing four square before, but that's a year and a half old at least and not a very good one at that.


This is Xandra's Roman's sire, Axel, isn't he?

Love all your dogs. Honestly, the perfect amount of rear for me, I don't like dogs that are lacking in rear angulation, either.

This is a good point - excessive rears are a current fad in many breeds, not just GSDs. A lot of show setters have similar rears to show GSDs - loose ligaments and all. No one seems to notice as much on them though.

Speaking of UKC - they just modified the GSD breed standard. Here's the latest version:

http://www.ukcdogs.com/WebSite.nsf/Breeds/GermanShepherdDogRevisedMay12012