Breed Suggestions for child's obedience dog

Aimee, you know I'm basically a one-breed person. But I've developed a healthy respect for Bostons. The ones I've met that aren't total fruit loops are a lot of fun.

Oh dear. Don't you have at least one big dog, too? That says you shouldn't have Paps with big dogs.

I don't know a lot of 4H kids who care for the dogs exclusively. Most of them are, as Aleron said, family dogs. This would also be several years down the road. A 10yo is not a small child.

I probably shouldn't mention that my friend's 10yo is making her 4H debut this year with their 4 lbs Yorkie that has miraculously survived living with three children and four large dogs. It's so sad to see such a loved little dog proudly trained by a sweet kid.

I do have a large dog. Who crates and rotates with the papillons and in the 3 + years I've had her has never visited with one except through the crate door. What's your point where it concerns my dogs?

I also live with two very young children who aren't allowed to play with or handle my dogs. Again, what's your point where it concerns my dogs?

I assumed you would go to a good breeder, I was just saying that if you went the ACD route it might be a good idea to get an adult who you could really evaluate with children. Like I said, the ones I have worked with really weren't kid-friendly (this is more to do with typical kids - obviously there are some that are very dog savvy that would be a better fit).

I don't think I implied anywhere that I thought you were incompetent or ignorant, if it came across that way I apologize. You asked for breed suggestions so I gave my thoughts on what breeds I thought may be good and which ones I thought may be best to avoid. I also have successfully obtained, trained and handled dogs - including an ACD foster who had a LOT of issues. In addition, I believe I was quite a dog-savvy 10 year old. Heck, I think I was only 11 or 12 when I first joined this forum... And despite having a lot of knowledge, I still think an ACD would have been too much for me. Anyway like I said, I think an ACD is a lot of dog for a young kid and that there are breeds out there that would make a much better 'first dog' so to speak. In no way was I trying to be condescending, just honest.


I agree with you on the bolded point. I knew a lot for an 11 year old about dogs. I started researching to get my first dog around that age and 4 years later got Spy I think I knew a lot more back then than the average joe did. Based on the ACDs I have worked with though, I would still be cautious giving one to a child as a first dog (even if the parents were going to oversee the handling). I am not saying that no kid could handle one because I know that isn't the case, like you said with Darien, but I think it would certainly take a very involved, dog savvy family and a child who takes a special interest and is really into dogs.

This was what I was getting at with my points about the ACD and the other breed I suggested. You wrote it much better than I did

You are posting information that says that Papillons shouldn't be in homes with small children or large dogs. What if the crate door broke? I've heard of more crating hardware failures than children seriously injuring the family dog.

You are obviously an exception. Can there be no others?

Not all children are going to go Godzilla stomping on all of the toy breed residents of Tokyo, and it's ridiculous and insulting to keep insisting that they will.

Like how Dachshunds, Beagles, and Shibas are great obedience dogs?

Ok you know what... this is STUPID. You're right, I'm wrong and I never hope you find out otherwise. Cheers and feel comforted by your own sense of superiority on the matter.

I wish I could meet your dogs, your stories about Joey always bring a smile to my face. Out of the hundreds of Bostons I've met, I can think about three that didn't make me go WTF?

It also doesn't help that my neighbors across the street have two that love to jump and scream on their front door and will come charging out of their house any given chance and into my yard to harass Sawyer. Sawyer can't stand Bostons either--too many have just randomly come flying out of nowhere to latch on to him.

Bull breeds always gotta show those fuzzybutts who's boss.

Thanks! They crack me up everyday. I think a lot of boston owners suffer from the "cute little doggie owner" syndrome. Their dogs are little and cute so they can't do any wrong. They can't hurt anyone...they're too little! Which is definitely not the case. My two are far from perfect, but I understand their limitations and don't put them in situations they cannot handle.

I have to say I know many a pap that lives with larger dogs. Its a good thing that no one told them that they were too fragile.

I get that people want to be careful with their breed. But I do see paps with kids, I do see paps living in homes full of BC and other larger dogs. These dogs live long full active lives.

I only mentioned the ACD because I have seen quite a few that are doing well with kids. Maybe its a regional thing.. the ones here are quite a bit smaller than BCs and while very drivey aren't all horribly edgy dogs (at least the confo and combo lines) I have known quite a few farms that have them and they are good with kids... even the badly bred ones. But then again maybe I just know a lot of dog smart people.

(that comic, which is one of my fave, doesn't make much sense if you are leaving the argument.. only if you are staying)

-- it's not just you. ACDs are popular family dogs around here, and are handled by kids all the time. Most of them are working (to one degree or another) farm dogs as well, but not all.

When I was growing up here, ACDs were very popular. When I was in 4H, a good half of the dogs entered were ACDs. They aren't nearly as popular now, but you still see them.

Smooth coat BC.

The BC we had when I was growing up let me do anything with him despite me (as a small child) knowing jack about training and him being an explosively drivey dog.

And my parent's current dog Will was actually a kid's 4H project as an adolescent. He adores kids and is perfect with them. We have only ever had rough coat BC's. I bet that kid that had Will was pretty upset when its parent's sold him to a guy who had intentions of trialing him.... which he never did, was just a kennel dog until my parent's bought him through a broker. He is just sweet as pie and low key personality-wise while still having good focus and drive. He's a great ranch dog. He actually was somewhat helpful yesterday when we wormed calves, which is amazing given how my stepdad is not the best handler around and Will was a finished dog when we bought him and smart enough to know my stepdad wasn't that experienced with trained herding dogs, lol.

THe 4H kids in this area actually did cow herding demos before the rodeo this last summer. They were obviously just green kids and dogs, but it was awesome that they got to do that! Everyone here has BC's, lol.

Not a wheaten terrier. LOL That was my childhood dog, despite being raised with gsp and apbt, my dad said I could either have a wheaten or an airedale. Said Wheaten is still kickin' it but is now my dads dog. Terrible, no-good, very bad obedience dog. Sweet as pie though and the most tolerant dog I have ever met, to this day.

The girl who got Justy from my last litter has a Papillon. A Papillon who lives with a Border Collie, Golden Retriever, and a Leonberger .... all of which are able to play and socialize all day. I am happy to report the little one is alive and well.

As for the original topic, I am one who thinks any breed can make a good dog for someone. I know alot of people who say Border Collies are not a good first dog ... but many of my puppies have gone to homes where they are the family first dog. At some events I go to here, there are children handling everything from a Chihuahua to a Great Dane. I just think the family / couple / person just needs to know the type of dog they are getting into and what traits may be common to that dog. They shouldn't go into it thinking a working Border Collie will be a dog that just wants to be in the house sleeping all the time, for example.

My Competitive OB instructors have Papillions! AND.....LoLa the pit bull PLAYS with them...yes, that's right, they let their very fragile dogs play with a bully breed, so far, there have been no injuries....well other than a puncture in LoLas ear cause she was being a brat!

I think sometimes that the attitude of some little dog people is what keeps me from owning one. Treat it like a DOG.

I still vote for Bostons!!!!

What about a Bouvier or a rescued Bouvier. I grew up with Bouves and they were all great, awesome nanny/kids dogs. They all adored kids and were always gentle with my brother and I even though they were like twice our size.

My parents Bouve Emme goes bonkers for kids. And Bouves seem to want to really, really please their owners. They live for it. Although I probably would suggest going with a Show breeder who does obed than a working line as I know the working lines are more along the line of ACDs. They are a cattle dog after all

Might want to re-read the criteria...

You know you can't get away from APBTs/AmStaffs forever, right Aimee? Sooner or later, you're gonna get the itch. Your sickness may be in remission right now, but you will have a flare-up. *mega evil cackle*