A Shiba For Newbies??

Ferdundra

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#1
Hi All,

My wife and I are looking into getting a dog. We have wanted one for some time but only recently feel we're ready to give one the attention it deserves. We own a small to medium home (1700ish sq.ft) with a fenced yard of average size.

We used to have a friend who owned a Shiba Inu and we thought it was a great dog. We have started looking into getting one ourselves but have some reservations. I have read that Shibas are sometimes very unfriendly and agressive to strangers/other dogs, and don't do well with newborns (we plan to have children within the lifespan of the dog but don't have any currently).

However we love some other aspects of Shibas, such as their look, cleanliness, tendency not to bark, etc.

My question is, having not owned a dog before (but being prepared to devote time to crate training, obedience classes etc), is a Shiba an appropriate choice for us, or should we go with a "safer" breed as has been suggested to us such as Lab/golden retreiver?

Thanks for your help!
 

anna84

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i think you should go with the breed that fits your lifestyle best. Look into other breeds other than just shibas and labs. do either of you have any experience with dogs? what qualities are you looking for in terms of how friendly with strangers, trainability, grooming, and exercise
 

Ferdundra

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anna84 said:
i think you should go with the breed that fits your lifestyle best. Look into other breeds other than just shibas and labs. do either of you have any experience with dogs? what qualities are you looking for in terms of how friendly with strangers, trainability, grooming, and exercise
Thanks for your reply. We both have experience being around the dogs of friends and relatives but no, we do not currently have experience raising one ourselves, hence part of my question.

I have looked at many dogs, and labs, goldens, shelties are just some that have generally risen to the top based on our lifestyle.

As for other qualities, high trainability is definitely prefered, and we do plan on attending obedience/puppy classes with any dog regardless of breed. Exercise is not a problem, we do have a yard and we are both quite active and would be happy to have a dog that jogs with us. As far as grooming is concerned we would be ideally looking for an average to low maintenance dog in that department.
 

anna84

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see its the high trainability thing thats going to make me wonder if a shibas the best fit. its entirely possible to train them but they aren't as bigon pleasing their owners as some other breeds. this quiz is posted a lot because it's actually pretty good http://www.k9country.com/perl/dogBreed.pl for a starting point, let us know what comes up for you =)
 

mojozen

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#5
Shibas aren't known for high trainability. There were bred to be independant thinkers to make decisions on their own while hunting. They are CUTE little dogs, but they would be one of the last breeds I'd recommend to people who've never had dogs in their lives. (included on that list are pit bulls, any protection dog breed, a lot of the spitz breeds and quite a few of the terriers).

Anyway, somethings to keep in mind (that i got off of a rescue site)

*In their eyes, Shibas can take on the world no matter how big the foe or the task. They are dominant with other dogs and do not usually get along well with other "bossy" dogs of the same sex. Many Shibas will, however, get along great with another dog or cat that agrees the Shiba is boss.

*Shibas can be runners. The Shiba Inu is a natural hunter. Given a chance, Shibas will take off in search of game. It is advisable to never trust your Shiba off-lead unless in a fenced yard.

*The Shiba's least favorite word is "come." They will usually take your number and get back to you, when called.

*Shibas have a mind of their own. While it is possible to obedience train a Shiba, it is a challenge. Tell him to sit and he sits . . . sometimes. If there is something in it for him, and it is convenient at the time.

*Shibas always like to be in charge; their favorite word is "mine." Although not "barky" dogs, they do yodel and scream anytime they feel they are being violated, such as nail trimming, bathing, and leash training.

*Shibas are a double-coated breed, which means they drop their *entire* undercoat once or twice a year.
 

tempura tantrum

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#6
Hey there- hopefully I can help you out with some of your concerns. I've been in Shibas for about 10 years, and currently own one neutered pet-quality dog, and one intact show quality bitch.

As a general rule, I'm not too quick to reccommend Shibas as a first time dog for anyone. That being said, my first dog was a Shiba, LOL. I studied several breeds over a time period of a few years, and by the end, was convinced a Shiba was for me. I talked to several breeders, got a feel for temperaments, and made the plunge. They are by no means an *easy* dog, but if you're willing to devote the time, you can make it work. I did, and the result is two wonderful companions I couldn't imagine being without.

Now, on to your concerns:

Shibas, as a general rule, are a dog-aggressive breed. While I've met a few that get along famously with every other dog they meet, most do not, and you shouldn't expect them to. Mine *tolerate* other dogs (they know what kind of behavior is expected of them), but they will never be the type to play happily for hours on end with other people's animals. In short, if your looking for a dog that you can enjoy taking to the dog park, think again about Shibas.

In terms of human aggression- without a doubt, steer clear of ANY breeder who tells you that this is a human-aggressive breed. That is a load of BS, and such behavior shouldn't be tolerated for a second. Shibas bond very closely to their family, and could pretty much give a flying rip about anyone outside of it, but you should never see a Shiba display outright aggression towards a human (unless given due cause). Their attitude is a sort of "does God swat flies?" mentality.

Iffy temperaments *have* been an issue in this breed in the past, but as a whole, I believe they are improving. Choosing a great breeder is your greatest insurance for success in this department. If you've found a couple breeders you're interested in, you are most welcome to PM me, and I might be able to help you out.

When it comes to Shibas and newborns/young children:
My mom had a baby around the same time that we got our first Shiba, and we had absolutely no problems. My little brother and Tai get along famously. People often ask "are Shibas good with kids?" My reply is an ecstatic "YES! IF the kids are good with Shibas." Both children and pets can be taught respect for one another. Most people wouldn't tolerate getting poked in the eye, slapped, etc. yet we expect our dogs to be angels in the exact same situations. The key is to remember that dogs are *animals* not little people in furry coats. They do not operate under our social mores, and expecting them to does both you AND your dog a disservice. Never leave the child unsupervised with a dog (this goes for ANY breed- even Goldens and Labs), and you should be fine. We've yet to have an incident in our family. As a whole, Shibas don't make great "kids dogs," because they tend to be more aloof, but they make wonderful "family dogs."

Obedience classes are a must, if you want a dog you can live with. That being said- shop carefully for your obedience class. Most Shibas don't take kindly to "traditional" corrective forms of obedience training. In other words, throw the The Koehler method of dog training out the window. If you teach primarily with corrections, your Shiba will shut down and lose all respect for you. They do *far* better with positive reinforcement (operant conditioning) techniques. Feel free to visit the training forum and look for posts by Doberluv and IliamnasQuest, who both do an excellent job of explaining why positive reinforcement is a good choice for Shibas.

I hear a LOT of people say that Shibas are "stupid" or "hard to train." Nothing could be further from the truth. This is an extremely intelligent (bordering on cunning) breed. You will not be able to train a Shiba like you would a Golden. Understanding the breed's history will help you realize why this is true. This ancient breed has been cultivated for centuries to track and hunt wild boar and bear in Japan, while the Matagi (hunter), followed at a distance. Therefore, it was never in the dog's best interest to wait for instructions from a human not in the thick of the battle. Hesitation while listening for directions = a good way to get gored or killed. That being said, your Shiba will want a *very* good reason as to why it should follow *your* directions! ;) It all comes back down to positive and *fun* training techniques. (Shibas LOVE agility). One other thing to keep in mind- this independent streak makes the majority of Shibas TERRIBLE off-lead dogs. If you want a reliable off-lead dog, drop the Shiba from your list immediately. I've met two in my life that I found were decent at best.

Exercise is a definite must for these guys- they are NOT lap dogs. Any athletic pursuit you are interested in- they will be too. (Unless it's swimming, in which case they will happily stare at you from the sidelines, wondering what on Earth would possess someone to go into cold water VOLUNTARILY).

Grooming is pretty low-key with Shibas. If it wasn't for the fact that I show my dogs, I could easily get away with bathing them 4 times a year. They're incredibly fastidious, hate to be dirty, and never have that "doggy smell" that people complain about. They DO blow coat twice a year though- and then the house will be FILLED with fluffy puffs of hair. The vacuum will become your best friend at this time, LOL. A bath and comb out will shorten this process though.

Please excuse the length of this post- as you can probably tell by now, I am absolutely in LOVE with this breed! Don't hesitate to ask more questions- I'm only too happy to help a prospective new Shiba slave...err...."owner."
 

tempura tantrum

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#7
I'll just add one more quick thing in regards to trainability (hard to shut me up when it's about my heart-breed, LOL)

These dogs are *highly* trainable- but it's *biddability* that is the main issue. They will not happily repeat the same exercise over and over again as a Golden or a Lab would. They get bored very quickly with repetition, so the key is to make training sessions fast-paced, fun, and short.

Both my dog and bitch picked up new behaviors with lightening speed. It does not take Shibas a long time to learn anything. Tai knows how to sit, stay, come, lie down, high five, dance, "find it," shake, crawl, jump, and "swing" (finish an exercise by walking behind me and sitting at my left side). Kimi can fetch, find her ball on command, find family members, jump upon any surface I tap, pounce upon an object on command, stand for examination, "look pretty," and "back that thing up" (what I tell her when I need her to adjust her feet in the show ring). Both are proficient agility dogs. I trained Tai in agility class, and Kimi by myself. With Kimi, she mastered new behaviors in a manner of minutes, simply by watching Tai go first. This includes doing a see-saw (teeter totter), and jumping through a suspended tire.

The point is they're WICKED smart, but this brilliance also makes them question WHY they should be doing behavior X. When you say "sit," a Golden says "Yes!" A Shiba says "why?" This was something that drew me to the breed, I liked the challenge. If you think it's more likely to annoy you, then I would stick to another, more biddable breed.
 

bubbatd

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#8
Being a great dog lover, there were many breeds I would have been drawn to, but having dogs before children , I wanted to be more safe than sorry. It would have broken my heart to have to give up a family pet for the sake of babies. Thus, Goldens all the way .
 

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