Am I the only one who thinks this is cool?

Well. . . ?

  • I would flame you if you got one. Actually, I'm flaming you in the comments right now.

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Oko

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#41
Also the way your post was worded bugs me, there is blue and red Merle and I'm not sure what black Merle is supposed to be referring to.
Maybe lilac merle or whatever you call genetically blue merle? Since blue merle is technically from black, IIRC.
 

frostfell

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#42
Maybe lilac merle or whatever you call genetically blue merle? Since blue merle is technically from black, IIRC.
*shakes head* iv seen blue merle that are blue-nose, blue patches, light background. black merle is black patches with light grey/blue background. red/chocolate merle is self explanatory. i dont like to call what aussies come in "blue merle" because its really not. its black. any color can come in merle, except maybe?, ee yellow. i had, at one point, a blue seal brindle merle. his patches were blue brindle, and his background was orange/tan brindle. the seal was just a guess, but he wasnt "just" blue brindle, he had something else going on. i didnt get any pictures of his weird background and brindling, because my camera was crappy and every picture didnt SHOW what i could see with my own eyeballs ><

blue merle


black merle
 

Saeleofu

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#44
So is merle like overo in horses?
Sort of, but while overo is literally lethal in the case of homozygosity, merle is not truly lethal - the homozygous animals do not die of being double merle, but they are prone to having some serious issues, particularly with hearing and vision (and eye development/formation).
 

frostfell

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#45
So is merle like overo in horses?
im not certain. in a couple aspects it is, 2 copies of the gene is not quite as lethal as it is in overos (which causes abortions and stillbirths right?). homozygous merles are usually just deaf or blind, small or malformed eyes, underdeveloped immune systems, etc. wyndlair avalanche is a big example of this, hes a quite famous rough collie sire who is a double merle and as far as i can tell, he doesnt HAVE eyes
 

Upendi&Mina

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#46
*shakes head* iv seen blue merle that are blue-nose, blue patches, light background. black merle is black patches with light grey/blue background. red/chocolate merle is self explanatory. i dont like to call what aussies come in "blue merle" because its really not. its black. any color can come in merle, except maybe?, ee yellow. i had, at one point, a blue seal brindle merle. his patches were blue brindle, and his background was orange/tan brindle. the seal was just a guess, but he wasnt "just" blue brindle, he had something else going on. i didnt get any pictures of his weird background and brindling, because my camera was crappy and every picture didnt SHOW what i could see with my own eyeballs ><

blue merle


black merle
Yes but since blue dogs are genetically black dogs with the MLPH gene causing the black to be dilute, blue Merle is blue Merle, is blue Merle.
http://www.ashgi.org/color/dilute_aussies.htm

That page shows a pretty good example of a dilute blue Merle Aussie.
 

frostfell

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#48
so you call black dogs "blue"? if its black pigmented, black nose and eyerims, black patches, its not a blue dog. its DD or Dd. blue is dd. a blue merle would be Mmdd. if its got black pigment why would you call it blue?
 
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#49
I know in danes merle (grey with black splotches and black nose etc) is not considered the same as blue merle....(grey with darker grey splotches and blue leather)?
 

Upendi&Mina

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#50
so you call black dogs "blue"? if its black pigmented, black nose and eyerims, black patches, its not a blue dog. its DD or Dd. blue is dd. a blue merle would be Mmdd. if its got black pigment why would you call it blue?
The merling gene randomly dilutes a varying amount of the black to blue. Since the merling itself is blue I would say its logical to call them a blue Merle, given that the black patches are not the merling. ;)

In other words there is no black merle by the very basis of how the merling gene works. The merling will ALWAYS be a dilute color.
 
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Sit Stay

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#51
I just want to clarify for perhaps non-horsey people reading this thread - the lethal gene in horses being talked about is linked to FRAME overo, specifically. Not other common overo patterns like splash or sabino. It is known as Overo Lethal White syndrome (OLWS) or Lethal White Overo (LWO), which isn't an entirely accurate name because it is the frame overo gene that is lethal.

(eta: it is lethal due to an abnormal and dysfunctioning colon, IIRC. There is no treatment or cure that I have heard of - foals must be PTS or die naturally. They appear healthy and normal otherwise. Interestingly, Paint breeders report a far fewer percentage of lethal white foals than the 25% it "should" be when breeding frame to frame. More like 4-5%, I've read in some cases.)
 
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#52
so you call black dogs "blue"? if its black pigmented, black nose and eyerims, black patches, its not a blue dog. its DD or Dd. blue is dd. a blue merle would be Mmdd. if its got black pigment why would you call it blue?
It's just what people call it. Just like red merles are technically liver.

http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/merle.html
 
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#55
Yea, that's what I said? People just call it blue, although genetically the dogs are black. They're really ALL black merles, people just don't call it that.
 

Laurelin

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#57
I know in danes merle (grey with black splotches and black nose etc) is not considered the same as blue merle....(grey with darker grey splotches and blue leather)?
Slate merle is usually the term for a blue (dilute) merle. So the black in the coat is diluted to blue and then merled. 'Blue merle' is a dog who is black and not dilute and merle. A blue merle will have a black nose and a slate merle will have a blue nose <--- easiest way to tell.

Lilac/isabella is red/chocolate/liver that has been diluted. And that can be merled as well.

Yes, why can't we all use the same terms?
 

Laurelin

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#58

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