The Jax Instinct Test Video

I'm glad that you had a good time, even though that looks like a stressful situation for everyone involved :yikes:

Lizmo did a great job of explaining how out of control the situation was. I definitely wouldn't recommend that lady to anyone.

Evidently, there are not a lot of choices for this type of training/experience in my area. It was never about the training, just about a single experience anyway. HIC not HCT.

I asked both the BC/Aussie rescue where I got Jax and a Rally trainer CD, ASCA-CD, RAE, CGC, TDI, TDIA, AATD, FMD, AKC-HIC, AHBA-HCT, WD-SS, WD-WTXX, TT. Both are CGC, TDI evaluators and one is IACP certified and BOTH suggested this lady. They both told me she was an AKC herding judge as well, so I went with their recommendations.

Maybe it's the only game around in a reasonable proximity? Don't know...but it appeared to be the case to me and who am I to question their recommendations? I know nada about anything.

lol, somehow you guys have me on trial here. Jax had fun, my son and I had fun and we got to spend a few minutes in the country. My son and I watched the unedited version yesterday with sound and I asked him next time not to take so much video of the sheep. He said once again, he'd never seen one. We need to get out to the country more.

I see now that it should or could have been handled differently, but it wasn't. It was what it was..."Dog chases Sheep".

(No animals were hurt in making this video) Maybe that should be my new Avatar. I just hope this is not my 15 minutes of fame.

JoeLacy, I don't think ANYONE in the thread was judging you or your dog. What I get out of the thread is the TRAINER didn't meet up to what they should have.

I really don't think anyone wants you to feel attacked or judged. They just wanted to point out (for you and others who don't know) this person has flaws that they don't find desirable in a trainer.

Try not to take it personal, I TRULY don't think it was directed at you or Jax

Thanks Cooper, I won't take it personal.

I completely agree.

I only replied to this thread because I don't want people to come on here and think this is what herding is supposed to be like.

I never would've started herding lessons if this is how they were ran. lol.

whoa, i was stressed watching it!

The lady sent me some still photos today.

I think I like this one the best.

Well, AKC people will recommend AKC people. Just for furture reference.

You're on the BC Boards, why didn't you ask there? You make it sound as if there was no other place to take your dog. Lots of people that work dogs are in Texas.

I've tried to tell you that I'm glad you had fun, and I'm not attacking you or your dog (whom I know nothing about). But you don't seem to get it. You don't seem to get why this 'evaluation' was such a mess, either.

Anyways, I think I need the banging head smiley, please?

That is a VERY nice still shot JoeLacy.......it was nice of her to send it to you

Liz, she SAID she sees now.........I am sure the videos you posted helped her see, why the further need to pound?

Because he's still saying that we are attcking him....? And he's making it sound as if he had no other choice. He's on the BC Boards. They are very well known for putting people in touch with trainers in there area.

And I think it's a 'him', lol.

Lizmo? Did you ever see the movie Face off with John Travolta and Nic Cage? There is a line in it that made me think of you just now. "Either kill yourself or let it go."

I'm thinking of taking this video down and ask the mod for a delete on this thread. One thing is for sure, I'll be very careful the next thing I post on here as not to be the brunt of such pompous wrath. My suggestion to "YOU" is LET IT GO...

No, I can't say I have.

I'm sorry you think I'm attacking you. It was never my intention, I just ask questions that you haven't answered.

I hope you you might change your mind about taking Jax back to sheep, it's a great thing to get involved in with your dog.

Joe, you seem awfully defensive for somebody who was just doing it for no other reason than to have fun, and for somebody who is pretty intent on never trying it again... I'm not sure I understand the defensiveness. It takes TWO people to continue a discussion and TWO people to let it go and move on. Every time YOU post in this thread asking to have it "let go" you are just keeping it alive.
This board is full of people who speak their minds and we are not soft-handed "nicey-nice" folks who will only smile politely and nod in the face of something we find upsetting. Every time you post you are opening yourself up to comments and, yes, criticism. If it upsets you... just walk away. You do not have to return to your thread and keep reading it, and you don't have to continue responding. It's the internet - walking away is VERY easy, moreso than it is in real life. I've walked away from threads and arguments MANY times on this board and I cannot tell you how much easier it makes my life to just accept that at times, the best thing to do is just wash my hands of the discussion and go away. I have little doubt that after doing so people have continued to comment or snark at me, but I don't have to read it. And I don't... because I have walked away.
Instead of telling everybody else to let it go... do so yourself first.

Also, if you are so intent on having people let it go, might I suggest not insulting people by calling them "pompous..?"

I know someone around here that might know a better trainer. She's on the bc boards and trials in TX. I could get you her user name so you could PM her. There's also a stockdog association here too that might know some people if you're interested in doing more.

No one's trying to be mean or attack, just trying to inform. I'm sorry you see it that way though.

I don't see where anyone is attacking Joe either. People who are experienced in the activity posted their opinions on how the training was being done. If you don't know, and no one points it out to you, how can you learn? So what if she was recommended by people who have dogs that have an alphabet behind their names- if they aren't experienced herders then they won't know either, they are just throwing business over to a colleague, just as I'm sure they get clients referred to them by the herding person.

I didn't get to see the video unfortunately, it's made private now, which is too bad. I have a friend who has 2 BC's that herd on his farm and he seems to know what he's doing and I wanted to show the video to him for his opinion as well.

You know, all I wanted to do with my dogs are give him a wide variety of experiences. I got his CGC because I needed to be able to control him with at least some certainty as we did new things. This herding thing was a one shot deal when I went into it and it was indeed fun. Is this something I want to pursue? I doubt it.

The next thing planned is a long hike in the mountains. We have not done that yet. Would we do that often? I doubt it.

The herding test was not unlike all the things I do with my dogs. We walk city streets, and mean downtown downtown not in neighborhoods. We go to arts and crafts fairs, outdoor rock concerts, we visit friends and family together, we do many varied things and don't focus on just one.

To me it's not about the destination, but the journey and have a well rounded dog in a variety of situations. Having ribbons and titles are not important to me, I understand they are to some people and I support that, but it's much more important to me, just to be with my dogs. If it's herding or us just taking a nap at home, it's all just as good to me.

Fact is, we all have lives outside our dogs and more often that not, those take priority out of necessity. The time and monetary restraints do play a role.

I have to be a realist here. I'm a city guy and have city dogs. The things we do together can be just as rewarding to all of us in the city as those out in the country. I'm just trying to set reasonable expectations for myself as their owners.

I like to go to the theater when I'm in NYC. I also like to go to Central park for a Picnic and visit the museums. I love to eat a NYC hot dog on the city streets and equally as well fine dining at the Waldorf. For me, life is about experiencing many different things and that's what I try give my dogs. The herding test was just that and nothing else.

Did Jax love it? Well, duh, but he also loves going to the dog park. He should do both and he has. Today I found another HIC test coming up next month. We "might" go again just for fun, but to sign him up on the spot for a long term herding training and neglect his other activities is not in the plan.

I could see us doing agility, it's in the city and I think both Jax and Peyton would love it. Would that substitute for going to the DP or out and about on the town with Dad, of course not. Agility would just be one more thing for my dogs to "experience" and never an end all be all, or win at all cost kind of thing at all. I want my dogs to experience many things and they can be a champion of none as far as I'm concerned.

Whether I make bad choices or good choices it is never without forethought. Could I have done better, evidently, did I know I could do better, well now I do. But that still does not diminish the fact that Jax got that experience and that was my only goal and in that, it was a success for all. You can say what you will about the tester, but "I know" my intentions with my dogs are always very good and I have longer term well rounded plan which is my main focus.

I hope that clears things up. Sorry if I went off. You guys should know me pretty well after 450 posts. I do NOTHING that will hurt my dogs.

It's back up Dan.

YouTube - Herding Intinct Test

I like your stories. I like that your dogs are rescue, I like that i think you would walk on coals if it had to be for their safety. THat you care if they are happy and enjoying themselves. THat you want to help them learn as much as they can to get as much as they can out of this life. One of the many reasons I like you and have enjoyed meeting you and getting to know Peyton and now Jax. WE all learn from each other which is all that matters in the end. I hope you put the video back up. We are a family here and our history of experiences are here. This is part of Jax's story. ((((HUGS)))) THank you for your kind words for my Mary.

Joe, nobody here has attacked you. We critiqued a video -- not directed at you, but for the thousands of other people who might be reading this. There are other chazzers who want to learn why that was a bad test. There are lurkers and guests who may need to be educated.

It's great that you're so involved with your dogs. Yea, we've tried to encourage you to do more herding, but that's coming from people who have done herding and find it immensely enjoyable and want to express and share our own love for the sport. We also respect your choice to not do so.

Many city people still pursue herding with their dogs. Many people do herding once or twice a month for the pleasure of it and never pursue titles or even high levels of skill at it. But it's certainly not for everyone.

And before you get defensive over that, keep in mind the previous paragraph is directed towards all the lurkers who might be thinking they can't do herding because they live in a city.

Yup, add me to the list of people who live in the city and do herding.