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  #301  
Old 10-22-2013, 07:33 PM
krissy krissy is offline
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Kootenay - How much does Onyx weigh? She looks like a decent sized dog. Is she lighter than I think she is, or are you just uber strong? lol I can't imagine my dog launching herself at me to catch. I feel like that would end bad!


On another note... I've got two Hyperflite Frostbite discs in the mail on their way to my house! Woot! It's getting cold all of a sudden this week and the club didn't have any SofFlites or Super Aeros in stock so I'm going to try these. When they restock in November I'll get some other types to try out.
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  #302  
Old 10-22-2013, 07:41 PM
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Kootenay Kootenay is offline
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Originally Posted by krissy View Post
Kootenay - How much does Onyx weigh? She looks like a decent sized dog. Is she lighter than I think she is, or are you just uber strong? lol I can't imagine my dog launching herself at me to catch. I feel like that would end bad!
.
She's pretty little, about 40lbs or just under? I hope she doesn't grow too much more. She's still pretty easy to catch, but it wouldn't be fun if she got too much bigger!
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  #303  
Old 10-22-2013, 07:48 PM
krissy krissy is offline
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Ha! I definitely thought she was bigger. I was like... "maybe I CAN catch Kili". 40 lbs... ok. 60 lbs... we'll see. 75 lbs (Summit)... I'll die.
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  #304  
Old 10-25-2013, 06:12 PM
krissy krissy is offline
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Ok, so an update and video.

Our Hyperflite Frostbite discs arrived the day after I ordered them from the local disc dog club. Talk about service.

I was very pleased initially that Kili seemed to be very interested in the disc. However, she quickly lost her desire to tug with it, though she still wanted it and chased it readily. But the problem is that I have really built such a strong tug drive with her for a reward that not tugging with the disc seems to have devalued it for her.

I thought maybe I could throw the Hyperflite but then reward with tugging with the West Paw rubber disc. That did NOT work. As soon as the softer disc came out she totally lost any interest in the Hyperflite and refused to chase or pick it up. But she can't catch the West Paw. She has been doing well with learning to catch the Hyperflite but her motivation for it is only so-so. She also does really well catching short throws made toward her, but throws that are away from her (that she has to run down) she has trouble with. I'm guessing that'll come as she learns that the game is to catch it.

Tonight we worked on "disc race"... I hold her back, throw the disc and then race her (that's a relative term when you're talking about a greyhound) to the disc. That's one way that I really worked up her drive for the tug toy. The other thought I had was to try to rig the disc up to a leash or flirt pole.

Looking back at the video footage it does cross my mind that maybe she was tired, maybe too much training... however I do feel like the diminished tug drive has been real over the past couple of days. At the very end of the video is the last bit of training from today, and I'm thinking maybe she was just tapped out. I hope so anyway. We did about 3-5 minutes of rollers, short catches, and chasing me to grab the disc. Had a break. Then 3-5 minutes on flatwork (working on "around" and "through") then she had 10-15 minutes to play with toys, with Summit, with me, and just to sniff and be a dog. Then the failed attempt with the West Paw was only really one throw. Then we did that last segment with the disc race. I called it quits because I could feel that I was soon going to be getting annoyed because she kept biting me. That first yell was because she actually bit me REALLY hard and it caught me by surprise... in fact I have a big bruise on my wrist. The second one didn't hurt at all but I yelped because that wasn't a "re-grip error", she was actually going for my arm. Grabbing me when we do personal play has been an ongoing issue, but there's no toy in that situation.

So here's the video footage from the past few days (Warning: Turn your speakers DOWN! ha ha)



Let me know what you guys think is going on. Any suggestions or advice? I really have no idea how to train a dog for disc. I'm not sure I'm doing it right!

P.S. My neighbours are soon going to think a whack-job moved in next door with all the hooting and hollering going on every time the puppy catches a disc.
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Kristie and the Apex Agility Greyhounds:
Summit (BBF Dropout) - Retired from racing, not life
Kili (Lakilanni Where Eagles Fly) - Walking dreamer
Future Puppy - Coming ~2016-2017
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  #305  
Old 10-28-2013, 12:04 PM
SaraB SaraB is offline
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I can't watch the video because I'm at work and this computer needs to updated for video watching, so take my advice with that in mind.

Some dogs have a hard time moving to a hard disc after using a soft one. There are a few softer "hard" discs that can help those dogs. Typically if I hear a dog isn't wanting to tug when they've always had a nice tug in the past, I would recc trying a softer disc. The Hero Super Aero's come to mind and are what I used to transition my husband's dog to real discs because of his softer mouth. Plus side is that they are very durable! These discs are competition sized and can be used permanently, so there is no need to switch away from them. I know they Frostbites are pretty flexible, but they really aren't as soft as the Super Aero's.

Also, limit tugging, it should super fun and a reward. If the majority of your 3-5 minute session is tugging, then she will get bored of it. If you can't go 3-5 minutes without filling the extra time with tugging, cut your session even shorter. 1 minute and then a break. End while they are still actively engaged with you.
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  #306  
Old 10-28-2013, 12:08 PM
SaraB SaraB is offline
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Figured I'd update on our latest comp! We had our disc competition for the season, a Skyhoundz Disc Dogathon. It all went pretty well, we were indoors which is awesome as it's pretty cold here right now. Zinga brought home 2nd place in Spot Landing and Time Trial. Zuma and Zinga tied for 2nd place in Freestyle. I threw Zinga's Bullseye because of her dropping the disc early, made her go back to get it a few times as I don't want it to become a habit.

Zuma apparently was still sore from an accident during last weekend's agility trial, so her freestyle game was really, really off. She's going to take a long break with some laser therapy to see if that helps. She had a chiro appointment last wednesday and another coming up soon, so that should help as well. Poor girl, if I would've known she was sore I wouldn't have even entered her!

We have a ton to work on for next year, a ton of great new ideas. I'm glad to have the break to focus on other things and to get some new tricks under our belts.
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  #307  
Old 11-05-2013, 08:31 PM
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CharlieDog CharlieDog is online now
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Indy is showing considerable interest in the disc now, but either I throw to fast (Ozzy is a fast dog, and reaches the disc in time to catch it in the air, Indy does not) or she needs to build up some speed.

Is there a way to throw the disc so that it floats a bit slower? She's gotten really good at up close catches, but she's very pawsy and tries to shove the disc into her mouth with her feet

Is there also some way to improve eye/mouth coordination? She's gotten pretty good at close throws (five to seven feet away from me) but further out and she loses it. She keeps her eye on it, but she can't seem to connect. Is this just a practice issue?

This is all new to me. Ozzy was born knowing how to catch a disc flying mid air and he gets some big air. There's a vid on my FB if anyone is interested. I tagged Linds, but I'm not sure if she saw it.

Also, what's the dog situation like at comps? Ozzy isn't a fan of other dogs very much, and I don't want to set his reactivity issue back with flooding him with dogs.
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  #308  
Old 11-06-2013, 07:21 AM
krissy krissy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaraB View Post
Some dogs have a hard time moving to a hard disc after using a soft one. There are a few softer "hard" discs that can help those dogs. Typically if I hear a dog isn't wanting to tug when they've always had a nice tug in the past, I would recc trying a softer disc. The Hero Super Aero's come to mind and are what I used to transition my husband's dog to real discs because of his softer mouth. Plus side is that they are very durable! These discs are competition sized and can be used permanently, so there is no need to switch away from them. I know they Frostbites are pretty flexible, but they really aren't as soft as the Super Aero's.

Also, limit tugging, it should super fun and a reward. If the majority of your 3-5 minute session is tugging, then she will get bored of it. If you can't go 3-5 minutes without filling the extra time with tugging, cut your session even shorter. 1 minute and then a break. End while they are still actively engaged with you.
I am getting some new discs next week. Katherine Furger kindly donated 5 gently used discs (I asked for Hero Super Aeros and Hyperflite SofFlites so not sure how many of each I'm getting) for me to try. My trainer is bringing them for me to class next weekend. So hopefully softer discs will help.

Now... when you say to limit tugging, we don't play tug for 3-5 minutes straight, I use it to reward her for chasing after the disc, catching it, etc. So whatever we're doing (rollers, throws, etc) I encourage her to bring the disc back to me and we tug for a couple seconds, then I throw it again. But now the problem is that she is reluctant to tug when she brings it back. Do I just throw it again? Give her a food reward? I tried switching to something she can tug with as the reward for chasing, catching, and returning the disc... but that just made her lose complete interest in the disc.
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Kristie and the Apex Agility Greyhounds:
Summit (BBF Dropout) - Retired from racing, not life
Kili (Lakilanni Where Eagles Fly) - Walking dreamer
Future Puppy - Coming ~2016-2017
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  #309  
Old 11-06-2013, 11:02 AM
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Pintage Pintage is offline
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This is probably terrible advice, but I struggled for months trying to get Lugia into disc (she's also a sighthound). I mean, she'd catch discs and retrieve them for me but it wasn't exactly the most thrilling thing for her. She also didn't like tugging on plastic discs, either. The thing that REALLY made things click for her was watching other dogs play disc. Probably anthropomorphizing here, but I think of Lugia as a really competitive dog, so after she watched this dog play disc, I immediately threw one for Lugia and she SPRINTED after it (with a gusto I'd never seen before), did a flying leap and caught it midair. Since then, she's been crazy about catching discs. I'd play tug using a plastic disc with Circus, Lugia would come and play tug too, even though she never liked plastic... she even makes a point of tugging harder than Circus and tries to rip the disc from my hand and commences "killing" it...

I don't know how often model-rival training works for dogs in general, but I found that it works really really well for Lugia (I don't train Circus this way, I think there's just some aspect of Lugia's personality that makes m-r training work). Like, Lugia never used to like chasing and retrieving balls. She'd look at me all "You threw it, you get it!" But once she saw another Silken chase/retrieve tennis balls, she became obsessed... just watching this dog fetch for 10 minutes somehow turned her into a ball-crazy dog o_o
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  #310  
Old 11-06-2013, 11:57 AM
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JacksonsMom JacksonsMom is offline
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Originally Posted by Pintage View Post
This is probably terrible advice, but I struggled for months trying to get Lugia into disc (she's also a sighthound). I mean, she'd catch discs and retrieve them for me but it wasn't exactly the most thrilling thing for her. She also didn't like tugging on plastic discs, either. The thing that REALLY made things click for her was watching other dogs play disc. Probably anthropomorphizing here, but I think of Lugia as a really competitive dog, so after she watched this dog play disc, I immediately threw one for Lugia and she SPRINTED after it (with a gusto I'd never seen before), did a flying leap and caught it midair. Since then, she's been crazy about catching discs. I'd play tug using a plastic disc with Circus, Lugia would come and play tug too, even though she never liked plastic... she even makes a point of tugging harder than Circus and tries to rip the disc from my hand and commences "killing" it...

I don't know how often model-rival training works for dogs in general, but I found that it works really really well for Lugia (I don't train Circus this way, I think there's just some aspect of Lugia's personality that makes m-r training work). Like, Lugia never used to like chasing and retrieving balls. She'd look at me all "You threw it, you get it!" But once she saw another Silken chase/retrieve tennis balls, she became obsessed... just watching this dog fetch for 10 minutes somehow turned her into a ball-crazy dog o_o
This worked A LOT for Jackson too. He didn't care much about fetching until he watched my uncles GSD fetch and saw her loving it so much. Then the chuckit brought out excitement in HIM too, and I bought him his own. Now he loves to go outside and fetch!

I did the same with the frisbee, too. I played it with the GSD first and he was watching her loving it.
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