Dog Site - Dog Stuff
Dog Forum | Dog Pictures

Go Back   Chazhound Dog Forum > Dog Discussions and Dog Talk Forums > Dog Training Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 04-13-2013, 07:43 PM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is online now
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,041
Default

Honestly one of the best things you can do is go to trials, plunk yourself down, and just watch. And watch. See all the difference performance styles, the handling styles, the contact performance options. Watching people's videos online is great but really being there and feeling the courses and seeing all these runs with so many skill levels and partnerships all on the same course back to back...and decide what you want your team to look like for the type of courses you expect to run. Develop that picture in your mind, and then tackle people and trainers and the great resources here to figure out how you are going to accomplish that. But without starting with the picture of what YOU want, your training will inevitably lack focus and consistency, and you will do a lot more retraining later.

Just my 2 cents though
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-13-2013, 07:52 PM
Raegan's Avatar
Raegan Raegan is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Fond du Lac, WI
Posts: 411
Default

If I had one equipment wish, after 3-5 jumps and a tunnel, it would be a dog walk. More and more it looks like running contacts are becoming standard practice. I know with Trkman's method you need to get a lot of repetitions in while slowly raising the height, and that's just really hard to do if you don't have your own.

I don't know, for me I have a weekly run thru night. My training at home is mostly handling practice (Haha I'm terrible at handling). So having a lot of equipment at home isn't necessary for me.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-13-2013, 07:52 PM
Laurelin's Avatar
Laurelin Laurelin is offline
I'm All Ears
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 29,308
Default

There's a trial next weekend here. I'm kind of jealous, a local girl scout troop is volunteering o they don't need volunteers. Why didn't my girl scout troop ever do anything that cool?

I'm so new to everything, I figure I need as much help as I can get. I don't want to try to do EVERYTHING though, because that's impossible. But I really could use some pointers for some good exercises we could do in the yard. And some good pointers on how to raise a sports pup and build drive, etc. I mean... I've never done it before. I messed up enough with my first two and spent literally years doing agility wrong. Not really looking for anything to use as the agility bible, just looking to read and watch some stuff before Nextdog comes so I have a better set of tools to pull from for Nextdog.
__________________
Mia CGC - (5 year old papillon)
Summer TG3 TBAD - (10 year old papillon)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-13-2013, 08:08 PM
BostonBanker's Avatar
BostonBanker BostonBanker is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Vermont
Posts: 8,201
Default

Quote:
Honestly one of the best things you can do is go to trials, plunk yourself down, and just watch. And watch. See all the difference performance styles, the handling styles, the contact performance options. Watching people's videos online is great but really being there and feeling the courses and seeing all these runs with so many skill levels and partnerships all on the same course back to back...and decide what you want your team to look like for the type of courses you expect to run. Develop that picture in your mind, and then tackle people and trainers and the great resources here to figure out how you are going to accomplish that. But without starting with the picture of what YOU want, your training will inevitably lack focus and consistency, and you will do a lot more retraining later.

Just my 2 cents though
Brilliant.

I went into Gusto thinking I was Going To Do It Right This Time. I was getting a puppy and I knew what I was doing and it was going to happen. Who knew there were so many ways to do it right?! What I really had to do was settle myself (and him) on a general system/style/whatever that works for us. I skip some really convenient seminars now, because I know that they aren't right for us, however great the presenter may be.

As for equipment - I'm jealous of all of you. I get by with two jumps and a set of 2 x 2 weaves. I don't have any yard to speak of, so it's more than I can use at once. I'd love to have more, but I make sure I hit up as many practices/run thrus as I can, and invite myself over to friends' houses if they have good equipment!
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-13-2013, 08:38 PM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is online now
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,041
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raegan View Post
If I had one equipment wish, after 3-5 jumps and a tunnel, it would be a dog walk. More and more it looks like running contacts are becoming standard practice. I know with Trkman's method you need to get a lot of repetitions in while slowly raising the height, and that's just really hard to do if you don't have your own.
Yeah I have serious DW want. I had sworn I would not get a puppy until I had my own adjustable DW lol. We'll see how that works out with Mirapups coming so soon though. Pretty much any more I can squirrel away for breeding related emergencies is going there for the foreseeable future, so no DW for me.

That said, have you considered building your own down plank? It really does help...I built a regulation downplank (12') for working at home, and by adding something in the middle it can double as a baby teeter trainer. it's just a 12' x 12" wood plank with slats, painted with a good exterior paint for weather proofing then sanded & colored. It's not the same thing, but it at least gets you started.

Also the dog that just won 26" AKC Nat'ls has stopped contacts, just sayin' . A lot of the dogs in the finals did. You gotta run fast and clean to make it to finals after all. I really need to get vid of my friend's BC and his stopped contacts...they are a thing of beauty.
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-13-2013, 08:40 PM
Laurelin's Avatar
Laurelin Laurelin is offline
I'm All Ears
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 29,308
Default

I would say most dogs running in the taller heights at AKC nationals did stopped contacts.
__________________
Mia CGC - (5 year old papillon)
Summer TG3 TBAD - (10 year old papillon)
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 04-13-2013, 08:49 PM
Raegan's Avatar
Raegan Raegan is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Fond du Lac, WI
Posts: 411
Default

Did you see the stride by stride video of Daisy Peel and, um, whoever? Very cool.

Marsh just has managed contacts, but we'll see what our 2o2o winter training looks like when run thru start in a couple weeks (provided the ground ever dries up!).

I just don't have the space for 12'. it would have to be stored in the basement and id never drag it up to work with. This fall I'm moving though, and every likely destination has much better access to equipment!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 04-13-2013, 08:57 PM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is online now
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,041
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raegan View Post
Did you see the stride by stride video of Daisy Peel and, um, whoever? Very cool.

Marsh just has managed contacts, but we'll see what our 2o2o winter training looks like when run thru start in a couple weeks (provided the ground ever dries up!).

I just don't have the space for 12'. it would have to be stored in the basement and id never drag it up to work with. This fall I'm moving though, and every likely destination has much better access to equipment!
Yeah, Daisy Peel/Solar vs. Desiree Snelleman/Pace in the Challenger's round. Very cool.

For those who haven't seen it, I linked it below. (Pace went on tto win the 26" Finals and earn his NAC). Regarding the contacts, I think it's interesting that due to the turn off the DW Pace's contact performance might have been just as good as Solar's but because he shot forward toward the OC jump along basically the same path as Solar's running DW, any path length savings were lost and Solar's additional speed across the contact was able to make up time there:


I have a 4' board too lol. Because I move too much and that was more portable. But yeah, I get the frustration. It's just not the same.

(sorry for the derail, Laurelin)
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-14-2013, 12:35 AM
Beanie's Avatar
Beanie Beanie is offline
Clicker Cult Coordinator
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Illinois
Posts: 13,355
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
I'm so new to everything, I figure I need as much help as I can get. I don't want to try to do EVERYTHING though, because that's impossible. But I really could use some pointers for some good exercises we could do in the yard. And some good pointers on how to raise a sports pup and build drive, etc. I mean... I've never done it before. I messed up enough with my first two and spent literally years doing agility wrong. Not really looking for anything to use as the agility bible, just looking to read and watch some stuff before Nextdog comes so I have a better set of tools to pull from for Nextdog.
My 2 cents...

I don't think you "messed up" with your girls. There are SO many things I would do differently with Auggie given the chance... but I don't consider it having messed up with him. My journey with Auggie may not have been the one I dreamed it would be - I kissed away my dreams for a MACH to settle on a PACH instead, then I buried the PACH dream as well - but I do not believe even for a second that our journey was the wrong one or that it was a mistake.

I've linked this before, but:
Quote:
Donít ever think that any dogís life story is one of unfulfilled potential. I am confident that each dog in our life is living out their intended purpose. From your first agility dog who may now be the star couch-potato of your family, to the dog that may be driving you to drink due to a never-seen-before level of agonizing frustration.

Regardless of how it may appear to any of us watching, every dogís life is always one of great intention. The odyssey is unique to each dog and their person. Those of us on the outside looking in may never be privy to all that is being fulfilled during the time you have together but the impact is likely more than any world championship ever could provide.
http://susangarrettdogagility.com/20...ordinary-dogs/


Next, as far as what to do with your agility puppy. My story with Payton is a lot like BB's with Gusto. "I have ALL THE BOOKS and ALL THE DVDS. We are going to do this RIGHT!" I had schedules from big name agility people. Puppy should be doing THIS by THIS age and when he's THIS old you should have THIS mastered...
And it caused me so much anxiety because I would look at those schedules and freak out. "He should be doing WHAT by now?? We haven't even STARTED that!"

It took a while for me to figure out it was a waste of my time to be worried about it. Would I have preferred things to be a bit different? Oh yes. Do I regret it? No. Payton and I are doing what Payton and I were meant to do together. Regardless of anybody else's schedule, Payton and I will ALWAYS be on OUR schedule.


So what you should do with your agility puppy is play with your puppy.
If you haven't watched Trkman's foundations video yet, you'll hear her talking about the same thing - in fact she flat out says the way she trains her dogs is not nearly as organized as the DVD makes it out to be. She plays with her dogs! Lots of chasing games, she teaches them a lot of tricks. With Payton it was (is) a lot of impulse control games too, balanced with a lot of tug. Busy encouraging his drive and yet working on how to harness and control it. The foundation that I laid with Payton is the foundation of a relationship... not just a foundation for a sport dog. And the fact that we have spent almost two years building a relationship has made all this agility stuff much easier than if all I was doing was trying to tick boxes on somebody else's schedule that dictated what Payton and I should be doing by such-and-such age.


Cliff note's version: read whatever you can, learn cool games and ideas, but don't make your journey with your dog try to somehow match up with any other journey. Because it just plain won't and the point is to enjoy your unique journey rather than be busy comparing it to any other journey and moaning about how behind you are comparatively speaking.


ETA: Oh yeah - as for suggestions of what to set up in the backyard, Clean Run has two agility sourcebooks. I use them to play and when I have to sub an agility class as well. I don't always have the space to set up the full exercise exactly as it is on paper (in my parent's backyard or in our unusually shaped agility building) but I still am inspired by the intent of the exercise and use it to set up something similar that still gets the job done.
__________________


Auggie - The Flash RN NAJ MXP MJP CGC
Payton - Sharp Dressed Man NA NAJ CGC
Pepper - Chocolate Swizz-l-icious
& the pest, Georgie - Peach Pudding N Pie NA OAJ
The Sheltiechick Blog
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-14-2013, 08:34 AM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is online now
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,041
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beanie View Post
So what you should do with your agility puppy is play with your puppy.
So much yes.

I've said it before but I was all worried that I wouldn't bond with Mira () because she was the first dog I really got with Hopes and Dreams and Expectations attached. I got Kim and Webster because they were (and are) cute and I wanted a dog. That's really all there was to it, for better or for worse, and all their accomplishments and their ability to function in polite society is really gravy lol.

So I made a completely arbitrary rule that I wasn't going to train for any competition behaviors til Mira was a year old so there would be no pressure or frustration if she wasn't learning something the way I thought she should. So we...played. For a year. Hikes in the woods, restrained recalls, getting to know and respect on another, bobble boards, interacting with every weird thing I could find from agility tunnels and PVC bars to unstable logs to skating around the house on a sleeping bag (very fun by the way) to throwing a sheet on her and cheering as she waggingly found her way to the edge to just sitting at the park and watching kids play soccer while I read a book. Yeah we did some pivot games and rear feet targeting and once we ran down a big line of chairs (with her leaping from chair to chair) because it seemed like an entertaining thing to do lol.

And then she hit a year and during all that play time in which I was getting crap from people about "when are you going to start actually training her?" I had figured out how she worked and she had figured me out and trusted me. Three months later she had her CD with solid scores. At 18 months I introduced her to jumping and actual weaving and at 23 months (she went into heat at 22months for the first time...right when I had entered her in her first agility trial lol) she went to her first trial on 5 months of training on random hodgepodge equipment in my neighbor's sideyard and did great and Qd despite never being in a trial environment before, simply because she trusted me.

And more importantly, I have a dog I cannot live without. She is perfect for me.

And even so, despite having two prior dogs and all these resources to draw on, there are things I would change about how I trained her foundations. Mostly small things, but there is always something. Even if I had trained her perfectly, behaviors inevitably erode over time and I would be doing periodic maintenance/retraining work. And NextDog, no matter who you are and who that dog is, will always be at least a little different, and things that worked this time around won't work next time, and that's okay too.

Give me a dog with whom I have a good, solid relationship and we will have more success on course than I would have with a more athletic, better trained dog whose relationship is less sound. Webster is a perfect example -- structurally he is a bit suspect -- training-wise he is...well Webster isn't really trained lol -- but he's earned the moniker "The Double-Q'in Machine", routinely collects a respectable number of points in a day, and has a fan club because he's so **** cute and happy about the whole thing lol.


I guess the reader's digest version is just what I quoted lol...play with your dog and relax. It'll be okay. As long as you have a good solid relationship with your dog, any training "mistake" is surmountable because you trust each other, and you understand each other enough to adjust what you need to do in order to succeed.


ETA: Omelet and a coffee if you made it through all that. Apparently I shouldn't post before I get my own breakfast lol.
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13

Last edited by Shai; 04-14-2013 at 08:52 AM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:11 PM.


©1997-2013 Chazhound Dog Site