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  #11  
Old 02-13-2013, 08:50 PM
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Yeah it definitely contributed to our issues. Everything kind of snowballed at once unfortunately.

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You've done so well with Tipper and Mu! I at least don't have the aggression to deal with.
Aw thanks! Its nice to hear because tonight I kind of want to kill them. Lol.
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  #12  
Old 02-13-2013, 09:13 PM
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Go Didgie!!

Linds, I was wondering, at what age did you notice that Didgie had a motion fixation? And how prevalent is it in herding breeds? (I tried to Google the answer but I don't think I'm using the right keywords.) Did Traveler ever have this problem, or is it more likely to manifest if a herding pup is raised with a fast-moving adult dog? And hypothetically, if you knew from the very beginning that Didgie had this fixation (like, the moment she got off the plane), what would you have done differently?
I have dealt with two dogs that have been motion reactive. It may not be the same thing, and is definitely not to the same extent as Didgie. I do see herders (especially border collies) stalking each other often. A couple friends were playing ball with their BCs the other day and the one was playing and the other was very clearly stalking the dog playing. I think a lot of people just accept it.

One was Trey, who was a sheltie. He was very motion sensitive from day 1. At the time we had not enough experience to really deal with it so we took the 'management' route.

Mia is the second one that has a tendency to stalk and redirect on the other dogs. She's definitely not a herding breed but she's always been very prey driven and sharp. I have never met another papillon with her temperament. So it certainly does happen in non herders, particularly dogs that are a little sharper and drivier. When I brought her home she showed some well developed prey behavior- stalking bugs and toys. Tail down, very serious. That transferred into play with the other dogs, namely Nard. I didn't mind it at the time, thought it was pretty cute and funny. Nard didn't seem to mind either.

It gradually has gotten more and more prevalent as she's gotten older and she's gotten more confrontational. I didn't discourage it and in fact at some points encouraged it. Summer does not play so Mia doesn't stalk her when they're playing. The issues we have are when Summer goes to the bathroom. Particularly when Summer poops. And that's going to sound really weird. also doing recalls with Mia around is an issue. But basically Mia stalks Summer as she's going to the bathroom then redirects onto her. Summer of course tries to poop then run away before Mia gets her. Well, Summer running makes Mia worse. Pretty much any fast movement from Summer or Bernard can cause redirection. She will scream and chase. Usually goes for their ears and/or tail. and she will just drag poor Summer and Bernard by the tail. This has sometimes ended in fights between them.

I notice Mia gets WAY overstimulated at this point. She will usually be opening and closing her mouth repeatedly in excitement. And often will screech.

I wouldn't mind advice on the redirection from anyone. I've been working to keep them under the threshold as much as possible. Definitely don't encourage the behavior. Oh well, lessons learned.
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  #13  
Old 02-13-2013, 11:02 PM
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All of my dogs have done this. I guess I didn't really notice or work on it purposefully but there are some behaviors I am not ok with and do not allow.

Limit was the worst. He had a bit of edge and him and Kastle would get into it. I began to encourage him to engage me with a toy when he was angry with Kastle. I went out in the yard every day for weeks and practiced this...but I tend to do things like that anyway, out of habit.

The only dog that Limit fixates on now is Robin. For the most part only in our backyard and only when I'm not out there. If I'm around, he will now engage me. If Robin is not around, Limit is "normal" now and will play fine with everyone else.

Robin went through this with Kastle for a few months and I mostly let Kastle correct him. The girls together are holy terrors but to everyone indiscriminately and moving or not lol
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  #14  
Old 02-14-2013, 12:31 AM
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It's interesting hearing others experiences and knowing I'm not the only one to fall into this trap.

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Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
I do see herders (especially border collies) stalking each other often. A couple friends were playing ball with their BCs the other day and the one was playing and the other was very clearly stalking the dog playing. I think a lot of people just accept it.
I think you're dead on. People just except it as a matter of course. It bothers me with my two so I won't do that and since I started talking about it I've gotten so many people who go "Oh yeah, mine do that too."

There are two dogs I know that come to mind that are worse than Didgie, which is saying something. Two Aussies where they had one Aussie and got another Aussie when he was 5 months old to keep him company. They are completely focused on eachother and the younger one WILL not stop biting, barking and grabbing at the older one. They don't seem to care either, nothing is done to stop it and they cause fights with other dogs because of the intensity and level of arousal.

I just can't have that be them. I want to be able to do stuff with both my dogs, together, with their focus on me.

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The issues we have are when Summer goes to the bathroom. Particularly when Summer poops. And that's going to sound really weird.
YES! Didgie does that too! And Traveler always did that to Kaylee.
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Old 02-14-2013, 12:43 AM
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Bamm is super bad about this too. He has improved, but he still fixates with sudden movements. He's especially bad if he sees two other dogs playing (cricket and joey for example) and he will either charge at them barking his head off or stare hardcore with his body lower to the ground and flip his lip from where he is at. If I don't get in the middle and put an end to it right away I do worry that it may end up in a fight. Usually I can distract Bamm by telling him to go to his crate. As soon as he goes in his crate I immediately call him to me and offer him a tug toy and play with him for a little bit. That's helped a lot and while he still does fixate and probably always will, he has definitely improved.
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  #16  
Old 02-14-2013, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Linds View Post


YES! Didgie does that too! And Traveler always did that to Kaylee.
I really have been baffled by this. I've never seen another dog stalk then start biting a dog that is going to the bathroom.
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  #17  
Old 02-14-2013, 11:25 AM
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Wonderful job!
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  #18  
Old 02-14-2013, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
I really have been baffled by this. I've never seen another dog stalk then start biting a dog that is going to the bathroom.
Mu used to do it to Murphy. I don't remember when/why she stopped. I suspect that he told her off at some point when I wasn't watching though.
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  #19  
Old 02-14-2013, 01:52 PM
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Mu used to do it to Murphy. I don't remember when/why she stopped. I suspect that he told her off at some point when I wasn't watching though.
Yeah, Didgie will stalk and then body slam Traveler when he's going and Traveler used to be like that with Didgie but to a smaller extent. Too bad Traveler sucks at telling a dog off.

So here's today's update. I've upped the difficultly a bit, I'm throwing both their toys at once and alternating between throws, Didgie stays with me while Traveler fetches and then she gets her toy thrown. Sometimes I thrown them both in the same direction with her throws shorter. She's doing good!

The biggest part to me was when we got out there she looked to me, not Traveler. You can see in the start of the video that all her focus is on me, not him.

At about 3 minutes or so she lost it and went after him BUT I was able to get her back. I've figured out that me throwing it for her and then him, so that she is coming back to me as she watches him run away is REALLY hard for her.

But I am so happy every time she looks at him and CHOOSES to reengage with me.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azxSWOati9Y
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Old 02-14-2013, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Linds View Post
Yeah, Didgie will stalk and then body slam Traveler when he's going and Traveler used to be like that with Didgie but to a smaller extent. Too bad Traveler sucks at telling a dog off.

So here's today's update. I've upped the difficultly a bit, I'm throwing both their toys at once and alternating between throws, Didgie stays with me while Traveler fetches and then she gets her toy thrown. Sometimes I thrown them both in the same direction with her throws shorter. She's doing good!

The biggest part to me was when we got out there she looked to me, not Traveler. You can see in the start of the video that all her focus is on me, not him.

At about 3 minutes or so she lost it and went after him BUT I was able to get her back. I've figured out that me throwing it for her and then him, so that she is coming back to me as she watches him run away is REALLY hard for her.

But I am so happy every time she looks at him and CHOOSES to reengage with me.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azxSWOati9Y

That is so great! It looks like she's making some really good progress! I was really impressed when you lost her attention and she ran to Traveler how she was able to regain focus on you! That's Amazing! I'm not sure Talon could do the same at this point Good job!
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