Dog Site - Dog Stuff
Dog Forum | Dog Pictures

Go Back   Chazhound Dog Forum > Dog Discussions and Dog Talk Forums > Dog Training Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #641  
Old 01-25-2013, 10:24 AM
adojrts's Avatar
adojrts adojrts is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,089
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJEtzel View Post
It is not good to start repetitive jumping, contact hitting, or weaves until after growth plates have closed at maturity (or close) but flatwork, tunnels, and short jumps are totally fine in moderation. We don't jump in class or regularly, we just run through sequences. But the breeder said jumping below their elbows was fine up until a year, so we occasionally do a few jumps at 8", like this show and go. He's still got a table under his teeter and the poles open though, so no pressure there at all, and he only works on rubber matting usually.
It is my understanding that the rule is, half the height between the elbow and ground under a year of age. Also goes lower the younger the pup and the large/heavier the breed. Which is why jump bumps are used for pups instead of jumps of any height.

Airn, nothing wrong with teaching solid foundations to pups, actually it is recommended. But there is a big difference in flatwork foundations and running sequences and piece work. Pups can learn impulse control, wicked recalls, shadow handling (heeling on both sides, at all speeds, walking, stopping, running etc) learning to run past obstacles and tunnel entrances without doing them is far more important at this age/stage than doing them. Plank work and developing a end contact criteria is also excellent. We also don't teach weaves to young puppies. Proofing recalls, stays and working during distractions, something as simple as tugging around other dogs or while other dogs are working. The hardest thing to do, is keeping your pup with you and focused on you in a distracting enviroment. We also want dogs/pups to look forward and not at us when doing agility, so a lot of work in put into teaching them to focus forward, it is called handler v.s task/obstacle focus. There is so much to train which can benefit a pup, regardless of whether you do agility for non competitive or with goals to compete.
Reply With Quote
  #642  
Old 01-25-2013, 10:37 AM
SaraB SaraB is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 5,650
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by adojrts View Post
It is my understanding that the rule is, half the height between the elbow and ground under a year of age. Also goes lower the younger the pup and the large/heavier the breed. Which is why jump bumps are used for pups instead of jumps of any height.

Airn, nothing wrong with teaching solid foundations to pups, actually it is recommended. But there is a big difference in flatwork foundations and running sequences and piece work. Pups can learn impulse control, wicked recalls, shadow handling (heeling on both sides, at all speeds, walking, stopping, running etc) learning to run past obstacles and tunnel entrances without doing them is far more important at this age/stage than doing them. Plank work and developing a end contact criteria is also excellent. We also don't teach weaves to young puppies. Proofing recalls, stays and working during distractions, something as simple as tugging around other dogs or while other dogs are working. The hardest thing to do, is keeping your pup with you and focused on you in a distracting enviroment. We also want dogs/pups to look forward and not at us when doing agility, so a lot of work in put into teaching them to focus forward, it is called handler v.s task/obstacle focus. There is so much to train which can benefit a pup, regardless of whether you do agility for non competitive or with goals to compete.
This. Zinga is 10 months now and we've just barely begun piecing things together. She's still jumping 4" and we might do a sequence of two jumps and a tunnel so that I can ensure that I have a really high rate of reinforcement and that reinforcement is in the right place for the exercise.

We've been doing so much foundation stuff its almost ridiculous! The latest thing we are working on is a table behavior as well as proofing the stay on the table and speed both going to the table and moving off of it. A really fun game that we have been playing involves setting up two low tables about 20 feet from each other and playing quick release as well as impulse control games on them. I think I have a video somewhere of our latest session.

With all the foundation work we have been doing, I honestly don't have time to work full sequences or even have the desire to do so until I *know* we are solid with that foundation work.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #643  
Old 01-25-2013, 10:52 AM
mrose_s's Avatar
mrose_s mrose_s is offline
BusterLove
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: QLD, Australia
Posts: 12,139
Default

Guess its time I jumped into this thread.
I pulled Quinn from agility about 18 months or so ago due to her reactivity. I couldn't get her attention around other dogs enought o reward her with games, she was slow and distracted and it was a constant effort to stop her from flying into a reaction at another dog with a tug or a ball.

She's not over it all yet but she's much more reliable, a LOT more engaged with her tug, even around other dogs and I've worked hard to link her tug to playing ball (her favourite) and her recalls and control around distracion (yay herding) but she can still get reactive when aroused and around other dogs beinf full on.

I'm not happy letting her offleash in an agility class yet but I would prefer to teach most of it myself I think anyway and from next week I should have a training buddy I can meet with once or twice a week to bounce off.

I've decided to go back to the start and re-teach all her foundations. We've been getting back into circle work and started playing around with the tunnel this week so I'll try to get some vid and put it up.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #644  
Old 01-25-2013, 01:48 PM
Aleron's Avatar
Aleron Aleron is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 2,270
Default

I start usually agility training as soon as a get a puppy, in some form or another depending on the dog. Usually I start tunnels and chutes for sure, "jungle gym" work with low contacts, interacting with things that move/make noise then very low teeter bang game. The age I work them on contacts depends a lot on their coordination. The specifics vary dog to dog and evolve with my knowledge of training and goals.

I know that jumping and age is a big controversial thing but my dogs do far, far worse in every day life than anything I ask them to do in agility. Savvy was regularly going over the 2' baby gate at 12 weeks and scaled the 4' gate in the yard more times than I want to admit by time he was 6 months old -_- Our back deck used to be open (no railing or sides) and is about 4' tall. My GSD girls would, from I'm sure far too young of an age (under a year for one, not much over a year for the other) run full speed out the door and launch off of it into the yard. Kinda like Deck diving...only there was no water. Every day, many times a day they would do this until they were old dogs . One of them lived to 13+ and the other 14+ with no major orthopedic issues. Actually, they were both much sounder into old age than a lot of GSDs I know who had "physically easier" lives. My Dobe mix, I was 11 and no one told me that puppies shouldn't jump. I had no idea what agility was but I would build jumping courses in the yard for him to do. Starting at 4 or 5 months, I'd get him to jump stuff that was 16"+ high. By time he was 2, he could clear a single high jump that was 4'+. Again, I was a kid and had no clue about any specific training, I just thought tecahing my dog to jump was fun and he seemed to like it a lot. We started real agility when he was 3 or 4 years old and at the time he had to jump 30", which was never a problem. We did agility sometimes several times a week for years. He went on all day walks around town with me as young as 4 or 5 months old many times a week with some breaks. He lived to be an old dog and remained very physically sound.

Obviously, I no longer jump my puppies the way I did my Dobe mix. But some jumping is an early part of their training and I really think it's good for them. I start jumping young and gradually raising the bars as they get older. The age I start depends on the puppy but usually by time they are 12-16 weeks they have down some very low (2" - 4") jump work. I'm not talking every day or lots of jumping but it's part of their early training. It often starts with me having them chase me over really low jumps - a fun game I think they can learn most of what they need to know at lower heights anyway. Whim had only started jumping 20" shortly before her first trial and at her second trial, she measured into 24" which we had barely practiced at all. She went under the 24" practice jump :O But she Q'd in everything that weekend, no issues at all with the extra height on the course.

So here's some of what I do for foundations. I really like the wrapping stuff, it's fun and easy to do with dogs of any age. I think wrapping uprights and wings was one of the very first things I did with Roust and it's something he finds to be very, very fun! The contacts, Roo has not been coordinated enough on until recently to do much of. This is Roust between 7 and 10 months:

__________________
Nikki & the Herding Breed Variety Pack
Visit Us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Alerondogs
Reply With Quote
  #645  
Old 01-25-2013, 02:03 PM
katielou's Avatar
katielou katielou is online now
Slave to the Aussie
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,217
Default

Abe had his first big trial march 9th & 10th at the Seattle kennel club show!
__________________
"If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around."
- cowboy wisdom
Reply With Quote
  #646  
Old 01-25-2013, 02:06 PM
Aleron's Avatar
Aleron Aleron is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 2,270
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by katielou View Post
Abe had his first big trial march 9th & 10th at the Seattle kennel club show!
Good luck Abe! We want video
__________________
Nikki & the Herding Breed Variety Pack
Visit Us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Alerondogs
Reply With Quote
  #647  
Old 01-25-2013, 02:11 PM
katielou's Avatar
katielou katielou is online now
Slave to the Aussie
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,217
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
Good luck Abe! We want video
Oh I am sure there will be. So many people that know him found out and he is going to have a whole cheering squad there!
__________________
"If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around."
- cowboy wisdom
Reply With Quote
  #648  
Old 01-25-2013, 02:16 PM
DJEtzel's Avatar
DJEtzel DJEtzel is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 2,410
Default

Excited to see videos of Abe! What venue?
Reply With Quote
  #649  
Old 01-25-2013, 02:21 PM
katielou's Avatar
katielou katielou is online now
Slave to the Aussie
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,217
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJEtzel View Post
Excited to see videos of Abe! What venue?
AKC

Obligatory lower case
__________________
"If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around."
- cowboy wisdom
Reply With Quote
  #650  
Old 01-25-2013, 03:06 PM
DenoLo DenoLo is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: MA
Posts: 362
Default

We're doing our second trial end of February in USDAA. Still trying to decide if I want to do just Snooker, or Snooker and Jumpers.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:33 AM.


1997-2013 Chazhound Dog Site