Coolies

[JessLough]

Originally Posted by Laurelin

No, not any more than I see a difference between Steve and Blaze and Finn and Wesley. Or Cara and Hawk and Kechara and Merlin.

But I never said there wasn't a difference between BCs and Aussies?

The difference is, people see different Aussies and BCs often. Most on this board have seen Trav and the girls, and maybe other Toolalla Koolies, which all are of which specific type looks-wise

[AdrianneIsabel]

You think Steve and Finn look different? How so?

However, the question is not "can there be variance" the question is... what makes a border collie a border collie, or a coolie a coolie? If it's merely working style and Backup works sheep like my old bosses border collies, is he a border collie? Or Stafinois put Grant on sheep once, would he now be recatagorized as a Coolie if he potentially worked sheep in the same style?

I feel there should be more signifying a breed beyond "works stock the same" and while looks are not everything they can help standardize. If this is a flawed logic then I would love an education.

[sassafras]

Originally Posted by Laurelin

No, not any more than I see a difference between Steve and Blaze and Finn and Wesley. Or Cara and Hawk and Kechara and Merlin.

Yea I wonder if many of our frames of reference are just different because of a limited exposure to the breed.

I get what you are saying, Laurelin, because honestly there are dogs out there that I would be hard pressed to correctly identify as an Aussie vs a BC... so the amount of variation between Avalon's coolies and Linds/Sara's koolies doesn't seem any different than the amount of variation in those breeds to me.

[JessLough]

Originally Posted by sassafras

Yea I wonder if many of our frames of reference are just different because of a limited exposure to the breed.

I get what you are saying, Laurelin, because honestly there are dogs out there that I would be hard pressed to correctly identify as an Aussie vs a BC... so the amount of variation between Avalon's coolies and Linds/Sara's koolies doesn't seem any different than the amount of variation in those breeds to me.

She said it better. LOL

[avaloncoolies]

My coolies range from 35lbs (Mindi) to 48lbs (Akili), u know i might has well put everyone in cause i am pretty sure someone was refering to the "condition" of my dogs....Gunnah is 42lbs, Namoi is 39lbs, Wagga is 39lbs, Riley is 40lbs, Kembla is 37lbs, Malt is 38lbs, Beiber is 39lbs....seems pretty consistent to me, Akili is built differently and is what i refer to as "heavier boned" but I can assure you the "condition" of my dogs is just perfect ... Linds/Saras dogs are from a different kennel and have longer legs and neck, all around taller dog...

I understand that having only seen one "type" of coolie for the year an a bit that you have been following but as pointed out ... that doesnt make any other coolie that looks different not be a coolie...it to me just reinforces that something new had to be shared, show some of the variety and different traits

[JessLough]

Originally Posted by avaloncoolies

My coolies range from 35lbs (Mindi) to 48lbs (Akili), u know i might has well put everyone in cause i am pretty sure someone was refering to the "condition" of my dogs....Gunnah is 42lbs, Namoi is 39lbs, Wagga is 39lbs, Riley is 40lbs, Kembla is 37lbs, Malt is 38lbs, Beiber is 39lbs....seems pretty consistent to me, Akili is built differently and is what i refer to as "heavier boned" but I can assure you the "condition" of my dogs is just perfect ... Linds/Saras dogs are from a different kennel and have longer legs and neck, all around taller dog...

I understand that having only seen one "type" of coolie for the year an a bit that you have been following but as pointed out ... that doesnt make any other coolie that looks different not be a coolie...it to me just reinforces that something new had to be shared, show some of the variety and different traits

I think we mean different things when we say conditioned.

[Grab]

Originally Posted by AdrianneIsabel

You think Steve and Finn look different? How so?

However, the question is not "can there be variance" the question is... what makes a border collie a border collie, or a coolie a coolie? If it's merely working style and Backup works sheep like my old bosses border collies, is he a border collie? Or Stafinois put Grant on sheep once, would he now be recatagorized as a Coolie if he potentially worked sheep in the same style?

I feel there should be more signifying a breed beyond "works stock the same" and while looks are not everything they can help standardize. If this is a flawed logic then I would love an education.

to be fair, though. There really isn't such a wide variety between the avalon dogs and, say, Traveler as there is between Finn and Grant (for example). Their type differences are not that glaring.

[TuffStuff]

While I mostly agree with Adrianne...

Originally Posted by sassafras

Yea I wonder if many of our frames of reference are just different because of a limited exposure to the breed.

I do think this is a valid point. It would be kind of like never seeing anything except conformation Aussies, bigger boned and long flowing locks blowing in the wind.... lol And then suddenly being introduced to a little working Aussie. It would probably bring about the same kind of confusion.

[AdrianneIsabel]

Originally Posted by avaloncoolies

My coolies range from 35lbs (Mindi) to 48lbs (Akili), u know i might has well put everyone in cause i am pretty sure someone was refering to the "condition" of my dogs....Gunnah is 42lbs, Namoi is 39lbs, Wagga is 39lbs, Riley is 40lbs, Kembla is 37lbs, Malt is 38lbs, Beiber is 39lbs....seems pretty consistent to me, Akili is built differently and is what i refer to as "heavier boned" but I can assure you the "condition" of my dogs is just perfect ... Linds/Saras dogs are from a different kennel and have longer legs and neck, all around taller dog...

I understand that having only seen one "type" of coolie for the year an a bit that you have been following but as pointed out ... that doesnt make any other coolie that looks different not be a coolie...it to me just reinforces that something new had to be shared, show some of the variety and different traits

Sorry, my question is not the validity of your dogs nor their condition. I went to your website and I agree many look more closely to what I expect when I think koolie, a bit blockier dog and heavy boned, less of the lean and spry look, but sturdy.

Do you breed for any look at all or do you take only function in account when you breed?

[AdrianneIsabel]

Originally Posted by Grab

to be fair, though. There really isn't such a wide variety between the avalon dogs and, say, Traveler as there is between Finn and Grant (for example). Their type differences are not that glaring.

So, the Koolie breed could be standardized in looks, yes? Beyond "how they work stock" being the only defining characteristic?