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Old 01-04-2013, 10:22 PM
Kilter Kilter is offline
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Default The ideal dog law....

If you could write a law or laws to prevent puppy mills and byb's as much as possible, what would it be? What would work?

This came up as there is a bill going through and the dog show people (in Canada) are more or less against it. I like parts of it (it is for BC so doesn't affect me) but get why it's a concern. I suggested that the group come up with better ideas to suggest and some flipped out saying 'nothing' will work.

I get that there is no perfect law that will work, but I do think there are some things that would work....

Making it illegal to broker dogs and cats - you breed them, you sell them one at a time (well ok two at a time maybe but you get the idea - no breeding and selling to a pet store to sell for you).

Make the law that the animals are not confined to the same space 24 hours a day - you have to take them out for at least an hour of socializing and exercise (which would be a pain for puppy mills or many byb's).

Make it law that no dog/cat is tethered without direct supervision - no dogs living out of barrels on a ten foot chain (even the northern breeds).

you must live at the same location as the animals in your care - no having them out somewhere and popping in every few days or even just once a day to see them....

Any other ideas? yes, you can argue that no laws will work but there must be better ones out there....
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:00 PM
~Tucker&Me~ ~Tucker&Me~ is offline
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Would you mind a link to the law in BC you are talking about? I am just curious
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:17 PM
crazedACD crazedACD is offline
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What I'm going to say may not be popular..heh.

If there was a way to prohibit puppies from being sold in commercial, retail environments I would be for that. I'm not sure how you could define that from people selling out of their big kennels. If someone has a commercial kennel of say GSDs that is health testing, training and working their dogs daily, and so forth...that is reasonable IMO, but it could still be considered a commercial property selling puppies? And you can't define that against a "puppy mill style" kennel of dogs producing puppies.

I could meet 'puppy mills' halfway if the dogs weren't crammed, their health was of primary concern, the environments were clean and ventilated. Of course I would never buy from or advocate anyone to get a puppy from such a place, but that is my biggest issue with them. I believe the way the laws are written, the breeding operations can be cited and fined, but don't always have criminal charges put against them for poor practices. I don't believe there are enough inspections happening, but I don't think that is always the government's fault. Some states limit the amount of dogs one can have on a property, or the number of breeding dogs, which helps as you need x amount of puppies produced to make money. It would be cool if you are selling x amount of puppies a year, you can be inspected at random, face criminal charges, have xyz standards (a certain amount of space, cleaned daily, no health issues, etc).

I worry about more laws going on the books and really hurting the responsible breeders in an era that responsible breeders need all the help they can get. I don't think you are ever, ever going to get rid of the BYB as it is too hard to define by a legal standpoint.

Sorry for the rambling .
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:30 PM
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Xandra Xandra is offline
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Honestly, I think current cruelty/neglect laws should be enforced... and that's about it.

I definitely do not want to restrict people from tethering, I do not want a law saying you have to socialize/exercise your dog for an hour a day.

I don't even really want to make it a law that you have to live on the same property as your animals. It's really none of the governments business so long as the animals are not neglected.

I guess I don't have as much of a problem with making it illegal to sell more than a couple pups at a time but I still really would just as soon not have a law put into effect.
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:33 PM
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I would start with laws like recently passed in LA, no pet store puppies. Rescue/shelter puppies in stores, sure, but not commercial selling of puppies. That'd at least throw a wrench it is, I'd think.
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Old 01-05-2013, 01:38 AM
Pops2 Pops2 is offline
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I don't know if they still do, but VA used to have a nice puppy lemon law. It drove puppies out of the stores.
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:35 AM
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- Follow suit of LA, No puppies sold in retail stores
- Start enforcing the laws we already have on health of animals (food, water, shelter, condition).. if puppy mill busts show us anything its that these laws are NOT being enforced in the first place
- Breeder lives at the same location as his/her animals

I think even JUST cracking down on the second on would help A LOT. Hold breeders to the same standards as pet owners when it comes to animal care and condition. Those dogs need to have food, water, shelter and look OK. That right there would weed out puppy mills or at least shape up their practices, make it harder for them to pump out as many puppies as they are, and kind of settle down the industry.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:16 AM
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Keechak Keechak is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilter View Post
If you could write a law or laws to prevent puppy mills and byb's as much as possible, what would it be? What would work?

This came up as there is a bill going through and the dog show people (in Canada) are more or less against it. I like parts of it (it is for BC so doesn't affect me) but get why it's a concern. I suggested that the group come up with better ideas to suggest and some flipped out saying 'nothing' will work.

I get that there is no perfect law that will work, but I do think there are some things that would work....

Making it illegal to broker dogs and cats - you breed them, you sell them one at a time (well ok two at a time maybe but you get the idea - no breeding and selling to a pet store to sell for you).

Make the law that the animals are not confined to the same space 24 hours a day - you have to take them out for at least an hour of socializing and exercise (which would be a pain for puppy mills or many byb's).
I do like the first part of this but requiring "an hour of exercise" leaves too much up to interpretation.

Make it law that no dog/cat is tethered without direct supervision - no dogs living out of barrels on a ten foot chain (even the northern breeds).
Can't say I agree with this, I have known plenty of sledding set up with perfectly well cared for dogs on a swivel stake system. No need to ban something that's not doing any harm.


you must live at the same location as the animals in your care - no having them out somewhere and popping in every few days or even just once a day to see them....
Can't agree with this either, what does "same location" mean? in the same house? Sled dogs can't live in the house, it's too warm, and they need to stay outside to stay acclimated to the elements.


Any other ideas? yes, you can argue that no laws will work but there must be better ones out there....
I like your post except for the bolded parts.
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