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Old 12-24-2012, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
Except that she doesn't Seriously, if Jora never lived with other bitches I would have never, ever thought she would have a problem. She was fine with non-household bitches and not even DR. When I got another bitch and GSD people started warning me that there could be issues down the road keeping two same sex and especially same sex, close in age bitches together I thought they were a bit paranoid. Besides, my two bitches were BFFs! And of course they were raised well, trained properly and well socialized. I didn't think that would ever be an issue for me and my dogs. People who have those problems must have really aggressive dogs or just not manage them well. Now I know better.
I'm sorry you had that experience. SSA is bad when dogs have it.

Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
Everyone's entitled to their opinions of course. I have to say that I do wonder why you would buy from a breeder who you felt couldn't properly train and manage their dogs? And who's dogs (3 out of 8) may have unstable temperaments?
I don't feel she can't properly manage and train her dogs. Nor do the 3 that are SSA have unstable temperaments. She got them when they were older, ALL of them were over a year old when she got them and the 3 came from kennel situations. So, in her case, it was poor training before they got to her.

Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
Do you feel APBTs also fight due to poor leadership? Or that Foxhounds get along so well in huge groups because they are so well trained and managed?
Some, yes. All of them, no. It truly depends on the dog, lines and breeder.

Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
It is really oversimplified to say the only reasons people would have SSA issues are lack of leadership and/or unstable temperament.
I didn't say that.

Originally Posted by Aleron View Post
I really wish it wasn't more of a concern in GSDs than in the average dog. But well, in your examples you said nearly half of Judge's breeder's personal dogs are SSA, one of the dogs mentioned in this thread was rehomed due to SSA, one of my 3 GSDs was SSA, a GSD breeder friend of mine has had several SSA dogs. Just in this small sampling of dogs you and I know personally or have known, there's at least 10 dogs who have displayed SSA. Dogs owned by knowledge dog people. If you hang out on the GSD forum, it's not at all uncommon for people to post asking for help with their same sex dogs who have started fighting. I'm sure we both know many more than that though. Know how many Goldens I can think of off the top of my head with SSA? None. Poodles? None. Collies? None. And very often when I hear of SSA in breeds like that, it's like what you're saying with the 2 Sammy bitches - two bitches who just hate each other but are good with all other dogs. Or males who are jerks but not really out for blood. Now Dobermans? Have known quite a few SSA ones and I don't even know a lot. Rotties? Yep. And obviously GSDs. That would point towards it being more of a concern in some breeds than it is in others. I'm not saying that GSDs are always or almost always SSA. Some are and some aren't. And some who aren't would be if exposed to the right triggers. I do not think that it generally has to be with "dominance" or "leadership" issues with the owner. SSA should never come as a surprise in the breed. Which is why I haven't gotten another one.

One interesting thing I have noticed in GSDs I have known well is that SSA bitches are often really good with their daughters and granddaughters, providing they have always been together. I'm not sure that a leadership issue between dog and owner would cause a dog to want to eliminate unrelated bitches but favor those genetically related to them? SSA in GSDs is pretty complicated.
I truly believe it is an individual dog thing as well as certain lines etc. I do not think it is a concern in GSDs more than any other breed. I guess I've been lucky so far.
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