Dog Site - Dog Stuff
Dog Forum | Dog Pictures

Go Back   Chazhound Dog Forum > Dog and Pet Fun > Agility and Dog Sports


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 10-13-2012, 05:18 PM
BostonBanker's Avatar
BostonBanker BostonBanker is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Vermont
Posts: 8,201
Default

Quote:
Is that part of why there is so much push to breed small BCs and small shelties? Or is that something else? Just wanting to stay out of the 'BC classes'?
I think a big part of it is trying to get out of that darn 22" height class. Interestingly enough, what I'm seeing in our area is suddenly the "big people" moving into the 26" class. We've got a top competitor in our region who has a BC that I swear is half horse. He's not competing yet, but she specifically went out looking for a big dog. And she's not the only person I know. It makes me wonder if, in the next few years, the 16" and 26" classes will be the huge crazy ones. They've certainly gotten more competitive in the years I've been competing (not many, compared to a lot of people here).

As for the small dog/large dog thing - I think it is a toss up. I have friends who breed and compete Cavaliers, and do exceptionally well with them. They get a lot of flack for running small dogs and not getting "real" agility dogs. They run twice as fast and far as most big dog handlers, because you don't get the momentum and distance on the little dogs as easily. They train their contacts as hard or harder as anyone I know, because even little dogs can jump the yellow in big extension. Some things are easier with big dogs, some are easier with little dogs.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-13-2012, 05:27 PM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is offline
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,040
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonBanker View Post
As for the small dog/large dog thing - I think it is a toss up. I have friends who breed and compete Cavaliers, and do exceptionally well with them. They get a lot of flack for running small dogs and not getting "real" agility dogs. They run twice as fast and far as most big dog handlers, because you don't get the momentum and distance on the little dogs as easily. They train their contacts as hard or harder as anyone I know, because even little dogs can jump the yellow in big extension. Some things are easier with big dogs, some are easier with little dogs.
Yep walking off the course with Webster, I'm always breathing harder than I am with Kim, Mira, or the BCs I run sometimes. More running.
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-13-2012, 05:38 PM
Laurelin's Avatar
Laurelin Laurelin is offline
I'm All Ears
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 29,306
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonBanker View Post
I think a big part of it is trying to get out of that darn 22" height class. Interestingly enough, what I'm seeing in our area is suddenly the "big people" moving into the 26" class. We've got a top competitor in our region who has a BC that I swear is half horse. He's not competing yet, but she specifically went out looking for a big dog. And she's not the only person I know. It makes me wonder if, in the next few years, the 16" and 26" classes will be the huge crazy ones. They've certainly gotten more competitive in the years I've been competing (not many, compared to a lot of people here).

As for the small dog/large dog thing - I think it is a toss up. I have friends who breed and compete Cavaliers, and do exceptionally well with them. They get a lot of flack for running small dogs and not getting "real" agility dogs. They run twice as fast and far as most big dog handlers, because you don't get the momentum and distance on the little dogs as easily. They train their contacts as hard or harder as anyone I know, because even little dogs can jump the yellow in big extension. Some things are easier with big dogs, some are easier with little dogs.
Do the shelties count as 'real' agility dogs? I've never heard that before. It's kind of funny to me.

What keeps the 22 inch class so competitive?

I guess most shelties run 12 or 16?
__________________
Mia CGC - (5 year old papillon)
Summer TG3 TBAD - (10 year old papillon)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-13-2012, 06:04 PM
~Tucker&Me~ ~Tucker&Me~ is offline
and Spy.
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: B.C.
Posts: 4,940
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonBanker View Post
The border collies, I'm not sure if it is conformation or training. They are such fast, flat dogs running, that I think they need very specific work to learn to collect. Otherwise they turn into lawn darts and take down half the bars!
Story of my life...
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryMan View Post
I think u need some angry school.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renee750il View Post
That's what we do here. We're emotionally invested in each other and each other's dogs, the joys and the sorrows.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-13-2012, 06:09 PM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is offline
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,040
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurelin View Post
'real' agility dogs? I've never heard that before. It's kind of funny to me.
Honestly the only people I've heard that sort of thing from are people I probably wouldn't want to hang around with anyway...no matter what breed I was running!

But yeah there are a few of those around. It's funny, when I "just" ran my dogs and we did well that was one thing...but when I started running a friend's BC for her for a bit, all of a sudden I was a Real Agility Handler. Cuz der was a BC. It was so utterly ridiculous.

And heaven forbid you have a Sheltie or BC who isn't fast...
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-13-2012, 06:12 PM
Panzerotti's Avatar
Panzerotti Panzerotti is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Grande Prairie, AB
Posts: 950
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shai View Post
Belgians in general seem to jump big and have trouble turning over the bars. Probably the same reason they are so good at the big jumps required in some of the protection sports and dock diving. Many seem really straight and stiff...from pastern to back to front/rear angles.
Yes! I am working to try to get Pan more flexible over jumps, but it's very slow going. She much prefers to jump then turn as opposed to turning while in the air. Pan also is not the greatest at judging distances at speed and has a weird jumping style where she tucks her rear legs under her instead of extending them.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-13-2012, 06:47 PM
Shai's Avatar
Shai Shai is offline
& the Muttly Crew
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 6,040
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panzerotti View Post
Yes! I am working to try to get Pan more flexible over jumps, but it's very slow going. She much prefers to jump then turn as opposed to turning while in the air. Pan also is not the greatest at judging distances at speed and has a weird jumping style where she tucks her rear legs under her instead of extending them.
Good luck! Pan is in good hands, for sure!

A friend of mine with a Mal just got so fed up...the dog just had a terrible time turning over bars...handle could angle the approach but other than that it was straight across every time. No wrapping the uprights, it was jump-land-turn. Just had no flexibility through his back. That she could manage from handling standpoint though it wasn't ideal...what was so frustrating was any time she would go to an agility seminar, the instructor(s) (usually BC folks) would hone in on this and all the advice she would get was about getting him to flex over the bar...and after a while she'd just be like...I KNOW and yes I am working the whole list of everything to get him flexing can we please move on and critique my handling or anything other than this??? After a few times of this happening other folks would start to chime in to back her up so she would get something out of the seminar other than yet another lecture about how her dog isn't flexing over bars...
__________________

ARCHX U-CD Kim MX MXJ NF CL3-SF RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Golden Ditzhund, b. ~Mar'07
MACH ARCHX U-CD Webster MXB MJB RL3/2X/1X-COE CGC -- Flying Houdini, b. ~Jun'07
Mira CD JH MX MXB MXJ MJB CGC WCX -- Princess Cheeseface, b. Jul'09
Lodin -- Crazy Monkeybean, b. Dec'13
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-13-2012, 07:15 PM
Laurelin's Avatar
Laurelin Laurelin is offline
I'm All Ears
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 29,306
Default

Good to know it's not too many people like that, Shai. It seems silly to me that people wouldn't consider shelties to be a 'real agility breed' since they're so well represented.

I've seen quite a few slow BCs and shelties though too. It's not like every dog in a breed will be fast.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panzerotti View Post
Yes! I am working to try to get Pan more flexible over jumps, but it's very slow going. She much prefers to jump then turn as opposed to turning while in the air. Pan also is not the greatest at judging distances at speed and has a weird jumping style where she tucks her rear legs under her instead of extending them.
I've seen quite a bit of that in the belgians (though these were tervs)
__________________
Mia CGC - (5 year old papillon)
Summer TG3 TBAD - (10 year old papillon)
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-13-2012, 07:21 PM
BostonBanker's Avatar
BostonBanker BostonBanker is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Vermont
Posts: 8,201
Default

Quote:
Do the shelties count as 'real' agility dogs? I've never heard that before. It's kind of funny to me.
You've got me. I've actually never gotten it either, but these people seem to get comments like that all the time. It's turned into a joke, where someone is always saying to them "I'm going to get a little dog like you so I don't have to run" or "You should get a real agility dog and see what you can do!". Most of us are kidding. Some aren't.

Quote:
What keeps the 22 inch class so competitive?
In USDAA, it is where 80% of the border collies wind up, along with most of the Aussies, a few bigger Shelties, and a lot of the sport mixes. Which means you not only have a lot of the super competitive, fast dogs, most of the super competitive fast handlers are in there as well, with one or two or five dogs. It's always the largest class by far, and generally the most competitive, although as I said, it is starting to spread into the other heights a bit.

Quote:
I guess most shelties run 12 or 16?
Yes, in USDAA they do. There are a few that run in 16" performance with Meg, which means they officially measure into 22". But most are 16" dogs.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-13-2012, 07:31 PM
BostonBanker's Avatar
BostonBanker BostonBanker is offline
Top Dog
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Vermont
Posts: 8,201
Default

I wonder too if people haven't been encouraging agility dogs to jump flat, both without meaning to, and also on purpose. It's no secret that it is the fastest jump possible. Dogs who jump big and round waste a lot more time in the air. I haven't been around the sport long enough to know if that is an issue or not. You wind up gambling on keeping the bars up, but if you do, you are going to be fast.

I don't know, bar knocking is the one issue I haven't had to deal with, and I'm so glad. I can't imagine something more frustrating! I'll take my slow, careful jumpers any day.

Well, okay. Gusto maybe takes it to extremes. Like everything he does. I'm hoping he'll chill out a bit as he gets less green!
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:53 AM.


1997-2013 Chazhound Dog Site