What do you think Joey has in him?

[RD]

Oh for god's sake are people really making a fuss because you're calling your ibizan hound an ibizan hound? that's not a black nose.

I think it's much fairer to say that he's an ibizan hound than try to justify why there is some terribly obscure, rare breed like azawakh mixed in there.

[momto8]

Originally Posted by SevenSins

The dog's legs, from the elbows down, are actually fairly short. What makes him look like he has super long legs is a combination of long upper arm, shortish scapula, and almost no angulation between the two which is making the point of elbow fall awkwardly far below his ribcage.



Like these?



BYB/rescue dogs don't follow standards. ETA: Not implying the above dogs are either of those, I pulled a photo off the internet showing a structural point that the quoted poster said didn't happen in purebred Ibizans.

No BYB's don't, but typically it is something you do not see byb's in this breed are few and far between, and from the photo's i've seen of Joey his back is way more roached.

I know that Amber talks to me all the time and I have not heard of anyone giving her a hard time, this is very sad to hear and will be addressed to the proper people.

[skittledoo]

No one is giving me a hard time. That's not what I meant when I said some of the Ibizan don't think he could be pure. The people I've talked to are all Ibizan people that I highly respect in this breed. They are going off of their knowledge and experience with the breed. Undoubtedly they are all show people (then again I don't know of a single Ibizan breeder that doesn't show) and maybe there is a difference depending on the lines. They also pretty much all lure course their dogs too. I know the people I got him from said he came from a breeder in Florida. I seriously want to contact them to see if they can talk to his original owner so I can find out who he came from originally.

Whether he is mixed or pure, I absolutely love him and I honestly don't regret my choice to keep him at all. I do wish I could actually course him though instead of only doing CAT, but if I can't then I'll obviously stick with CAT and get my lure coursing dog later down the road. It's not the end of the world if he isn't pure... Really isn't.

[skittledoo]

Originally Posted by SevenSins

The dog on the left in that pic looks just like Joey's back to me though I don't exactly have a super trained eye when it comes to this stuff. I'd have to compare them side by side, but I just looked at him and his back looks just like the dog to the left.


I don't care about having a show quality type dog honestly. I used to be more interested in showing but my main things I really want to do with an Ibizan is lure course and I really really want to do a little rabbit hunting though he would have to be on a long slip right now.

[Pops2]

Originally Posted by Aleron

I found this and think it's interesting:

"Very dark brown or black eyes suggest impurity. If one looks at pictures of some of the rural farmer's hunting packs one will see many miss colored dogs with dark pigmentation. There are of course many stunning pure individuals in their native land. I have seen videos of entire packs of hounds that any breeder here would be proud to claim." http://www.amberlithe.com/articles/20

Because it sounds like dogs in the hunting packs in the breed's native land do sometimes have darker pigment. American breeders may have determined this is "impurity" but it can be hard to say what the truth is.

it's mostly (but not solely) a side effect of ribbon chasing that they glom onto a specific look within the wider variation of the breed & decide that ONLY this look is the breed. later the knowledge of the variation is lost and they start deciding older looks must be "impure." for example a LOT of show dale breeders are adamant that Matt Thom's slicks & broken coat dales MUST be crossbreds. they have all forgotten the woolly poodle coat was NOT the original preferred coat style. likewise solid red & wolf grey rottweilers, merle & brindle american foxhounds, black saddles on redbone coonhounds, short cur ears on plotts, brindle & B&T RR and labs, 20-30# fit poms & pugs, wrinkle free shar pei & neos, ETC.

[Romy]

Azawakh really don't have roaching. Many have high slung fila butts and many are flat backed. I think what makes Joey's legs seem long is that he's shorter in the loin than the standard calls for. Also, his head is on the opposite end of the extreme from what azawakh would have contributed.

And while there aren't many bybers in ibizan hounds, not all fit the standard. I'm guessing we don't see those often because they're placed in companion homes and don't make it to confo and performance events.

The roaching could definitely have been exacerbated by being crated too much/not enough exercise while he was developing too. That sort of thing can really ruin the body of even well bred sight hounds.

[Aleron]

Originally Posted by Pops2

it's mostly (but not solely) a side effect of ribbon chasing that they glom onto a specific look within the wider variation of the breed & decide that ONLY this look is the breed. later the knowledge of the variation is lost and they start deciding older looks must be "impure." for example a LOT of show dale breeders are adamant that Matt Thom's slicks & broken coat dales MUST be crossbreds. they have all forgotten the woolly poodle coat was NOT the original preferred coat style. likewise solid red & wolf grey rottweilers, merle & brindle american foxhounds, black saddles on redbone coonhounds, short cur ears on plotts, brindle & B&T RR and labs, 20-30# fit poms & pugs, wrinkle free shar pei & neos, ETC.

Good point. I think most breeds started off with a lot more variety than what many modern breeders would recognize. I have had non-PyrShep people question what is actually correct in the breed because they all look so different. I have actually been firmly told by multiple people am shows that "Pyrshep people really need to make the standard more strict. There is too much variety in the breed!"

[Lyzelle]

Originally Posted by Pops2

it's mostly (but not solely) a side effect of ribbon chasing that they glom onto a specific look within the wider variation of the breed & decide that ONLY this look is the breed. later the knowledge of the variation is lost and they start deciding older looks must be "impure." for example a LOT of show dale breeders are adamant that Matt Thom's slicks & broken coat dales MUST be crossbreds. they have all forgotten the woolly poodle coat was NOT the original preferred coat style. likewise solid red & wolf grey rottweilers, merle & brindle american foxhounds, black saddles on redbone coonhounds, short cur ears on plotts, brindle & B&T RR and labs, 20-30# fit poms & pugs, wrinkle free shar pei & neos, ETC.

Definitely true, and ditto with the Sibes.

[Aleron]

Amber, do you think the Beezer people would be mad if you got a PAL number on him and did coursing? I really think he could get one but you couldn't keep calling him a mix

[momto8]

"The roaching could definitely have been exacerbated by being crated too much/not enough exercise while he was developing too. That sort of thing can really ruin the body of even well bred sight hounds. "

That is a thought I had, i would defiently get him to a chiropractor