CM gets bitten... again (vid included)

[Doberluv]

Originally Posted by rubygirl

People who have children and would take a chance at having a dog at that level of aggression around... yes I would say that they are not particularly sound minded.

That is NOT aggression...not on the dog's part. That is a defensive reaction.

[Doberluv]

Originally Posted by rubygirl

I've seen dogs pushed MUCH FARTHER and not bit like this. I also would like to note that this wasn't a bite it was an attack. The dog keeps going even when Cesar desists. That's NOT normal.

Yes it is. The dog is already so worked up... his survival instincts are in high gear. His physiological self, hormones etc are in full defense mode. This dog has been a punching bag no doubt and because Cesar paused for a moment was no reassurance that the attack was over. Cesar did pause several times and then went after the dog again. So, he learned that the assault wasn't over.

[AdrianneIsabel]

Originally Posted by rubygirl

I've seen dogs pushed MUCH FARTHER and not bit like this. I also would like to note that this wasn't a bite it was an attack. The dog keeps going even when Cesar desists. That's NOT normal.

Why are you or your companions pushing dogs so hard?

Further, why do you believe that Cesar desists?

[rubygirl]

Originally Posted by Doberluv

Never mind that Cesar was staring, hovering over, blocking access to the food, even though that's bad enough. He was pursuing that dog non stop, relentlessly, punching, kicking, and cornering the poor animal. That dog didn't have a chance, even when he lay down and wasn't reacting. Cesar still, egged him on and forcefully elicited the reactions he got. That dog had no choice but to bite. He was being attacked by this maniac!!!!!!!!! What freakin animal, including a human wouldn't defend himself if that's all there was left because escaping wasn't even an option.... as far as I remember...without going back and looking at the yard and so forth. (can't bring myself to watch that again) This is absolutely normal behavior in a situation such as this. Yeah right...push someone, animal or human into a corner, make it think it might be killed and when it tries to preserve it's life the only way it knows how.....KILL IT. THIS IS AN ANIMAL. Animals don't know that you're still planning on letting it live and planning on feeding it again. To an animal, this situation may very well mean the end of it's life. Why do people forget that dogs are animals?????!!!!! Anyone who thinks like this shouldn't own dogs. They don't understand them. Don't even understand the basics of or the right to self preservation.

Punching and kicking. Hm.
I would have done a lot worse to that dog had it done that to me.
I had a very emotional response to the video. Imagining a child in the place of Cesar. A child that may very well be "posturing" over the dog or "provoking" the dog or "hitting" it on the neck. That kid would be attacked and maybe dead.
This dog did not give a warning bite. She bit, then Cesar backed off startled. Then the dog kept at him and delivered multiple blows and there were four puncture marks if you actually look closely at his hand. How can we perceive to know that bones weren't broken? Or that there wasn't muscle/tendon damage?
We tend to anthropomorphize and put dogs on a level that is the same as a human being. That is wrong IMO.
Cesar admitted he made a mistake. He knows he screwed up, that he was cocky or arrogant. That dog taught him a lesson.
The dog should only be kept alive if it is kept at a compound like Cesar's rehabilitation centre. Not in the generals public.
As for people saying they DO keep dogs like that in their homes around their children and that it is little risk... well I guess you'll only know when the dg finally dies and "well, he never attacked my kids". I wouldn't personally take a chance because my children are far more important then ANY dog out there.

[rubygirl]

Originally Posted by AdrianneIsabel

Why are you or your companions pushing dogs so hard?

Further, why do you believe that Cesar desists?

He may still be posturing slightly but he is not continuing to try and touch her or come forward at her.
I push them to see if they will in fact act like THIS! I desensitize. Never been attacked. Not one time.

[rubygirl]

Originally Posted by Doberluv

Yes it is. The dog is already so worked up... his survival instincts are in high gear. His physiological self, hormones etc are in full defense mode. This dog has been a punching bag no doubt and because Cesar paused for a moment was no reassurance that the attack was over. Cesar did pause several times and then went after the dog again. So, he learned that the assault wasn't over.

At no time did I see punching or kicking. I saw him kick the dog (not even hard) when the dog had latched on... or do you propose that he just stand there submissively while the dog is ripping his hand off.

[rubygirl]

I don't think I can continue in this argument. If people want to take a chance on dogs attacking them I don't particularly care. If you think this was an appropriate resposnse, fine. If you would tolerate this around an 18 month old baby, your insane.
I have given my opinion which is, last time I checked, the point of a forum.
You all think Cesar Milan is the devil fine. He is still a human being. HE didn't blame the dog, HE wasn't angry, HE didn't take revenge. Yet everyone on here is quick to call him a sadist and an abuser *eye roll here*.... then I am certainly a sadist and an abuser because that dog would have been taken out back and used as target practice.
Oh and sorry kady.... my iPad has autocorrect... lol

[AdrianneIsabel]

Originally Posted by rubygirl

He may still be posturing slightly but he is not continuing to try and touch her or come forward at her.
I push them to see if they will in fact act like THIS! I desensitize. Never been attacked. Not one time.

So you set your dogs up for failure? Fantastic!

The law of learning tells us that what is reinforced, remains and grows stronger with each reinforcement, and what is not reinforced, will eventually extinguish.

But hey if the only way you know how to train is Me Caveman You Dog then by all means, enjoy.

Meanwhile, in the modern world...

[Renee750il]

A lot of a dog's reactions have to do with the person pushing them.

I've had dogs I got from the pound that had a history of guarding food . . . and I could reach IN their mouths and take stuff. Do I tell anyone else to do something like that? Oh HELL NO.

I'll never forget the look on Charley's face when he saw me grab Buffy after she'd scarfed up an unidentified something and I had my arm in her mouth past my wrist He never tried that

Would I do something like that with any dog? Absolutely NOT. If there is fear on either side of the equation you've got a monumental FAIL. It all has to come from a position of mutual trust.

Something Cesar doesn't seem to worry about -- he seems more interested in "respect" based on the dog fearing him . . . which isn't respect at all, just fear. And a fearful dog is the most dangerous kind.

And no, I'm not a trainer and will never claim to be. It's just a matter of having some common sense.

[MandyPug]

Originally Posted by rubygirl

that dog would have been taken out back and used as target practice.

True dog lover... right there. Yup.