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  #11  
Old 05-10-2012, 07:19 AM
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A lot of people will "Rah! Rah!" about this and I reckon they should.

But all he did was confirm what has already been happening. That this is a issue for the states to decide and they have been doing so.

I know a lot of you like Obama because he is "cool", but he is nothing more than any other slimy politician, saying what he neds to say to get re-elected and then ignore us again.

Le Sigh..... So, "Hooray", The President thinks gay people can get married. How about the economy dude? The unemployment number getting "lower" is NOT because of the reason you want it too.... How about almost 350,000 women dropping out of the workforce in the last 2 months? What say ye there?
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  #12  
Old 05-10-2012, 07:37 AM
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If he says something about one thing he will be crucified for not saying something about another thing. Its the way it always goes.

I don't like him because he is "cool". I like him because he seems intelligent, grounded and has a good head on his shoulders.
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  #13  
Old 05-10-2012, 07:39 AM
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Frankly, I don't much care one way or another what Obama thinks about gay marriage. Considering that he flipped his view when he ran for President, I figured he was lying about opposing it . . . and as you pointed out, its happening on its own. He can hardly legalize it nationwide on his own. He can try to get the executive branch to stop enforcing DOMA, but theoretically, that's already happening.

But having the President of the United States (whether its Obama or anyone else) come out on their side is a huge symbolic victory. And they're right on that, actually. It is official recognition that their position is not beyond the pale, that it is, in fact, mainstream or close to it (as the polls indicate).

Obama's worth, or lack there of, as a President is pretty much beside the point. He did it because his hand was forced and it was more politically advantageous to come out in support than oppose it (and it is . . . it will now be an election issue, and the opposition is extremely good at looking like foaming bigots). He has supported it before . . . he didn't evolve, he's just telling the truth of what he's always thought.

However, that the President supports gay marriage . . . that IS a big deal. Whether or not you like it, the person holding the Presidency is more than just themselves.

And gay people getting married is not a non issue. I've become very aware of the injustice of denying them the rights other couples have. Is it an issue on par with the economy? No. But it is an important issue . . . and I am appalled the phrasing used by NC, which doesn't just prohibit gay marriage, but goes out of its way to stick it to gay couples who want to work through private contract. Like it or not, that's an issue of basic freedoms, and the President should speak out.
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  #14  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:05 AM
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However, that the President supports gay marriage . . . that IS a big deal. Whether or not you like it, the person holding the Presidency is more than just themselves.
Try telling him that. LOL I get this Lil.

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And gay people getting married is not a non issue. I've become very aware of the injustice of denying them the rights other couples have. Is it an issue on par with the economy? No. But it is an important issue . . . and I am appalled the phrasing used by NC, which doesn't just prohibit gay marriage, but goes out of its way to stick it to gay couples who want to work through private contract. Like it or not, that's an issue of basic freedoms, and the President should speak out.
I am going to leave it at this, you all can crucify me if you wish.

If I were a secular person, I would be with you 100%. You who can reason know where I come from on issues of personal liberty. But I am bound by something bigger. Many of you use this as an example of the Bible's "hatred" and all the other things people say and that is fine. Its a lie, the Bible being about hate, but it's fine. I realize that I am not going to ever "win" an argurment about the Bible on the internet. LOL But God's commandment is clear on this topic. That's all I need to know.

This is the part where everybody loses their mind and calls me names.
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  #15  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckstop31 View Post
If I were a secular person, I would be with you 100%. You who can reason know where I come from on issues of personal liberty. But I am bound by something bigger. Many of you use this as an example of the Bible's "hatred" and all the other things people say and that is fine. Its a lie, the Bible being about hate, but it's fine. I realize that I am not going to ever "win" an argurment about the Bible on the internet. LOL But God's commandment is clear on this topic. That's all I need to know.

This is the part where everybody loses their mind and calls me names.
No, but it's the point where I point out that we are not a theocracy.
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  #16  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:13 AM
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No, but it's the point where I point out that we are not a theocracy.
Who ever said we were? In our Republic, the voters get to have religious liberty and if they choose to vote based on those beliefs, does that make us a Theocracy?
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  #17  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:18 AM
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Who ever said we were? In our Republic, the voters get to have religious liberty and if they choose to vote based on those beliefs, does that make us a Theocracy?
Basing laws on what the bible (allegedly and/or cherry-picked, which is a different argument) says = theocracy.

ETA: How do you feel about Sharia Law? Which is essentially people answering to a bigger power, from their perspectives.
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  #18  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:23 AM
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I am also of the opinion that there is no god. So that argument is for people who want to listen to bigoted old men who are now long ago dust.
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  #19  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Lilavati View Post
Frankly, I don't much care one way or another what Obama thinks about gay marriage. Considering that he flipped his view when he ran for President, I figured he was lying about opposing it . . . and as you pointed out, its happening on its own. He can hardly legalize it nationwide on his own. He can try to get the executive branch to stop enforcing DOMA, but theoretically, that's already happening.

But having the President of the United States (whether its Obama or anyone else) come out on their side is a huge symbolic victory. And they're right on that, actually. It is official recognition that their position is not beyond the pale, that it is, in fact, mainstream or close to it (as the polls indicate).

Obama's worth, or lack there of, as a President is pretty much beside the point. He did it because his hand was forced and it was more politically advantageous to come out in support than oppose it (and it is . . . it will now be an election issue, and the opposition is extremely good at looking like foaming bigots). He has supported it before . . . he didn't evolve, he's just telling the truth of what he's always thought.

However, that the President supports gay marriage . . . that IS a big deal. Whether or not you like it, the person holding the Presidency is more than just themselves.

And gay people getting married is not a non issue. I've become very aware of the injustice of denying them the rights other couples have. Is it an issue on par with the economy? No. But it is an important issue . . . and I am appalled the phrasing used by NC, which doesn't just prohibit gay marriage, but goes out of its way to stick it to gay couples who want to work through private contract. Like it or not, that's an issue of basic freedoms, and the President should speak out.


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  #20  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sassafras View Post
Basing laws on what the bible (allegedly and/or cherry-picked, which is a different argument) says = theocracy.

ETA: How do you feel about Sharia Law? Which is essentially people answering to a bigger power, from their perspectives.
Well, most of the laws of this country are based in Judeo-Christian values. If we got down to brass tacks, I bet we would agree on 95% of what those values are. As it comes to homosexual unions and things of that nature.... It comes back to the idea that rule are OK, as long as I agree with them. I believe God gaves us those rules for good reasons. He IS God afterall.

Again, we need to understand what this country is. A Republic. The PEOPLE get to choose our leaders and what our government is supposed to be. We have done so. Like it or not, for now I guess, a vast majority of people here identify themselves as Christians. Those people vote their belief system. That does not make us a theocracy.

As for Sharia.... If a free people choose to live by those standards, good for them. But Sharia is not a good arguement for you to be using in defence of gay marriage.
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