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  #11  
Old 08-01-2009, 05:12 PM
Athebeau Athebeau is offline
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Originally Posted by Athebeau
yet also don't back down when they try to pull their paw away.
My goodness I think I'm going through mentalpause I can't believe I said that! LOL Thank you Doberluv and corgipower for pointing that out. I wouldn't want anyone following that horrible advise I typed! Heck I sound like the dog torturer.

A bit off topic corgipower, my cousin used to breed and show corgies. Adorable dogs we also get many in for grooming.
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  #12  
Old 08-01-2009, 06:00 PM
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Doberluv Doberluv is offline
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Oh yeah...you are the all star animal abuser. That's your hallmark, or didn't you know. Cheh....yeah...right.

My little Chi will pull her foot back from time to time when I'm Dremeling her. She isn't really trying to avoid it because she's been doing this for a long time and is quite fine with it over all. She's usually the pushiest one to jump into my lap when it's Dremel time. But it seems to just be a reflex almost. The vibrations are undoubtedly annoying to say the least so it seems natural for a dog to pull the foot back. I will take her paw and hold it more firmly and tell her, "come on now, hold still. We're almost done." (they do get tired of holding still for so long. Dremeling takes longer) Then I am sure to give another cookie. Sometimes I think, like Corgi said, they need to perhaps be re-positioned into a more comfortable position or just need to rest for a sec. I probably should just do a couple of paws at one time and do the others later, but usually I just push through and get 'er done.

So, just because my vetran dogs may pull their foot back a bit here and there, I don't just throw my hands up and let them go on their merry way. No....I won't back down.

So, I think it's all in how we interpret what you said. You may not have meant to use brute force on a green dog who is just beginning to get use to clipping or with one that has an issue about it. That force is what caused Tokie, my son's dog to develop such an extreme phobia about nail clipping and messing with her feet. Several of his friends held her down and forced her to get her nails clipped. They were frantic and nervous, strong arming her, yelling when she wouldn't hold still... and the whole experience just freaked her out.
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  #13  
Old 08-01-2009, 09:51 PM
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Renee750il Renee750il is offline
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I handle Kharma's feet daily. She really, really doesn't like it -- tolerates it because it's me. Occasionally I can even kinda sorta clip a nail a little bit. Her nails are not only too big to fit into clippers, they rival Wolverine's talons for toughness You guys would laugh/be horrified if you saw how I have to clip a little on one side of the nail, then the other side, then clip the point that's left, and even then can barely get the clippers to cut through.

I've even tried a rasp. Oh, that worked . . . . NOT, lol!

Let's not even discuss the dremel Let's just say that this IS the dog who attacked the cattle fence when she was 3 months old . . .

I'm not sure which of us dreads nail clipping more And Bimmer and Tallulah take their cues on it from Kharma, although Bimmer will tolerate being messed with longer *sigh* His nails are more difficult, though, because he has hair that grows down over them.
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Last edited by Renee750il; 08-01-2009 at 10:13 PM.
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  #14  
Old 08-01-2009, 10:18 PM
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Doberluv Doberluv is offline
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I know what you mean about the nail being so big and so hard. Lyric's and Tokie's nails are like that...very difficult to clip unless they've gotten too long and the tip is thinner. That is the beauty of the Dremel. Of course, that takes about 15 minutes per dog for me. If I did it more often, it would be so much better, but I procrastinate a little. I do remember times where I'd only be able to get one little corner of the nail in the clippers, then have to wedge in the other corner of the nail. Nope.....those thick, hard nails are really difficult to clip. And the hard ones take longer to Dremel or file too. The little Chi's nails are softer and tinier and they go pretty quickly except I have to be very careful because I can barely see what I'm doing. LOL.
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  #15  
Old 08-01-2009, 10:58 PM
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Hard to really tell, but consider that these paws are EACH 5.5 inches across . . . the talons are about the size of a medium woman's little finger. Yup. Not the nail -- the FINGER

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  #16  
Old 08-01-2009, 11:09 PM
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Many great suggestions here.

Whenever I read a thread about difficult time doing nails it always bring to mind on of my client's dog, a welsh terrier, who from the get go did not like his nails being done. I have to muzzle him, sadly (I hate having to do that) but if I didn't he would seriously bite. I've found in the course of clipping his nails the best method in doing so is I start with a couple nail and when he starts to tense up, just when he's about to lash out and start thrash I stop, calm him down, massage his back, talk to him gently until he calms down then do a few more and repeat when he starts to tense up. It's to a point I know before he will react now, just by feeling his body. Takes me a lot longer to do his nails but since grooming him I think that doing his nails now are a lot less stressful to him and me then when he first came 4 years ago.
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Old 08-02-2009, 08:02 AM
Athebeau Athebeau is offline
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Doberluv, thanks I got such a kick out of your post. So I should change my name from Athebeau to the dog torturer...hmmm lol

My Sister has quite a few tricks for doing nails on difficult dogs at our grooming shop. For small dogs she will have one of us hold the dog in a hug and rub belly and she quickly zips off the nails with a big positive yay after each nail. For one highly nasty Westie she just puts the dog on the grooming table and brings the paw up from behind like a horse and clucks to the dog like you would do to a horse when doing their feet. She too has an aggressive Welsh which she uses a different technique where she does them so quick the dog doesn't react. Some a blow in the nose clip, blow in nose clip and praise at the end of the nail clipping. For large breed dogs that are nasty for nails for some she will muzzle just as a preventative and doing the dogs nails in the tub works best as even though there is a bath mat down they are still a bit unsure of their footing. Some she won't even lift their leg and just snip the nails quickly while they are standing on all 4's some dogs dont even notice. She brings the nails clippers under them so they don't see. Her main thing is to never fight a dog to do nails, if you fight the dog the dog will resist and become tramatized. The thing is my Sister has confidence and you can see the dogs feel very comfortable with her and relaxed. I probably could not get away with doing the same tricks on her clients nervous dogs as they would pick up on my insecurity right away. You can't fake confidence when it comes to things like that, at least I can't. We have a dremel but since we are on a time line when it comes to doing nails we normally clip the nails off then dremel quickly just so they are not rough.

For my own rescues Beau my Dobe had to have positive tactics and desensitizing techniques used. We had to get him used to his paws being handled first so we started out with massage and massage down the leg and when he tense massage back up the leg etc. Soon he liked having his paws massaged and a snip here and there didn't bother him. Now for nails he is best when he is standing and the paws are picked up like a horse when cleaning their feet. For my highly aggressive Rottie rescue I used the massage method as well. She has severe HD so I don't make her stand up so most times I will clip her nails when she is relaxed and I will massage her and rub her belly then quickly clip her nails massage and belly rub again and she doesn't mind it at all, now that is. Chance our land shark positive techniques worked well for her. She was taught to stand and she is done like a horse and then afterward she gets high intense play time and she just goes crazy happy. She is basically rewarded by play time as she loves to play. The Newf's probably just sleep through getting their nails done, they don't care at all.
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  #18  
Old 08-02-2009, 08:17 AM
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Clipping nail experience is so different form dog to dog. Especially when you do it for work. My own dogs are really good at getting their nails done, I'm really proud of them. With client dogs, my technique varies from dog to dog. Some, as the one mention in my previous post, I've come to learn that holding on to his paw and forcing him through it gets him so worked up I worry about his overall health and mental state. Some dogs, even if they don't like their nails done I will hold onto their paw, talk through the process and they do just fine. It all depends on the dog.
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Old 08-02-2009, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doberluv View Post
So, just because my vetran dogs may pull their foot back a bit here and there, I don't just throw my hands up and let them go on their merry way. No....I won't back down.
Meh...I'll let the corgis go on their merry way if they pull their foot away.

But basically, I'll let them have their foot back, they'll walk around the room a bit, maybe play for a minute and than I'll go back to clipping nails. With them though, they don't trust the process 100% even now - Ares trusts it 95% and Morgan trusts it about 70% (bitches... ). If I continue to try to clip when they want to stop, that trust goes down. By taking a break and taking a breath, we regroup and it goes well.

I agree...it's all in the interpretation and it's different for every dog. I don't do the mals that way, because if I stop the clipping session, it'll be hours before I can try again while they bounce off walls.
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  #20  
Old 08-02-2009, 10:13 AM
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Wow Renee! What huge paws and nails! I guess a rasp is the only way to go. LOL.

Really good and interesting posts. I can see how creative you have to be when you are a groomer. There's no time to go through a super lengthy process. I think those ideas were very good and innovative.

Quote:
But basically, I'll let them have their foot back, they'll walk around the room a bit, maybe play for a minute and than I'll go back to clipping nails
.

That's what my horse shoer use to say when my mare would pull her foot forward and back, forward and back. I'd tell her to keep still and he said, "A-w-w, she just wants her foot back." LOL. He was such a nice man.

Well, that's a good idea to break things up a bit. I only do that occassionally but I think I'll work on doing that more.

I will have a plate with diced up cheese, steak or chicken on the counter and every few nails, they get a tid bit. So, they're not really wanting to go away but like I said, the vibrations are annoying if it catches the nail a certain way and Chuli, being so tiny will pull her foot back a little. In fact, if i turned her loose, she'd very likely jump right back into my lap. That one really truly loves the attention and food more than the tedium of the procedure. She really seems to like being fussed over. She's one who loves luxuriating in a bubble bath with a good book or any kind of grooming...putting make-up on, nail polish, curlers, you name it. She's just a very agreeable little gal.
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"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty."

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