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  #31  
Old 07-12-2009, 03:03 PM
ufimych ufimych is offline
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If I am a reputable breeder, or not, let others decide. I money back guaranteed genetic health of puppies I sold and always kept in touch with their new owners, because I wanted to know about their working performance. I also money back guarantee genetic health of my Saluki puppies. You can easily find statistic on dog's longevity in Internet. You will see that they live about 8-10 years average and all of them have lived their lives under intensive veterinary supervision! Even during those 8-10 years of life, many of them had surgeries, helping to extend their lives for a few years.
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  #32  
Old 07-12-2009, 05:37 PM
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Renee750il Renee750il is offline
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I am going to be interested in learning more about your dogs, since my Fila bitch is a hard, working line dog.

I don't see her ever living outdoors or consenting to sleep in a wooden box, lol. She's far too enamored of my 18" deep latex mattress and those high thread count sheets Plus I don't think I could stand to have her away from my side But the Fila is of a different temperament than the Saluki.
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  #33  
Old 07-12-2009, 10:17 PM
Pops2 Pops2 is offline
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rustic means the dogs prefer a rough existence over the pampered existence most pets have. for example my salukiX goes nuts in the house and insists on being outdoors regardless of weather. he prefers a run through the woods chasing critters to a pleasant walk. he prefers the battle w/ a fox or coon over a romp in the dog park. this is contrary to most dogs' nature (most creatures' for that matter), as most will gladly take a life of ease & plenty over one of hardship & privation.
rustic breeds grow up in rough conditions which weed out the weak in a similar manner to natural selection. this produces a dog w/ minimal health issues even when inbred. most rustic breeds develop problems quickly once they become popular as pets, companions & showdogs because the natural pressures are removed and breeding tends to be biased toward a single facet or only a few. this often allows dogs w/ less than obvious defects to become prominent in the gene pool, especially if the gene pool is made smaller by a rigid closed stud book that represents a small segment of the original population. further breeding causes the problem to become more pronounced. this is why BYBs are so dangerous to a breed & why people w/ working breeds sometimes fight recognition by major registries.
foxes, coyote & wolf nutrition, fecundity & recruitment (percentage of pups born that survive to become a breeding adult) is cyclical w/ their primary prey base & predation pressures. Foxy's example is 180 degree out from most of the USA as it showed low fecundity & high recruitment. most canids have large litters and low survival. rustic living mimics this but adds the pressure of human selection on breeding for a specific performance factor.

tessa
OTC shots are only as good as the shop you get them from. but if a shop doesn't handle them correctly word gets around as people start loosing dogs. so if a shop has been around for a long period & carries the shots for a long time they are most likely handling them correctly. remember hunting dogs are intentionally exposed to unvaccinated wildlife as much as possible so if the shots are bad you'll find out quick.

ufymich
my hunting grounds are worse than that, coastal swamp so thick it takes an hour to chop 100 meters. but i still find the patches of open ground to run my boy on. it's good that you keep up w/ the other dogs you've produced to help guide the breeding, but i personally feel that it's the breeding stock that needs to be worked the hardest. i appreciate the offer but i have no interest in a pure tazi type dog at this time. my next sighthounds will be whippet, stag, & coldblood grey (will consider a rustic hotblood).
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  #34  
Old 07-12-2009, 10:33 PM
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FoxyWench FoxyWench is offline
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pops...not sure where your getting your stats from on wild canid birth and mortality rates...
because mine are form the usda directly, im a vector species, canid specialist rehabber, (primary focus on coyotes and foxes, though i have handled wolves (and been lucky enough to work with both sub species of hyena, african wild dog, and many more)

Zoom, unfortunatly the absolute BIGGEST threat to wild canid litters is actually FLEAS! followed closely by tick and mosquitoe born illnesses and internal parisites.
Predators are also a risk to young litters...
nutrition and vacination issues are actully not that high on the list, parvo isnt common in wild canine litters in the northeast at least...and distemper is, while more common than parvo, still not the most common cause of death.

kind of sad realy that a tiny little parisite like fleas can whipe out an entire litter in less than a week...though west nile is also becomming a frequent cause of mass litter death in this area.
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  #35  
Old 07-13-2009, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
IMO if you breed an animal YOU are responsible for that animal
Especially if YOU are making money off of it.

To be blunt, it sounds like a breeder is trying to minimize care and expenses in order to maximize profits.

I wouldn't buy a pup even with someone else's money.
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  #36  
Old 07-13-2009, 01:53 PM
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FoxyWench FoxyWench is offline
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im with you mik on this one...
$700 for a dog with no veterinary history form parents with no health testing? i want to know what that money is covering?! unless each pup is eating $700 worth of food in 8-10 weeks?
cause vacines doen by the breeder (even when from a high quality source work out super cheap)
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  #37  
Old 07-13-2009, 04:45 PM
babymomma babymomma is offline
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Not only that foxy, but with a breederr that is in it for the money, they will probably be sold at 4-5 weeks. Barely weaned, so they wont eat much in the way of food.
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  #38  
Old 07-13-2009, 05:14 PM
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Jumping to conclusions much?
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  #39  
Old 07-13-2009, 05:24 PM
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sillysally sillysally is offline
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It seems that with hunting/working lines with *some* breeds not health testing seems to be common. Many of the "working" coon hound/cur breeders in this area don't health test. They breed healthy, skilled hunting dogs to other healthy, skilled hunting dogs.
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  #40  
Old 07-13-2009, 05:41 PM
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LauraLeigh LauraLeigh is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post
It seems that with hunting/working lines with *some* breeds not health testing seems to be common. Many of the "working" coon hound/cur breeders in this area don't health test. They breed healthy, skilled hunting dogs to other healthy, skilled hunting dogs.
This is what we did in NS when we were working hounds, working to working, esp. if Jack's male had an awesome bay, but was too fast, and Jill's female was a tad slow, and had too soft a bay.... They'd be bred.

We never tested for genetic issues, had never even heard of it.... and most of these hounds lives to a ripe old age... Jeff's Lady was 19...

I am intrigued by this thread and hope the OP sticks, I find the methods and reasons interesting, and would love to learn more. I also believe that the *need* to be inside a home is a human one... I have owned 2 working dogs who HATED the house, and would pace and pant when inside and both were raised in a house.

I am not about to say that what you charge for a pup should be soley based on what you spend.... There are breeders out there selling Papered Chi's for multiple thousands of dollars, hard to justify that.... I personally would never charge more for a pup than I'd be comfy paying myself... even if it was at a loss... I have talked with countless JQ public dog lovers, and when we got around to breeding and pups many, many say they simply cannot justify thousands for a companion pet, and right or wrong thats what drives many to byb....
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