Husk/Wolf mix

Tabby323

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#1
I just bought a husky wolf mix, I was told the mother was 98% hybrid wolf and 2% Malmute and that the father was 50% hybrid and 50% husky. I've read and heard many comflicted stories about hybrid. Some say their loyal and good pets other say their dangerous and nobody should have them. Now that i've got it my mom has been reading these things and wants to sell it before it gets to old. I havne't seen any aggressive behavior, but then again she's only 6 wks.
If anyone has any inoformation, i would appriciate it.
 

Debi

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#2
When I got Addie, the people said her mom was a wolf/husky. Maybe that's true.......but I think they said that cause they thought it sounded impressive or something. They had no idea who the father was. (Addie was the runt of the litter and doomed....so I scooped her up immediately) All I can say is....little Addie doesn't look or act 'wolfy' to me. She is so sweet, her idea of aggressive behavior is to lick you too much. Maybe your folks told you the 'wolf' part for the same reason.....some people think that sounds so cool. I'd give your pup a chance. Just my opinion here....but you can read good and bad about all breeds.
 
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#3
First, stop and do the math. 98% hybrid would mean that the dog is 98% MIX - not full wolf. The same goes for the 50% hybrid/50% husky.

Now, to take that further. For the so-called breeder to know these percentages, he (or she) would have to have a detailed pedigree tracking the various crosses back to the original breeding where the first wolf was crossed with the first dog. Ask for it. You paid for the pup; you're entitled to it. It's not like a pedigreed animal where you pay a different price for getting a dog with registration papers.

I leave you to your own conclusions as to how dependable this person's information is, especially since they sold the puppy to you at the too-early age of 6 weeks.

My Bimmer's got a small percentage of wolf; I had my suspicions because I know the area he is from, and after I had him awhile and he got older, my suspicions were confirmed by some of his physical traits, character traits and actions. He's also one of the most loving, loyal and dependable dogs I've ever been honored to share my life with, and he definitely needs every one of his "wolf-y" traits to keep the upper hand with Shiva and Kharma!

I'd encourage you to socialize your puppy with other people and animals, starting at an early age. You'll be glad and your dog will be better adjusted no matter what her genetics. You'll also be able to see how she reacts and be able to come to a better conclusion. One of the tell-tale things about Bimmer was that he was very reluctant to enter a strange building. To this day he's not terribly thrilled about walking into strange buildings - even the dog food store.
 

scout1

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#4
tabby
on yahoo their is a chat list called wolfdogzchat. there are a huge amount of people on there that are owners of northern breeds, wolfdogs and some of the people from the org.'s such as wolfpark are members. they are honest people and will guide you through the trials and tribulations of wolfdog ownership. there is much you need to know especially since you do not know the exact content of your pup. as for getting her at 6 weeks it is generally agreed upon that a mid to high content wolfdog or pure wolf pup should be taken away from its mother at an early age of 4 weeks so it can imprint on the humans who will be caring for it. there are dozens of wolfdog email lists but this has been the most knowledgable group of people i have found. good luck with her.
 
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#5
And how many times did we gripe and complain and say we'd never use that algebra they made us take in school, Serena?

Your math looks reasonable to me, and I'm too lazy right now to give myself brain strain formulating an equation to figure it out on my own.

The whole thing is very hazy, though, and the breeder should be willing to supply a genealogy to prove the percentage claims. A look at the parents should answer some questions as well. The breeder should also be able to tell you exactly what KIND of wolf breeds (timber, red, gray, etc.) have been used.

The main trick with a wolf/dog with a reasonable mix is to socialize well and early and maintain your position as the dominant member of the pack from an early age. It shouldn't be as difficult with a female pup as with a male, but it's just as important. It's also a good idea not to tell people that the dog's a wolf mix. It just opens you up for all sorts of hassles. I'm very careful about who knows it about Bimmer. Some do figure it out, of course, especially when they get a load of his teeth.
 
F

FaceZ Of DeaTh

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#6
why would you get a wolf hybrid they are horrible pets they are almost wild animals. You shouldn't get them its stupid. They can be agressive and wander away from your house.
 

RD

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#7
Facez of Death - Any dog can be aggressive and wander away. :rolleyes:

Wolf dogs require a lot of work, and they're definitely not for an ameteur owner. Ones with a very high percentage of wolf are actually still fairly wild, although they usually tolerate humans.

Also, most wolf-dogs with a high percentage of wolf (40% or more wolf) in them usually do NOT mix well with dogs or small animals. They can be unpredictable and jump quickly back and forth from wolf behavior to dog behavior.

They are loyal, but NOT good pets. In fact, I wouldn't even call them pets.. if you can handle the emotional needs of a wolf dog, and prepare yourself for the challenges, you'll do just fine owning one. If you don't have 18 hours a day to devote to being with them and interacting with them, it might not be the dog you should have..
 

pitbulliest

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#9
I'm definately not blaming you..but why would you want to get a wolf in the first place? They should be running around in the forest somewhere...there are thousands of breeds of dogs that have been domesticated for centuries..the wolf is not one of them..its not even a dog..

I don't know..I'm really confused about why people would breed a husky/mal with a wild animal...just doesn't make sense...ahh well..I hope you do some good ol fashioned research and make up your mind for the poor dog's sake. Good Luck.
 

Seijun

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#10
wolfdogs

First of all, I doubt your pup had a 90+% parent. Wolfdogs that high only go into heat once a year and they have pups in April to early May.

They can be unpredictable and jump quickly back and forth from wolf behavior to dog behavior.
This statement is ridiculous. All the behaviors found in wolves can be found in some dogs. Saying a wolfdog switches back and forth from dog to wolf behavior is like saying a beagle/bird dog mix will constantly switch back and forth from wanting to hunt rabbits to wanting to hunt birds. Wolfdogs are not unpredictable unless poorly bred. Their behaviors can be so intense though that owners won't know how to predict them. This is a human problem though, not the wolfdog's problem.

~Seij
 
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#11
Seijun, I agree with you on the face of the statement. But (there's always one, isn't there?) I can understand where the mis-perception comes from. (Yeeesh, I had to end that sentence with a preposition!)

I've observed Bimmer, who carries a percentage of wolf-blood, and sometimes he switches gears, for lack of a better way to describe it. When he's hunting and when he's guarding - especially on a couple of occasions when the threat to me was very real - you can see the domestic dog disappear into the background. He's still one of the most stable, affectionate, responsible, trustworthy creatures I've ever been honored to live my life with, and is still utterly trustworthy, responsible and stable when he's in 'wolf gear.' It's a subtle difference, but someone not very attuned to subtleties really doesn't need a dog with wolf blood.

The really unique and wonderful thing is that the German Shepherd part of him is still a herd dog par excellence, and he's incredibly gentle with the new calves; so much so that the cows don't even worry when he's nearby.
 

Seijun

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Yes, there is always the exception, especially since wolfdogs are just mixes. However, certain behaviors like guarding or prey drive I do not consider a switch to wolf behavior. They are natural behaviors that can be found in many domestic dogs, and prey drive and guarding are behaviors which are supposed to be able to switch on and off. But they do not do it randomly or without warning, they are behaviors which *usually* have triggers. A dog with high prey drive who likes to hunt rabbits will ALWAYS hunt rabbits. It won't be playing gently with a rabbit one minute, and then the next its "wolf prey drive" kicks in and it decides to kill and eat the rabbit. My friend's bird dog pup for instance-she can be playing around, acting totaly unconcerned with the world around her, then when she sees a pigeon, her whole body freezes and suddenly she has blocked out everything else around her. The second she sees that bird, her prey drive kicks in.

~Seij
 
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#13
It's not a change in action, it's a change in attitude. It's very difficult to explain; as I said, it's subtle. When someone pulled up in front of my house, thinking no one was at home, to break in and load up his empty cargo van, Bimmer (and, strangely, I also) knew what was happening as soon as the van pulled up to the curb. I've had dogs protect me before, and do a perfect job of it, but Bimmer's attitude changed completely. It's really impossible to describe, but it was an explosion; I've never seen a domestic animal display that level of ferocity - not even my Filas. And I've never heard that particular sound come out of a dog before, either. There's very little doubt in my mind what the outcome would have been had this person actually tried to enter the house. I've also never seen anyone clear out so quickly! That van laid rubber trying to get out fast. (rofl).

When he hunts, it's not like any of my other dogs. Although he's taught Shiva and Kharma to hunt, even they don't kill with his efficiency and obvious method. There are no histrionics; it's just catch, suffocate, drag into some sort of shelter, and eat. I've seen several big dogs catch and kill groundhogs, but never like Bimmer does.
These are creatures of nuance, and anyone who lives with one must be willing to be completely attuned to them, heart and soul.
 

Seijun

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I understand what you are saying, I am just trying to point out that all of these actions have triggers, they do not randomly surface as many people believe.

Brimmer's hunting method is not unique to wolfdogs, I have seen the same 'efficiancy' in a chow chow once before. Granted, most dogs who hunt will not eat their kill, and will not kill in the same method as wolves and some wolfdogs, however, like as always, there are always exceptions.

~Seij
 
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#15
I think you're saying precisely the same thing I did on another thread; dogs always have a reason for what they do; we may not understand the reason, but it's there.

Sometimes I think their reasons and actions make much more sense to me than humans'!
 

seaecho

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#16
After working as a vet tech for 12 years, I've seen plenty of wolf hybrids offered for sale as pets. Trust me, it doesn't work. Wolves are NOT domesticated, and should not be in a family type of situation. They are wild animals, and even if they are mixed with a breed of dog, CANNOT and SHOULD NOT ever be trusted. They can turn on you in a split second if they question your dominance in the least. I've heard all kinds of stories from clients who tried and failed to make pets out of them. Some of the stories were really scary. Some told me that if you are sick, the wolf will try to take advantage of you. Remember the rule - Survival of the fittest? Well, wolves are still primitive in that way. Personally, I wouldn't chance it.
 

Seijun

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*sigh* Key word there... "Stories". I have been studying wolfdogs for only 2.5 years, and in that time I have learned much, much more than most people know about them. My teachers and mentors were/are people who have worked over 10 or 20 years with wolfdogs, one spent many years working at Wolf Park and actually helping to raise many of the wolves they have. It is estimated that 90% of the wolfdogs sold in this country are sold as being higher in wolf content than they actually are. In my experience, I would say at least 70% of those sold have NO wolf in them at all. Many of the so called "attack stories" involved dogs mislabeled as wolfdogs (although there is no doubt that wolfdogs have killed and/or attacked humans-it is this way with all types of dogs). The following is an explanation into the nature of wolves and wolfdogs in regards to challenging for dominance. This information is not merely “stories”, it is information I have learned from L. David Mech’s (one of this countrie’s leading wolf biologists) books on wolf behavior, and my contact with those who have worked for many years will both wolves and wolfdogs.

Wolves are not domesticated, but wolfdogs are not wolves. Many do not make good "pets" for the average person, but you have to remember, they are MIXES. There are some wolfdogs that DO make good pets, mostly because they don't have a lot of wolf in them. Low content wolfdogs are often no different that Siberian Huskies in temperament and needs (although even to a beginning dog owner, huskies can be difficult to care for). It is a myth that "they will turn on you". No, a wolfdog will never (or shouldn't) "turn on you." Like all dogs, some are more dominant in personality than others. High content wolfdogs DO sometimes get what is called Winter Wolf Syndrome (WWS). This is a condition when, during the winter, the wolfdog may become more aggressive and may challenge for dominance among the pack members. HOWEVER, a wolfdog will rarely outright challenge the alpha human owner, unless the owner had a VERY unstable alpha position staked out to begin with (an owner of a high content who does not understand canine language and who does not know how to properly handle WWS WILL increase the likely hood of their being challenged). No owner who has themselves firmly established as alpha should ever have to fear that their wolfdog might challenge for dominance unless they have a wolfdog with a particularly alpha personality (with some wolfdogs, you have to REALLY be able to understand canine language in order to properly establish your alpha position). Even in the wild, wolves with WWS will rarely challenge the alpha. Mostly, they will challenge members closer to their own status. Wolves don't like to fight, and usually avoid it if possible. A battle with the alpha could turn deadly or result in serious injury-this is something a wolf pack cannot afford. I personally, have only known of ONE wolfdog (actually, it was a wolf) who outright attacked the owner for dominance. This particular animal came from a very aggressive/dominant line though.

Some told me that if you are sick, the wolf will try to take advantage of you.
This is yet another myth stemming from human ignorance. Of all the wolf/wolfdog owners I have ever met (and I have met a LOT), none has EVER been attacked or challenged when sick. A wolf or wolfdog will only try to take advantage of you if it has a very pushy/alpha personality and it feels you are laxing in your role as alpha. Whether you are sick or not will not affect your role as alpha unless you let it. And if you're THAT sick, you should probably be in the hospital. In the wild, sick or old alphas are sometimes challenged by other wolves. This is NOT just because they are sick or old though. It is because they are so sick and/or old that they can no longer fulfill their role as alpha (i.e.-eating first, disciplining misbehaving wolves, holding the pack together in general, etc). Also, as a general rule, an alpha will not be challenged the moment they get sick or start showing age. It may be weeks or even months before a younger wolf strikes up the courage to challenge the alpha. Even then, it will not be just one challenge. Several challenges by the younger wolf will occur before it finally succeeds in taking the alpha role (mostly because wolves may have to try challenging several times before they become brave enough to actually go and “take” the alpha role). But remember, it is very uncommon for an alpha wolf to loose its position due to outright challenges. (In the wild, few wolves reach old age, hence the rarity of challenges by younger wolves towards old alphas. In captivity, wolves live much longer and the alpha most likely WILL live to old age, making challenges by younger wolves quite frequent when the alpha becomes too old to fulfill the alpha role).

I, personally, would trust a wolfdog over a dog. I find they are more predictable than dogs (if you know what to look for). I have been living with a wolfdog for sometime now. She is a bit pushy, so I have to always remember to keep up my alpha role. For a while I had trouble establishing my alpha position, but I think I have that mostly worked out now, although she does still have a problem with food/possession aggression. Now that I have gotten a firmer grip on my position as alpha, I have noticed several changes in her behavior. She is much more submissive, more willing to accept discipline, and overall, a lot easier to work with. Still, she is a LOT more than what most people could handle (today she decided she was bored and she tried stealing a bunch of rocks from my rock collection, breaking one, then trying to eat up the outside furniture when I took the rocks away). Don't get me wrong, wolfdogs are NOT right for everyone, few people could properly care for a wolfdog with a lot of wolf content. Low contents, although more like huskies than anything else, are still quite difficult for most 'average' dog owners to handle (this is not because they are part wolf, it is because they may have a lot of malamute or husky in them-dogs that are wonderful escape artists, who are destructive indoors, who don't like listening to commands, and who run away a lot if given the chance. This is something few people could handle). However, when owning a wolfdog, their "turning on you" would most likely be the least of your worries ;)

~Seij
 
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#18
Thank you, Seij, for that post. It's a real boon to have someone with real experience rebut yet another unfounded opinion.

My Bimmer's an exemplary companion; he has my complete love, trust and respect at all times, as I have his. What more is there?

I'll bet that was funny, albeit frustrating, to watch your dog stealing your rocks. They get focused on some strange things sometimes. My Mom's Rat Terrier, Katie, collects rocks in the backyard, then precisely arranges them around the perimeter of the deck - Katie-Henge. (lol)
 

Seijun

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Well, I actually don't have that much personal experience, most of my info came from either people who HAVE had a lot of experience, or it came from Mech's books (or the books of other wolf biologists).

I'll bet that was funny, albeit frustrating, to watch your dog stealing your rocks. They get focused on some strange things sometimes.
Yeah, :D She does stuff like that all the time. Mostly, she just gets focused on destroying something, like trees, toys, or cloth. The other day she jumped up on top of the mailbox stand (you know, that bench thing that can hold 8 mailboxes in a row) and she began ripping up someone's newspaper. I took those away and then I could tell she was thinking about going for the mailbox flags instead. Other times when she is frustrated, she feels she HAS to destroy something, it seems to be her way of letting off steam. Luckily at times like this, she usually is satisfied with just a branch or log. Last week she became intent on getting into a Sprite can, she went and ripped off the base of the METAL can with her teeth, it looked like someone had tried to put the can through a paper shredder. Yes, for anyone wanting a wolfdog, these guys DO like to be destructive! :p
 
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#20
The difference is you chose to learn from your experience, however long it is; that makes a huge difference. It's the Quality of the experience. And you chose knowledgeable teachers and have done real research.

Your girl sounds like she's a kindred spirit with my Shiva. I've blamed Charley; if he hadn't named her Shiva (after the Great Destroyer) . . . She's calmed down some as she's begun to grow up, but sometimes the sheer exuberance and joie de vivre Shiva has, in a dog her size, is enough to wreak havoc. :eek:
 

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