Calling all Agility Addicts!!

[adojrts]

What are you training and/or trialing goals (long and short term) for this winter??
Mine (if other issues don't interfere) is to finish Petie's Masters Titles (he is only a couple of Q's away) He is also only 1 Q away from his Steeplechase Title (10 are required we have 9). Improving lateral skills and distance skills along with obstacle discrimation.
I have a few goals for my pup, contacts, weave entry, tugging, control games and just the regular flat foundation skills. By late winter or early spring she should be ready for the equipment.

What are your goals?

Lynn

[milos_mommy]

By late winter/early spring, i'd love for Milo to be able to work off leash around people and other dogs safely. i don't know if it's going to happen, and i don't really have the resources to train him, but it'd be really nice if i could make it happen.

[adojrts]

Milo
Is it possible for you to take some Rally-O classes? With all the PR and working near other dogs, you could have success, without him getting over stimulated by dogs doing agility.........

Lynn

[milos_mommy]

Milo
Is it possible for you to take some Rally-O classes? With all the PR and working near other dogs, you could have success, without him getting over stimulated by dogs doing agility.........

Lynn

i think that would be a great idea, but i can't find any rally-o classes or groups in my area. i should keep searching...

[BostonBanker]

After a frustrating two weeks, I'd say my long term goal is to not just give up:(. I'm kind of thinking that contacts are just never going to happen for us. A million reps a week for the past few months, and there is hardly a change. I had been planning a mid-February CPE trial to test them out in the "real world", but I don't think we'll be ready.

My goals had been to finish up our level one CPE title during the winter/early spring (We still need two more Q's, thanks to the whole jumping contacts issue), then focus on USDAA trials for the summer and working on our P1 title (she has 3 Q's so far).

Eh. I don't know.

[AgilityPup]

Zoey's is to weave steady on on-side, and at least WEAVE off-side.
Along with getting into the bath tub, lol, and her down... Which sucks!

[MafiaPrincess]

Steady spot on weave entry. Now we're in advanced and masters everything. We weave consistently, but we often run by the weaves, call back and then she weaves properly, which now won't fly..

And Keep working nice targets on contacts. We have them in class, have them so well if I say excuse me she backs onto the frame and puts her nose down.. so.. she finally fully understands the behaviour.. we just don't always do it.. Never blow over contacts, but we have strived for a very specific one I'd like to retain and get even stronger on.

We don't have a defined next goal in agility. We have 2 team, 1 snooker, and 1 gamblers Q to an advanced games title. It isn't close enough for me to think about it yet..

We're 2 Qs to an advanced rally title.. I think it's more attainable right now, and I think the skill set needed will help our agility.

[MericoX]

With Kiba... training this winter will be focused on weave poles. Hopefully buying a set soon and putting it in the garage to practice on. Her handling is awesome.. though if she would stop refusing the Aframe when she feels likes it (every now and then she will). Long term goals need to work on her stamina and speed, her distance work is coming along good but still needs alot of work.

Stryder on the other hand, he's still scared of some of the obstacles. Need to get him over his fear of the weave poles and see saw. And get him used to jumping bars that are at his eye level.

Both working on keeping focused on me too.

[adojrts]

That's it?????? I know there are more folks on here that do agility!!

[Dekka]

LOL try to find the time and the $$ to get out there and do some?! Seriously I have no time this year with school, and no cash. And I really wanted to work on Dekka's contacts, and get Scandal going. Sigh.
Anyone wanna buy a pony?

[saffie]

Here is another agility addict.
I'm doing agility with Saffie, but we are still beginners. She knows how to take all the obstacles, but now we have to learn how to run a course. So my goal is to learn the handling.

With the dogdance I would really like to earn a promotion point.

[adojrts]

After a frustrating two weeks, I'd say my long term goal is to not just give up:(. I'm kind of thinking that contacts are just never going to happen for us. A million reps a week for the past few months, and there is hardly a change. I had been planning a mid-February CPE trial to test them out in the "real world", but I don't think we'll be ready.

My goals had been to finish up our level one CPE title during the winter/early spring (We still need two more Q's, thanks to the whole jumping contacts issue), then focus on USDAA trials for the summer and working on our P1 title (she has 3 Q's so far).

Eh. I don't know.

BB, any chance, you get to any fun matches? And do they allow training in the ring at CPE? We are now allowed to in AAC, which is about bloody time!!

Where are things going wrong? Break it down, point by point and maybe we can help find that straw that is breaking the camels back??:D
Also are you videoing your training? If not, I recommend that you do, have that camera going in all training sessions. You maybe able to pin point the problem.
How did you first train the contacts, how did you run them when trialling and how are you training them now?

Good luck
Lynn

[BostonBanker]

BB, any chance, you get to any fun matches? And do they allow training in the ring at CPE? We are now allowed to in AAC, which is about bloody time!!

Where are things going wrong? Break it down, point by point and maybe we can help find that straw that is breaking the camels back??
Also are you videoing your training? If not, I recommend that you do, have that camera going in all training sessions. You maybe able to pin point the problem.
How did you first train the contacts, how did you run them when trialling and how are you training them now?


I've never been to a fun match, and don't know of any in the area. Our agility club does public demos sometimes (although we are well past the season for that) where you can use treats/toys in the ring, but they don't really allow any sort of "correction", including going back and re-doing the obstacle. No training in the ring for CPE.

Where are things going wrong? With me, and the fact that it took me too long to decide what my criteria are. I started by training a down on the contact, trying to lower her center of gravity and stop her momentum before she hit the ground (old, healed elbow injury that hasn't bothered her in over a year, but worries me). It worked fairly well at first, but once the a-frame got to full height, it got almost impossible for her to stop herself. She's pretty downhill, straight shouldered, heavy in front (picture an old style quarter horse).

So, I switched to running contacts. She was so slow and cautious about everything in life anyway, I thought it would be the easy way out. It worked fine for our first couple of trials - I don't think she ever missed a contact in training or in the ring. Then all our work on upping her drive and motivation kicked in, and suddenly it was easier to just launch over them (dog walk and a-frame, she still always hits the seesaw). We did two trials where she was consistently missing the contacts unless I really slowed her down, which I didn't want to do just when we got her going! So, we dropped out of the last two trials we were planning on for the fall, and made that our project.

New plan is 2o2o. Because I originally taught a foot contact for the down (mistake number 238), I was having a very hard time transferring her to a nose touch on a target. Instead, I'm using a cut up square of bathmat and using that as a foot target. My criteria is: both back feet on the equipment, both front feet on the target, and nose pointed straight ahead.

After a million reps on the plank, she's pretty solid there. She still doesn't always hold it until I've released her, but basically hits the criteria every time, even coming off a jump/after a rear cross/while I front cross/while I'm behind and sending her ahead. The holding until a release becomes an issue if I keep running past it, which is a new revelation I'm still working on.

The big issue is when we have the actual obstacles (we've been working with a really low a-frame in class) and speed. She's probably hitting 20% wonderfully, 10% close, and 70% just blasting over it. The 20% is generally when I am either with her or ahead of her and can stop at the end myself.

It's just been a really crappy couple of weeks, and I am pretty bummed about it. Right from the beginning of the re-training, my instructor said we should stick with this plan until Feb. before we re-evaluate and try something else if needed. I guess I just need to be patient and keep plugging along, although I certainly would love any ideas or thoughts you may have.

Actually, I have one question as well that I'd love your opinion on. Do you use contact trainers at all? I have very limited access to the real obstacles, and am wondering if using a CT would help with the transition from plank to full sized equipment. I've gotten varying opinions from other agility people (shocking, I know;)), and don't know what to think. With Christmas money and then tax refunds following close after, it may be an option.

Sorry that got so long! As I said, I've just been frustrated and am eager for other ideas!

[adojrts]

BB, no worries about it being too long, the more info the better.
Before I give an opinion I have a question or two first.
Dont feel bad, we have all done it, changed our criteria or didn't narrow it down enough, so you are in good company.
How long have you been retraining the contacts?
How are you planning on fading the mat target? And in class when she doesn't do the contact behaviour, what happens? What do you do?

Ok, more questions......on the contact board, can you move in any direction? Can you run past her and have her hold it??
Will she hold it with huge distractions?? food, other dogs running past, people yelling and clapping?
Have you backchained the Frame and DW, before adding more obstacles and speed?

As for your question about CT, I use a contact board, plus I use stairs and a clear target. Luckily I don't need a CT, since I have all the equipment. But having said that, I recommend that my students use stairs and a contact board at home. I too have heard mixed opinions on the CT.
Take care
Lynn

[Speed]

We still have some teeter and weave pole work to do and Speed has gone from crazy dog to sometimes looking reluctant and running slowly. I think he's confused about his job at times and I need to work on handling.

When he seems reluctant, I start having 2nd thoughts about agility but he's only 18 mos old and I'm a green handler. When I adopted him at 7 mos old he couldn't even go up and down stairs. I have to remind myself about how much he and I have learned in 1 year. And then I need to think about how much we'll know in 3-5 years!

I want to attend another Bud Houston camp in the Spring and would love to trial in 2008.

Lois

[PAWZ]

Since I had to retire my aussie due to vision problems I am not trialing at this point in time, but my baby will start agility kindergarten tomorrow night YAY! I plan on working contacts with a hit it board using eventually a 2o2o with quick release graduating to a running contact over the period of a year or so of training. Im also going to work on weave pole entrances, directionals, wraps and so forth. I dont plan on bringing him out until he's 2 1/2 at least so there's plenty of time for training

[Dasher's Mom]

Hmm...lets see, I actually have a few goals for the season/winter.

Dasher - I would like to get 2 Grand Prix Q's this season. We already have 2 Steeplechase Q's for this season so we are in the quarter-finals at the USDAA Nationals for 2008 (yay!!) :D But I would like to compete in the Grand Prix at the Nationals as well. I would also like to Qualify for the Nationals in the team competition. We have a team trial in Dec. (fingers crossed) Not too worried about how we will do at the Nationals as Dasher is only 3, but I would like to go to get one under our belt. I am also taking a couple of seminars this winter. I hope to really work on our Gambles. I thought we had pretty good distance work but we keep missing the Gambles, mainly because my sends aren't smooth so we get refusals at the Masters level. Getting better at our Gambles is probably my biggest goal for the winter with Dasher.

Zip - With Zip, since we are just starting out, I just want to progress with his training. Hopefully get him doing contact obstacles. (just doing the bottom portion at the moment). Also get him weaving. He is weaving with almost closed poles, but I have yet to close them all the way. Also taking a seminar with Zip this winter. We will be working on handling at the seminar. So thats another goal with Zip, getting him familiar with my cues and me getting familiar with his cues. ;) Hopefully he will be ready to trial in the spring, but really no rush there.

[BostonBanker]

How long have you been retraining the contacts?


My last trial was in early September, so it was a bit after that when we really started focusing on it. Mid/late September?

How are you planning on fading the mat target?

I've been slowly cutting it smaller and smaller, which was the actual plan. I've also pulled it away a few times while doing plank work; running 10x or so with the mat there, then picking it up and running once without it. That wasn't part of the plan, just me testing. No idea if it's a good thing or not, but she still hits the position just like she does with the mat. I've never done more than one rep in a row without it.

And in class when she doesn't do the contact behaviour, what happens? What do you do?


Usually "side load" her onto the bottom of the a-frame again, and do a couple of reps of that successfully before going back to the full obstacle.

on the contact board, can you move in any direction? Can you run past her and have her hold it??
Will she hold it with huge distractions?? food, other dogs running past, people yelling and clapping?


No, that was this week's revelation. I'd been working hard on being able to send her ahead of me or get lateral distance that I hadn't worked enough on her really holding it until the release. So that is on the list for practicing this week. I haven't really had many distractions where I've been practicing. I'm usually alone, so I guess I will have to make a point to start finding some distractions!

Have you backchained the Frame and DW, before adding more obstacles and speed?


She hasn't seen a dogwalk since we began re-training. We did probably 7 or 8 weeks of just planks (propped up on the table), both by itself or with jumps or tunnels at each end to get some more speed. Just the last few weeks, a very low a-frame (with the apex maybe knee height?) has replaced the plank.

[adojrts]

BB,
What I would do is start by switching targets to a mat that is clear and continue to cut it down as you have been (but I don't think the matt is the problem). Also removing the mat as you have been doing is also a good idea.
But I think the biggest issue, getting her to maintain the contact no matter what you do, as you have already found out. A small contact board (12 wide, 4 ft long, raised up on both ends and the middle by 4 inches) that you can train with at home and at the barn would work.
Are you using a clicker at this point? Or have you ever used a clicker for contacts?
I would backchain the frame, using a pause table on the side to help her jump onto the frame. I wouldn't add jumps and tunnels for added speed until she was 100% on holding the contact. Now having said that, you still want speed, you shouldn't need a tunnel or a jump for her to do the frame at speed. I would start (after the backchaining) by having her hold a stay, or by having someone restraining her for recalls to you over the lowered frame. Start by being close to the base until you can be faced in the same direction that she is traveling. The goal is for you to be at any angle, facing in any direction from the down contact and for her to perform the frame by running at speed to the contact and hold until released. At that point, you start by moving beside and laterally to the frame, progressing until you are beside her or laterally beside her. At this point she is sending to the frame. It is only then, when she can hold the contact from all those positions that I would start running with her. From all those handler positions, train her to hold the contact with you taking off straight ahead, sometimes releases her, sometimes comeback to her for huge rewards.
I know it sounds like a lot. I also didn't assume anything and only layed down every detail of how I would train it.
Ya know, the ramp of a horse trailer could make an awesome contact trainer......backchain it!! to the point you can send her through the side door or ramp to the back ramp, while you do all the jumping, running and lateral etc. Hell thats not a half bad idea!!!!! You could also to the opposite to when we load horses.........park the trailer where the ramp would be steeper :D

At any rate, once she can do all that (it wont take all that long), then start raising the frame, then add jumps and tunnels for that extra speed. Also at anytime, if she starts to hesitate, try not to prompt her by pointing or repeating your target cue, wait her out and then have a party.
That is what I would do, hope it helps in any way.

Take care
Lynn

[BostonBanker]

Any ideas and advice is always appreciated:), especially when it is as good as yours!

LOL We did the trailer ramp for quite a while last summer (when I was training the down)! I had never thought about it until someone else pointed out to me how handy it was. If I can ever dig the trailer out again after this storm, it may have to make another appearance.

With your contact board, you have the whole thing level 4" off the ground? I had been leaning my plank on various surfaces to make it a slant. Just wanted to confirm. That is certainly an easy thing to do, as the plank is now living full-time in the indoor for Meg's use.

Thank you so much for taking the time to type up your thoughts. As frustrated as I get at times, I really do want to get this issue solved, even if it does take all year!

[adojrts]

Any ideas and advice is always appreciated:), especially when it is as good as yours!

LOL We did the trailer ramp for quite a while last summer (when I was training the down)! I had never thought about it until someone else pointed out to me how handy it was. If I can ever dig the trailer out again after this storm, it may have to make another appearance.

With your contact board, you have the whole thing level 4" off the ground? I had been leaning my plank on various surfaces to make it a slant. Just wanted to confirm. That is certainly an easy thing to do, as the plank is now living full-time in the indoor for Meg's use.

Thank you so much for taking the time to type up your thoughts. As frustrated as I get at times, I really do want to get this issue solved, even if it does take all year!

Way to go, about using a trailer ramp. Sorry about all your snow, we have ice and lots of it right now.

The contact board is usually about 3- 4 ft long, 12 inches wide and raised up at both ends and supported in the middle by 4 inch blocks. It's easy to have in the house and to transport.

Your very welcome, I hope something in all that helps you in some way.
Don't get frustrated, it wont do Meg or you any good. I know you know this but I am going to say it anyways :D.
WE ALL MAKE MISTAKES, IT IS PART OF THE LEARNING CURVE.

Especially with our first agility dogs!! Agility is hard and its very challenging, it certainly isn't for someone who wants to train a little bit and go out and win. That doesn't happen. And I know you don't fall into that category.
I had one student, she has a very forgiving and had an over achiver type of dog. The dog was very talented and keen, the owner was very willynilly on training. Yeah they got through to earn their first Title and did it within 3 trials. Then the owner stopped training, a few months later she entered her wonderful dog in a trial. They got an E in every class, now that they were in Advanced they didn't have the skills needed to compete at that level. That was the last time they trialed. I would bet almost anything, that if that student had had any kind of issue, whether it be teeteritis, contacts whatever, they would never have made it to their first trial.
You will be fine, you have a bit of a bump in the road, you will get past it.

Good luck
Lynn

[Beanie]

Get all of the weave poles straight up, which we're pretty close to.
Also, blind crosses into the tunnel and the "out" command.
Maybe that's too much to expect, he's only two so he's still a baby dog... he's very velcro though, and it makes it really hard to do a lot of things. Probably won't be an issue in novice, but I don't know that I want to start trialing until we're actually... you know... READY to trial.

It would be nice if he'd give me a good contact on the a-frame, too. I'm honestly less worried about catching the contact and Qing, and more worried about him hopping off too early and hurting himself. Sigh.

[mrose_s]

ahh. by end of summer.

I'd like to work on his contacts mainly, and getting his weaves more reliable and then working on his offside weaves.

[Brandyb]

Whew ... my goals are a little more long term than winter. Brandy and I are trying to finish our Advanced title (AADC), one more Q, which is eluding us for some reason :) - LOL. I'm looking to perfect our weaves ... she was bang on at the last trial with two sets of 12 in the steeple chase (though we are just too slow for that game), she just seems to need refreshers just before a trial ... so we practice the week before at the arena, and the night before on my little set.
I'm aiming for our first CPE title as well - hopefully in spring when it starts up again, as well, I'd like to compete in the Canada Cup in the summer - see if we can beat our 4th place finish from last year (ok - that's a little far fetched, but I'd like to see how we do again).
Regionals ... well, I'm not sure what I'll be doing here yet ... I'll see where they're holding it first, then decide.
Over all, our goals are perfect the weaves (or as close to perfect as we can get), work on motivation (I've had to remove the ball and use a "less desirable" toy - she's crazy when it comes to the ball - but FAST on course, though a little uncontrolled when the balls around). And just have fun. She ran just wonderful at our last trial, attentive, quick, but not too fast, and accurate as heck - I was so proud, but no Q's (long story), and if she did that at every trial, I would be a happy girl. :D
I hope everyone reaches their goals, and has fun doing it - This is just such a great sport, and really helps the bond between owner and dog.

[adojrts]

Hi;
Regionals is in the same location as last year :( but they are being held in May somewhere around the 24th I believe. All the info in on AAC's website.

[Brandyb]

Oh really? :(
I was hoping that they'd be held somewhere else this year (though I couldn't find it on the site). I wasn't a fan of the "sand rings". At least its in May ... hopefully it won't be as bloody hot as last year.

[adojrts]

Oh really? :(
I was hoping that they'd be held somewhere else this year (though I couldn't find it on the site). I wasn't a fan of the "sand rings". At least its in May ... hopefully it won't be as bloody hot as last year.

I am pretty sure that is the time and location. I guess I may have seen it on the Barklist, which is the yahoo e-mail groug for the AAC.
Agreed, hopefully the weather is cooler and NOT wet, the footing last year wasn't great, but I would expect if it got soaked it would be worse.

[Bear Luv]

I think my long term goal for Honey Bear is just to fun a course lol. Like without being distracted. Paying attention to me the entire time, and not skipping any obstacles. I know for a long time to come she will blow her contacts, we are working on that. Thats another goal. As well as not giving up. We havent practiced in a long time, and I think thats because I am ready to give up. Goals are very important, and I think this thread is awesome, it really will help people realize what they want to accomplish.

Diane