Eek! non expected puppies! help please people!

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Last month we Adopted an abused Alsation gal,only to find out that she was 4 months pregnant!
Me and my boyfreind have no idea who the sire is.
All im asking is for some help and support with this,like where should i buy the whelping boxes,how i can tell she's in labour?
thanks for the help!

[adoptashelterpettoday]

Correct me if I am wrong but I believe dogs only stay pregnant for 2 months. So there is no way she could be 4 months pregnant.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Whoops!
i ment 4 weeks!
lol! sorry there! time isnt my strong point.
anyhoo,excusing the blunder,any advice?

[bubbatd]

There are many threads here to help you . Please read and if you question anything ...ask ! Good luck !

[Lizmo]

Agreed ^^^ Read the stickies in the this section. Lots of info there ;)

Talk to you vet a LOT about this, making sure you call him when she does go into labor so if you need a c-section FAST he's there for you.

Also once the pups are ready to go to there home make sure you check out places before you just dump a puppy their. Keep in contact with the new owners, want pictures...updates.

[Red_ACD_for_me]

I'm assuming it was a private adoption and not from a shelter cause otherwise she would be spayed already :confused: I would take her into be spayed ASAP and terminate the pregnancy. It is ALOT of work raising a litter of pups plus time and money.How old is she? What breed? I wish you luck though :)

[Spiritus]

Alsation = German Shepherd

Is she four weeks along NOW, or was she four weeks along when you got her a month ago?

If she's four weeks along now, talk to your vet and find out if it's too late to spay her. If it's too late (ie. would be detrimental to her health), then you need to get ready. Read the stickies in this section to learn more about whelping and raising puppies.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

I cant terminate the pregnancy,i am [B]very[B] against abortion,and of course i will spay her after.
she's 3.

[Lizmo]

How old is she again? I respect you for not aborting. IMO good choice ;)

[Spiritus]

I am against the aborting of human children, but with dogs it's different. Children are always wanted, if not by the woman carrying them, then by people who are unable to have children themselves. We don't drop children off at shelters to end up being put to sleep.

But since you are that against it, you have a very big responsibility both to the mom and to the pups. You have a lot of research to do about whelping and raising puppies, and you have to start looking for homes - SCREENING those homes, placing pups on spay/neuter contracts, or even better yet, finding a vet who will do early spay/neuter and having them altered before they leave for their new homes. Choosing to let your bitch have these puppies means that you are responsible for these puppies until the day they die. That could mean 15 years of responsibility....

[RedyreRottweilers]

I'm just curious how you found out she was in whelp?

[Red_ACD_for_me]

UM yeah! I'm also against abortion for humans but there is a BIG HUGE difference between humans and dogs ;) Dogs get put to sleep everyday because there aren't enough homes and the shelters are so over crowded. If you are ready for all the work ahead of you then good luck but I would terminate it, that's up to you :) Just think that this litter of pups is going to be taken away from all the other pups in shelters waiting for homes.........

Alsatian= GSD :o Never heard of them being called that before and I grew up with GSD's all my life! :p

[ChrissyR]

From someone who has just walked in your shoes (my bitch whelped about 4 weeks ago) I can say it is a ton of work, worry, vet visits, money and stress. I would have spay/aborted in a heartbeat if I could have. I couldn't because it would have comprimised Shortys health since she was too far along. To me, there is nothing wrong with spay/abort. When you think about all the unwanted shelter puppies/dogs and the ones running wild it's just not right to bring more into the world if you can prevent it.

I want to wish you luck on whatever you decide to do. Some questions you should think about is:
If you can't place the puppies, what are you going to do with them?
Are you going to alter them before they go or make a contract that says the new owners are responsible for that?
Are you willing to accept the pup back if it doesn't "fit" the new owners?
Just remember, those puppies are your responsibility until the day they die. Are you willing to go the extra mile?
Are you going to charge and adoption fee or just "free puppy" them?
Are you willing to visit the people who are intersted to see how they are, how they live, other animals?
Are you willing to have these people in your home so you can see how they interact with the puppy?

Good luck!

[~Jessie~]

UM yeah! I'm also against abortion for humans but there is a BIG HUGE difference between humans and dogs ;) Dogs get put to sleep everyday because there aren't enough homes and the shelters are so over crowded. If you are ready for all the work ahead of you then good luck but I would terminate it, that's up to you :) Just think that this litter of pups is going to be taken away from all the other pups in shelters waiting for homes.........

Alsatian= GSD :o Never heard of them being called that before and I grew up with GSD's all my life! :p

I completely agree. Children do not end up in shelters, and they are not put to sleep.

I would abort the litter as well... there are so many puppies out there in need of homes, and you do not know the background and history of the parents.

[MafiaPrincess]

People put too many human values onto dogs. It is the reason many people freak on line breeding, they see it as incestuous even when there are cases where it is of value. Often the same thing happens when discussing terminating pregnancy in animals.

They aren't human, and in many cases would have been a better solution if still viable.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Well in answer to your question RedyreRottweilers,she was looking a bit chubby and I took her to the vets to ask how she'd gotten so big so soon,if i should change food ect... and he told me she was expecting.
I might go and contact some family tomorow to see if they're interested,and my friends family are really keen on having one.

As for the abortion idea,thanks,but no thanks.If the puppies were ill or putting the moms health i'd abort the pregnancy ASAP but killing them before they'd had a chance to live just beacuse they're not perfect,im sorry but i just can't agree to that,no offence,but its just my opinion.Don't take it to heart,I don't want to start an argument.

If I can't find them homes I'll put them in guide dog and police dog training,they're always looking for dogs to train there.

[Lizmo]

I may have missed this, but you still have not told us how old and what breed she is :confused:

[Laurelin]

3 year old German Shepherd

[Lizmo]

Okay, thanks :)

[RedyreRottweilers]

Well in answer to your question RedyreRottweilers,she was looking a bit chubby and I took her to the vets to ask how she'd gotten so big so soon,if i should change food ect... and he told me she was expecting.

Well I sure would like a referral to this vet, since I don't know of ANY vet who could ascertain a bitch in whelp at 30 days/4 weeks except by ultrasound.

Working ability and temperament is inherited. Police departments and guide dog schools either import dogs already trained from strong working back grounds, or purchase dogs bred expressly for that purpose here in the US.

[~Jessie~]

Also, it is a big risk for a police department to spend tons of time and money on training a dog with an unknown background. Imagine if when that puppy turns 2, all sorts of health problems come out. There goes all of that time and money that went into training.

[Spiritus]

Well I sure would like a referral to this vet, since I don't know of ANY vet who could ascertain a bitch in whelp at 30 days/4 weeks except by ultrasound.

A vet that is experienced with palpation can feel the pups right around this time.

[MafiaPrincess]

You can't just give dogs to any group that does 'good' things with them. Great in theory, but you haven't thought this out. You've put too many human emotions into a pregnant dog.

I hope you have a grand or more put aside in case she needs an emergency c section, and that you are willing to keep an entire litter of puppies if you can't find them homes.

[adoptashelterpettoday]

You cant just go to the police training schools and say "here is a GSD". The dog has to fit a profile, they have to be very drivey, and most GSDs wont pass.

Same with service dogs except they have to have different qualities. Most dogs wont pass this either.

It would be like saying a sheep rancher will take any border collie. Not true, they have to fit the profile and most dont.

I wish you luck and PLEASE spay/neuter them BEFORE they leave for their new homes. INclude the price in the adoption fee. Spay/neuter contracts dont work all of the time.

[RedyreRottweilers]

A vet that is experienced with palpation can feel the pups right around this time.

Sure they can, but how many bitches have you seen that look pregnant when the time is right for palpation?

;)

[~Jessie~]

Not to mention the time off from work, whelping supplies, having a vet who you can count on for help 24 hours a day (a c-section at an emergency vet clinic can easily go from the $1,000-1,500 range). After that, there are the costs of vet visits for mom and pups, food... and being responsible for finding good forever homes for the puppies.

I know it's hard not to anthropomorphize animals... but humans and animals are completely different. I read somewhere that only 25% of all dogs are in their forever homes. Are you ready to take on the responsibility of bringing puppies into this world and assuring yourself that the homes they end up in are permanent ones?

I'm sorry to be so pessimistic, but we have an extreme overpopulation of dogs in this country.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

I have about 3,000 dollars in the building society for all these things mentioned,they were origianly going towards a Bracelet i liked,but this is more important,so money isn't a problem.
Also,how many puppies will an Alsation ussualy have?

I have about 3 homes,Myself,a close family freind,and my aunt wants one.
Amazing what you can do with a phone,isn't it?

[~Jessie~]

Amazing what you can do with a phone,isn't it?

Amazing how much food and vet care $3000 can buy for dogs in a shelter.

Sorry, I'm bitter. I just can't see bringing puppies from unknown backgrounds into this world when so many need homes.

[Red_ACD_for_me]

Jazzy Jessie, If you didn't know she was pregnant when you got her then I would love to know how you know that she is having "Purebred GSD"s :confused: She could be pregnant by a lab for all you know............

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

I dont work,so thats not a prob,and also I know there is an etreme over-population of doggies,why'd d'yo think i adopted her in the first place?
Didn't mean to sound rude there though,just having my two cents in,is all.
Apreciate the advice,keep it up! :)

[adoptashelterpettoday]

I'm sorry to be so pessimistic, but we have an extreme overpopulation of dogs in this country.

Especially GSDs. All you have to do is visit: http://www.germanshepherds.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=0&Board=UBB69
--urgent

non urgent/semi urgent: http://www.germanshepherds.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=0&Board=UBB6




They are ALL pure bred. Lots are puppies..I personally would abort the puppies too but different people think different things. If she is willing to take these puppies on for life, pay the vet expenses (which jeez i cant even imagine), take lots of time off work, be prepared for if mama rejects them or is aggressive toward them, be prepared if mama dies and puppies have to be bottle fed, be willing to clean up poop/pee constantly for 8-10 weeks, pay for all of them to be spayed/neutered, do home visits for each new family, check references for each family, and be prepared to keep ALL of the pups if not all get adopted, then more power to her.

I forgot about follow ups with each family as well, and be prepared to take back any of the puppies if one of the owners comes back 5 years later saying “hey I screwed this dog up, I don’t want it anymore”. A responsible person will take the dog back no matter what age, or no matter what problems the dog might have, even if they are caused by the person you adopted to (Because remember you chose this person to have one of your puppies). I couldn’t do it but maybe others can. In rescue, we abort puppies if we can. There is no sense bringing more unwanted puppies into this world..

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Jessie that sounded rather mean. :(
And red,you're right,I have no idea if the puppies will be purebred.
I didn't know I said that,i didn't mean to. :D

[adoptashelterpettoday]

If they are mixes you better plan on keeping all of them for a long, long, long time (5+ months). Shepherd mixes dont find homes very easily. And a Shepherd can have 10+ puppies.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

You're all right,What if the puppies are returned from thier homes 5 years later?
The truth? I haven't a clue!
Thing is,I'm terribly unexperienced and un-educated,but thats why I asked for help on here,to understand and be supported through this.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Thanks for the answer, Adoptashelterpettoday.
I think the puppies will be purebred,as when i adopted her They told me her history,she was abandoned in a home when the owner moved away with another two Gsd's, one male,I'm told.But who knows! Another dog might have gotten in and bred to her,for all the shelter knows.

[Red_ACD_for_me]

You're all right,What if the puppies are returned from thier homes 5 years later?
The truth? I haven't a clue!
Thing is,I'm terribly unexperienced and un-educated,but thats why I asked for help on here,to understand and be supported through this.
Luckily and hopefully EVERYONE stays nice in there posts to help you through this. I'm glad that you admitted to being unexperienced and uneducated and that is ALL the MORE REASON to abort the pregnancy...........

[Maxy24]

They need to be neutered before they leave and if at any point the owner no longer wants them then you must keep them. If you can't find them homes you need to keep them. The female must be put on HIGH QUALITY puppy food and after giving birth should go to the vet to make sure she has not retained any placentas or pups (they will most likely give a shot to make sure she expels what is left). You need to prepare for an emergency with replacement milk and hot water bottles/heating pads incase she rejects them. You need money incase she needs a c-section. Need a whelping box (can't help with that sorry, all I know is it should have a rail on the side so if the pup is against the wall the mom can't push against the wall and crush it). Be prepared for stillborns or pups that die soon after birth and even worse when the pup dies a few days or weeks later on you've gotten to know him. They could be born with defects and you may have to choose to euthanize. Then you must find a good home and give or sell the puppies no earlier than 8 weeks. Screen the homes and don't be hesitant to turn down an owner if you do not feel they are right for your puppies. If they have other dogs or children invite them over and have them all meet the puppy and make sure they get along. You'll need to begin their socialization process to ensure they are well adjusted, non aggressive dogs. You'll need to get them their first round of shots. You also risk loosing the mother during birth. If you cannot handle these things then PLEASE abort. I am not against human or animal abortion (as long as it is not used as a form or birth control in humans) and feel that if the bitch does not have to go through the birthing process then why make her, plus the expense and emotional aspects for you and the risk on your dogs life. Then there is the dog over population problem. Whether or not your pups go into a shelter or not there will be shelter dogs effected. If you give away 6 pups to six different families you are making it so those people do not go to a shelter and get six shelter dogs so that makes six more dead dogs that died for nothing. It is hard to think about but that is what you are facing. From the day these pups are born to the day they die they are your responsibility. If you send them home with a spay/neuter contract then you have the right to go to the owners (after the amount of time you specify on the contract that the dog must be fixed by) and if the dog is not fixed or at least have an appointment to be then you have the right to take the dog back. Reconsider the abort and if you really do not want to do it then understand what you are getting into and get to work on your research. As far as puppy care goes and preparation I can't be of too much help since I have never experience it before but other members have and can help in that area. I wish you luck!

[adoptashelterpettoday]

I would honestly suggest that you contact your local German shepherd rescue. Tell them your situation and ask them for support and guidance. They will help you out, but they WILL tell you to abort the puppies. Like I said, people in rescue abort puppies. It’s better then being responsible for 10+ puppies homes for their entire life. And yes, no matter what age you will be responsible for taking the puppies back, even if the previous owner has really screwed the puppy up and YOU will be forced to make the decision on whither the dog is salvageable or not. And you will also have to consider that these puppies might not find homes as soon as you expected. I know you are against abortion but, why bring unwanted puppies into this world? I know quite a few cases where rescuers screened homes extensively only to have the dogs brought back scared, dirty, and aggressive due to undersocialization. And yes some difficult decisions had to be made because no one can keep a dog like that, especially a rescuer who has limited resources.. The rescuers thought these families were WONDERFUL, but people lie and people can put on an act.

Seriously consider aborting the puppies, it isn’t immoral at all it is actually kind. Unless you keep all of them, you don’t know what life these babies face. And if you decide to allow her to deliver, please contact your local GSD rescue and tell them the story and ask for their help in placing them and again I can not stress enough MAKE SURE THESE BABIES ARE FIXED BEFORE LEAVING. I also know of many dogs who got adopted under spay contracts only to be returned to the rescue later pregnant. Spay/neuter contracts don’t work, the best way to make sure it gets done is to make sure it is done before they leave:) .

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Well,im sorry I just can't abort them,don't get mad,please.
However, all puppies will be nuetered and the mom will be spayed ASAP.
Once again thanks for the advice,We really aprreciate it. :)

[~Jessie~]

I dont work,so thats not a prob,and also I know there is an etreme over-population of doggies,why'd d'yo think i adopted her in the first place?
Didn't mean to sound rude there though,just having my two cents in,is all.
Apreciate the advice,keep it up! :)

Yes, that is great that you adopted a dog... but you're going to bring possibly 10+ more pups into this world by letting her keep this litter.

[Maxy24]

Well,im sorry I just can't abort them,don't get mad,please.
However, all puppies will be nuetered and the mom will be spayed ASAP.
Once again thanks for the advice,We really aprreciate it.


Ok just make sure she does not get spayed until she weans the pups. So is she four weeks now or was that a while ago? She needs to be on puppy food what do you have her on now? And then there is the matter of a whelping box which I hope others will help you with. There are a few threads that show pics of them so if you do a search then you might find them. You can make one or but one that needs to be assembled but like I said make sure it has a bar or soem sort of ledge/barrier on the inside so that the pups can go under it and when the mom leans against the all she won't crush them.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Well,She's on adult wet food at the moment,sometimes with a bit of meat mixed in.Do I start giving her puppy formula now?
I knew what a whelping box was previously,but ive no idea how to construct one,I'll leave that to the boyfriend :D.

[J's crew]

I don't have alot of time right now but after skim reading these post's I just wanted to let you know that not all rescue's recommend or have emergency spay's at 4 weeks into a pregnancy. I would never consider it myself, nor would many rescue's I know.

[Spiritus]

You can use a child's plastic pool for a whelping box. They're light, and easy to keep clean. You will need paper - lots and lots of paper. Whelping puppies is messy - lots of fluid. I go to my newspaper publisher and purchase roll-ends so I don't have to deal with the ink.

[Maxy24]

Well,She's on adult wet food at the moment,sometimes with a bit of meat mixed in.Do I start giving her puppy formula now?

Yes that would be best, it has more calories. She would have to be on it until she weans the pups. What brand do you feed or what brand will you feed if you switch to puppy food. There are lots of suggestions on food brands in the food section.

[ravennr]

You might be against abortion for animals, but the complications from a whelp can kill a mother. It happens more often than in humans, more problems can occur more rapidly without any notice.
Letting her have the litter is potentially killing her. And trust me, those puppies have no idea they are even real or living and she doesn't know they are either. Her changes in emotion are natural, not because she knows what's going on.
But if you're still against it no matter how much information is given, regardless of this dog's situation, then, I'm sorry you feel that way.

For the sake of the puppies and the mother, I hope this is an extremely small litter, and not the typical shepherd-sized litter they are notorious for having.

[IliamnasQuest]

Well, first of all - kudos to you for adopting this dog and for accepting this further responsibility.

While I, too, would encourage you to do a spay on her now it's pretty obvious that you won't do that. I do hope that the bitch doesn't run into problems during whelping. German shepherds can easily have 8-10 pups. If the bitch were to die during whelping, you will be stuck hand-raising these pups. I've done this, and it's HARD. We fed every two hours. It was not just a matter of feeding the pups .. then they had to be wiped to stimulate urination and defecation, then cleaned up and the box cleaned and all that. They had to be kept warm and dry. As they grew, the feedings spaced out a bit more but it got MUCH more messy. We were sleep-deprived for weeks. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone - and if you're working, it will definitely affect your work ability.

I really recommend that you do some google searches for "whelping puppies" or "dog pregnancy" as you can find some great articles explaining the entire procedure and what to do. I believe there's a post on building a whelping box at the top of this section, and I've found other articles online that describe various boxes. You need to stock up now on paper, towels, iodine, and various supplies. You can find more information on what you'll need with a search online.

You'll probably want to line up potential homes for at least 8 puppies. Keep in mind that many times people say "yes, I want one!" and then when the time comes they decide they can't take a pup. Finding responsible homes that can afford to take proper care of a puppy and who will make the dog part of their family and not just tie it outdoors can be tough too. Many people don't realize the commitment it takes with a shepherd. They need socialization and training and they shed 365 days a year. It's important that those who may want a puppy now understand that they're taking on a 12-14 year commitment.

Just one last thing about the abortion issue .. while I know that you are opposed to the concept, in all honesty it is more kind to the pups to not be born than to live a life of misery or a life being passed around. The majority of dogs do not find their "forever" home as pups. By making the choice to allow these pups to be born, you're accepting the responsibility for every bit of pain, discomfort, hunger, and sadness that these dogs will experience for the next 12-14 years. That's a huge responsibility. If you really think that you want to carry that burden (and the knowledge of that burden for the rest of your life) then allow these pups to be born with that full knowledge.

Good luck to you and good luck to the bitch -

Melanie and the gang in Alaska

[vanillasugar]

You're definatley in a tough situation, and please know that the members of this forum are very knowledgeable and very helpful, and will be here to support you whatever comes of this (though some advice may not be easy to hear).

I too have to side with the "spay her" option. Please hear my reason why. Your dog may potentially have 10 or so pups. That's 10 or so HOMES. Homes that will not go to puppies or dogs already living in shelters, waiting. Dogs and puppies that are at risk of being killed because those homes aren't available. So which dogs should be saved? Those who aren't born yet, or those who are already out there waiting?

Is it fair to bring these puppies into the world and kill dogs already here?

[bubbatd]

It hurt me terribly to abort a whelp once ............... but for the love of the breed and my female , I felt it best .

[happyhound]

I always find it weird when people try to anthropomorphize pets. I don't believe they form a lifetime bond with their young the second they are born (or in utero for that matter) like people. Your moral beliefs mean nothing to this dog.

I also think it is ludicrous to spend savings (assuming that is what a building society is) on a litter of mutts with no guaranteed future.

I guess you can look at it this way ... the pregnancy can be aborted now or their lives will be "aborted" at a shelter (after they have had a "chance to experience life" :rolleyes: and shelter $$ goes toward the dog).

[Cheetah]

Everyone has given great whelping etc. advice... The only thing I could add is that you could maybe write up a contract for all the prospective adopters. And screen the crap out of each person. Maybe write up a questionnaire When I wanted to buy Shippo, his breeder screened me like crazy (and I did the same to her) and we signed a contract saying that he will not be mistreated, he WILL be neutered, and that I'd return him to her if I couldn't keep him. If I breach the contract, she can sue my pants off... >^^;<

But it would help insure good homes for the pups. It's great that you plan on fixing them all. That will insure that the new owners can't breed them and add even more dogs to the world lol...

[RD]

Good GOD, people, ease up on her.

If I adopted a dog that was pregnant, i would not be able to abort the puppies. I'm sorry, I just don't see a need to terminate their lives if I can find homes for them. Yes, shelter dogs are going to die if people get these puppies in place of the shelter dogs. Shelter dogs also die when people adopt other shelter dogs or rescue dogs instead. Why is a shelter dog's life worth more than that of an unborn puppy? It has nothing to do with anthropomorphism, it has everything to do with not wanting to kill the puppies. It's a really crappy decision to have to make and I respect her decision either way.

And please don't show me photos of dogs in shelters. I know what's in shelters, I volunteer at one 5x/week.

I think at this point her choice has been made clear, why not focus our energy on helping Jazzy learn about whelping and raising puppies, as well as finding the right homes for them? Cheetah's idea of a contract is a great one.

[Sapphire-Light]

Good GOD, people, ease up on her.

If I adopted a dog that was pregnant, i would not be able to abort the puppies. I'm sorry, I just don't see a need to terminate their lives if I can find homes for them. Yes, shelter dogs are going to die if people get these puppies in place of the shelter dogs. Shelter dogs also die when people adopt other shelter dogs or rescue dogs instead. Why is a shelter dog's life worth more than that of an unborn puppy? It has nothing to do with anthropomorphism, it has everything to do with not wanting to kill the puppies. It's a really crappy decision to have to make and I respect her decision either way.

And please don't show me photos of dogs in shelters. I know what's in shelters, I volunteer at one 5x/week.

I think at this point her choice has been made clear, why not focus our energy on helping Jazzy learn about whelping and raising puppies, as well as finding the right homes for them? Cheetah's idea of a contract is a great one.


I agree whit you :D

The only way I could see on aborting puppies is if the mom is really sick or too weak and giving birth could risk her life.

For example many years ago one of my cousin had a pittbull (now the breed is baned here) and the bitch had 7 months old, and a malinois/ german shepperd mix got her pregnant.

But since she was reallly small and she still had a puppy body she died whit alll the puppies trying to give birth since the puppies where too big and many :(

I am against the aborting of human children, but with dogs it's different. Children are always wanted, if not by the woman carrying them, then by people who are unable to have children themselves. We don't drop children off at shelters to end up being put to sleep.

But since you are that against it, you have a very big responsibility both to the mom and to the pups. You have a lot of research to do about whelping and raising puppies, and you have to start looking for homes - SCREENING those homes, placing pups on spay/neuter contracts, or even better yet, finding a vet who will do early spay/neuter and having them altered before they leave for their new homes. Choosing to let your bitch have these puppies means that you are responsible for these puppies until the day they die. That could mean 15 years of responsibility....

I hate to say it, but living in a poor country this is not completly real.

You can easily see kids in the street droped by iresponsable parrents, and most of them do drugs whit a type of glue.

In the newspapers they are many news about idiot mothers killing the un-born child, or killing them afther they born.

This is the nasty and horrible facs.

But true is even if they put on adoption the kids are not killed.

[adojrts]

I tend to agree, the deed is done and her mind is made up, so excellent advice and support is what is needed.
Such a shame that the shelter that she adopted the dog from failed in the first place to spay before letting her go to a new home.

Take care
Lynn

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Thank you RD!
I was starting to wonder If I should of even asked for advice by the way the rest of you guys were slaughtering me there.Not to say you didn't give phenomenal advice,But just ease up a bit,mkay?
We are all aware of the shelter situation,but some people tend to be a bit harsh,which scare some people out of asking for help,which means the dog is in an even worse situation than it could have been if you were a tad nicer and supportive.
Im not trying to start an argument,just saying a few pointers there.

Anyway back to the puppies.
I've handed out a few flyers today saying for any keen adopters to ring or email us,1 reply so far,and I'll go round and view their home sometime next week.
8-10 puppies huh? Woah.Well,ive got 2 homes from close friends and family,and that guy I mentioned above,and I might keep 2 myself,If no-one sutible wants them.

[adoptashelterpettoday]

Be very cautious when looking for homes. Be sure to do a home visit (where you go to a person's house to make sure they don’t have tons of animals who aren’t taken care of, make sure their fence is secure, exc), make an application (I can send you an example of ours if you want). Screen very carefully. You want these dogs in a great home. Also, make SURE you get a vet reference. Call vet reference and make sure their animals have been well taken care of. I have denied many an application due to a poor vet reference. I think you also said that you were going to spay/neuter them before they left (which is great). I would suggest asking the adopters to put a deposit down on the pups before they are old enough, so you can pay the spay/neuter costs. Lots of rescues do this.

I again will suggest that you contact your local GSD rescue; they might be willing to list the dogs for you or allow you to attend adoption events with them when the pups are old enough. And go with your gut, if you don’t like someone but can’t figure out why not, don’t let them have a puppy! Gut feelings are usually right.

A contract is a must. Again, I have a copy of one if you would like to see how it is worded. It’s just saying if the dog doesn’t work out it will be returned to you.

I wasn’t being mean, or harsh-only realistic. It's a sad, sad world out there. I wish it was different but it’s not. But you have made up your mind, so just be really careful who gets the puppies & make sure you are 100% comfortable with the families..Dont be afraid to turn people down.

[Fruit bat]

[QUOTE=Spiritus;646790]t. Children are always wanted, if not by the woman carrying them, then by people who are unable to have children themselves. We don't drop children off at shelters to end up being put to sleep.


Think so ???? You should see the reports on Child Haven here in Las Vegas. It's exactly like the local shelter. There are three uninvestigated deaths That I have heard about.and there is finally enough public outcry to get something done. And orphananages have always been overcrowded and children suffer.


Any way good luck with your puppies. TRY NOT TO WORRY. Read up a little on what to watch for and most likely your dog will do fine.She will probably handle the rest.

[joce]

Be very carefull find ing the pups homes-I have been hearing about a lot of free and cheap dogs getting snatched up lately. Really makes me worry about were they are going seeing some of the articels on line I ahve lately.

[Sapphire-Light]

I found two links that could help you whit the puppies.

http://www.thepetcenter.com/gen/whelping.html
http://www.sharpeis.net/breeding.htm

When you are cleaning the puppies try to not over clean them, I heard that some female dogs don't reconise they puppies if most of the smell (comming from her in the puppies) is taken off. :( and they could refuse to accep them or can kill them.
Mostly if they are by cesaria.

[Saje]

Ok this person is obviously knew to dogs and doesn't have any experience with whelping. She is trying to do the right thing. She got the dog from a shelter. Not all shelters spay/neutered. My Mikey and Nanook had to be done after I got them and they were from a town shelter. That's a non-issue. She knows she needs to get her spayed after.

Obviously, she cares about her dog. But she has a lot to learn. The issue of aborting is a very personal one. Not even all regular chazzers agree. I do think it would probably be the best but if she's not willing why push it? Instead lets help her handle it from here on in.

Now what does she need to do next?

[mamasobuco]

The rescue I work with does not abort puppies. We take on the responsibility of keeping the pups healthy and finding them good homes when it is time.
Jazzy, you must do what feels right in your heart. You are taking on a HUGE responsibility and it sounds like you are ready and willing to follow through with it. I commend you for that. I wish you and your girl much luck and good health through the birth of these pups.

[Saje]

JJ I recommend you go to the breeding ground and search any threads started by Mach1Girl. Pay particular attention to posts by Redyre. Here's a start:

http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18675


http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18738

http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20037

[Saje]

It also might help if you post specific questions.

[Kase]

I'm sorry that I can't offer any advice about whelping ect but I do not have the experience. I just wanted to say good luck with it all and I hope you've found some of these posts helpful :).

[sparks19]

LOL@ there are always people that want kids even if the parents don't.... yeah that's why so many kids end up living in group homes (shelters if you will ;) ) until they are 18 and old enough to be kicked out on their butts. ther are lots of unwanted children in group homes... it's not really that different. They may not get put to sleep but since they don't have true guardians and guidance... many end up on drugs and living on the street when they get kicked out of the group home at 18.... and unfortunately that sometimes leads to death.

Anyway.... Good luck with your puppies and there is TONS of great advice on this forum. Especially in the stickies. read them carefully... and often.

[Saje]

I deal with adoption a lot Sparks and there are very long waiting lists for people wanting to adopt. Even older children. It's definitely harder but there are still plenty of parents who are out there. Especially after they've been on a waiting list for a decade or two. Seriously. I think it's more that the children aren't available for adoption or it's just too difficult. It's so sad really. So many good homes go without children and so many children suffer. :( The older they get the harder it is to adopt. Something should be done while they are still young and can be given the most chances.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Question,Should the whelping boxes bar be plastic or is metal okay?

[Maxy24]

look here it's a sticky by Redyre about whelping boxes. This is one she made and used PVC pipe for the bars around the edge:

http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20647&highlight=whelping+box

and I'm REALLY sorry if I was harsh at all, I didn't mean to be. Here we end up scaring away members a lot and It's kind of angering because they end up leaving when they really need help. I like that we are a passionate group and do like that we can debate but when it turns personal and people start to yell or argue without respecting the others it's very annoying. I hope we can all help you now that you have chosen to go through with the birth and raising of the puppies. I will do what I can to help, but like I've said I've never gone through this myself and am just going by what I've learned here. I'm very glad you sought advice here, this really is a very knowledgeable group of people!

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Thanks,I was a little confuzed.Hehe,My boyfreind Laim is going AWOL trying to make a whelping box,he's got glue in his hair and Cookie is playing fetch with the plastic pipes with Samson,Its quite a sight.
Ima go back and watch now :popcorn:

[Cheza]

I can't offer much advice other than to keep in close contact with your vet, but I wish you the best of luck!

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Aww thanks hun!
Puppy breath!

[otch1]

Hi Jazzy... my apologies if I'm repeating previous posts. Haven't read thru all. You have a litter due from an unaltered rescue and need delivery information, if I read correctly. Sounds like you're already working on the whelping box. Make sure there are no abrupt corners, as a puppy can be wedged into them without mom knowing. Have a second smaller box with heat lamps ready. If for any reason this is an unusually large litter and a puppy is rejected, you'll want to have formula, a bottle and size appropriate nipples from your vet or feed store incase you have to feed a pup. Also several heating pads. You'll want to get a box of surgical gloves in case you have to assist in any way or break open a sack that mom may neglect. Have your vet explain this to you and show you how it's done. Know how to cut an umbilical cord, as well, incase mom has trouble. You may also want to pick up a muzzle. If for any reason things go wrong during delivery, a puppy is stuck or mom's in distress, you may have great difficulty getting her into car for emergency vet trip. She will not be herself during this period. You need to be able to safely handler her if you get in trouble. You're going to want to give mom added nutrional support during nursing. They can drop a lot of weight and added kibble often isn't enough. Talk to your vet about appropriate feeding program. Learn how to check mom for any signs of mastitis. Look this up on line and talk to your vet. It can be very painful for her, toxic to the puppies and you'll need to know what to do immediatly as far as treating the mom and how to care for puppies, should this happen. Make sure you have all of your ducks in a row, so you give mom and pups the best chance of a successful, stressfree delivery.

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Thanks!
Should I make the box a dome structure,so there are no corners in which to crush the pups?

[bubbatd]

I imagine somewhere you've read about the book " How To Raise A Puppy You Can Live With " ...Rutherford and Neil . It was my puppy whelping and raising bible . Good luck !!! We're here for you !

[bubbatd]

The pipes protect the pups .

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

Hmm, the book may be within my bookcase somewhat.^.^

Also, If more than one puppy was to be rejected(god forbid) Could I feed more than one puppy together,by taping two specialized puppy bottles that you mentioned earlier together?
It would make bottle feeding time more easier.

[bubbatd]

Don't even think that way ......Mom will feed . !!

[*Jazzy~Jessie*]

lol!
Right! positive attitude right?

[otch1]

Yes... lol, just wanted to make sure you're prepared for any possible "glitch", so you get thru it smoothly. More than likely, all will go well and these will be supplies you can donate (unused) to an animal shelter when you're Shep is spayed and the pups are in good homes. Good luck.