Just wondering Labradoodle vs Purebreeds so to speak?

[doodleluvr]

I haven't ever really posted on this forum just for the fact of the things I've read just browsing. My husband and I are getting an Australian Labradoodle in October. We did alot of research on picking out a dog. Our son has allergies as do I. My husband absolutely didn't want a poodle he thinks there too girlie. But he was going to get me one until I found the cross breed lab and poodle the mutt most of you say. My question is what is the problem with it being a breed? I could turn around and say that half the breeds ya'll think are pure are infact mutts. For example Australian Cattle Dog AKA Blue Heeler is actually a cross breed and infact they breed it a few different times until they got the desired results. Ending result being a cross between I believe four different dogs Collie, Dingo (yes the farel dog in Australia) Dalmation and Kelpie don't quote me on that just trying to remember what I read. Bullenbeisser were the origins of boxers, so I guess my question is why would anyone bash any person for wanting a dog you may look at as a mutt? Is it that you think your better then the little kid who was so excited to get a labradoodle? IMO I think it's ya'll haven't done enough research to recognize that all dogs came from somewhere and all breeds at one time were made by humans crossbreeding to get the desired results. Just because your dog may have been considered a breed for 100's of years now doesn't make the Labradoodle a mutt. They do have a standard that they follow and they do have a Worldwide Club. So I think all that is left is to get the 300 dogs in 20 states that have been breed by the standards. I believe that is what I read makes the AKC recognize a Breed of dog. I also think most of you are looking at the backyard breeders that want to make a quick buck that don't follow the standards. Why are you looking just at the Labradoodles and not the other backyard breeders that could careless about the dog. Would you be more upset if someone got an Australian Labradoodle or a Pit bull pup that is only 5weeks old? I've seen tons of people that have gotten puppies from backyard breeders that are way to young to be away from their mothers. Basically what I'm getting at is ya'll should look at the aspect of someone loving a dog not what kind of dog it is, and if they ask you for help you would be adult enough to answer their question no matter if it's a mutt or a purebreed.

DoodleLuvr

[jess2416]

Read These........
http://www.chazhound.com/forums/search.php?searchid=229199

Edit to add: I have a mutt, but I sure wouldnt pay thousands of dollars for one...No one here hates doodles, most of us dislike the fact that there are already thousands of dogs just like these in shelters that need a good home, but people are making money off of them, when it is nothing but a mutt...

[Ash47]

The thing we have such a problem with is that people are still buying mixed breeds from breeders. There are so many mixed dogs in shelters. Soooo many. No one here has a problem with mixed breeds. I have 3. Almost everybody on here has a mixed dog. But, most of us did not buy them from "breeders."
We all also know that every purebred was once a "mutt." But, after many generations of breeding those crosses and finally coming up with a standard they were satisfied with, the original breeders began calling these dogs a breed. Labradoodle and all the other doodle names are just a marketing ploy. I don't know why people can not see why we just don't agree with the practices of most doodle breeders. Any by the way, anyone can make up a club name and say they are the "American Club of Labradoodles." It doesn't mean they are necessarily breeding for the right reasons or already have a standard. Every single doodle I have ever seen looks different. There is no set standard obviously.
Anyway, my stance on the issue is I will never buy a mixed breed from a so called breeder.

[zoe08]

First of all, congratulations on picking out a puppy and I am glad to hear you have done lots of research!

Everyone here gets just as upset over pet store puppies and BYB puppies as they do the 'designer' breeds, you just have to read the threads about those. It doesnt ALL get brought up in ONE thread.

Most people that breed 'designer' dogs such as a labradoodle, are usually BYB just out to make a bunch of money. So as long as the breeders you are buying your dog from have done health testing, etc, I don't think there will be as big of problem, I believe they are actually trying to make the Australian Labradoodle into a breed, but people that just have a lab and a poodle and think they will breed them and make some money arent those people.

Also you should know that getting a Labradoodle doesnt guarantee it won't get the coat of the lab instead of the poodle, and your son there eis a chance that your son or you could be allergic to it.

And poodles are actually not too 'girly'...you don't have to give them the floofy hair cut and they are good water retrievers I hear.

Hope that everything works out well for you and your new puppy!!

[doodleluvr]

I have read all those and that is why I choose to write that because most of ya'll don't say anything positive to anybody when they mention Labradoodle and I was just wondering why that is more on a straight answer then someone just bashing back. I wanted how would you say it...........mmmmmm an adult orientated answer of why it is the majority of you bash a person the instance the say doodle?

[fillyone]

I haven't ever really posted on this forum just for the fact of the things I've read just browsing. My husband and I are getting an Australian Labradoodle in October. We did alot of research on picking out a dog. Our son has allergies as do I....*Snip*....DoodleLuvr

What are you going to do if you or your son are allergic to the Labradoodle?
Many are not hypoallergenic.

[ihartgonzo]

It's good that you're doing your research :)

I have to warn you though, and hopefully you've thought of this, Labradoodles (unlike Australian Cattle Dogs & Boxers) are not a breed that is established nor does it breed true, it is a mixed breed. Therefore, you will be paying a LOT to import a puppy that could very well turn out highly or even just midlly allergenic! I don't bash the dogs, Labradoodles can be great dogs, but do understand that many of us are involved in rescue and ONLY accept breeding dogs, period, if it is to better the breed - since there are so many mixed breeds languishing in shelters.

My sister's MIL is also allergenic, and she's going to get a Portugese Water Dog from a wonderful breeder this summer. These dogs are very low-allergy, and much "sportier" looking compared to a Poodle. It's actually very difficult to tell a PWD or an Irish Water Spaniel from a Labradoodle... the real difference being that these 2 breeds produce consistent puppies with low-dander, while Labradoodles truly are a crap-shoot.

[Dobiegurl]

I have read all those and that is why I choose to write that because most of ya'll don't say anything positive to anybody when they mention Labradoodle and I was just wondering why that is more on a straight answer then someone just bashing back. I wanted how would you say it...........mmmmmm an adult orientated answer of why it is the majority of you bash a person the instance the say doodle?


Can you speak english please. I dont understand what the hell you just wrote.

[JennSLK]

Because 99% of the people breeding any doodle breed are breeding for the money. No health checks are done and they just pick any old dog to breed too.

People buy the because they think they are hypoalergenic. Some are but most arent. There are no garentees with genetics.

They were orgionally started as a service dog in Aus for those who had alergies. Thats all find and dandy and there are alot of GOOD doodle breeders in Aus. However there are very few good breeders in Canada and the US because most reconize the fact that people can be tricked into buying a cross bred puppy for $2000+ that 75% of the time will not turn out to be hypo alergenic.

I wuold also like to point out there is a world club for mixes as well.

Im my opinion there is to much difference in the dogs to be considered a breed. Yes they have a standard but because the majority of doodles are only F1 - F3 there hasn't been enough generations that breed true to a standard to be considered a breed.

Perhaps in many years when they breed true they ca/should become a breed but untill then they are a mutt plain and simple.

No one here has anything against mutt we just have everything against BYB and puppy mills, which is were the majority of doodles come from.

But then again thats just my 2 cents.

[JennSLK]

Because 99% of the people breeding any doodle breed are breeding for the money. No health checks are done and they just pick any old dog to breed too.

People buy the because they think they are hypoalergenic. Some are but most arent. There are no garentees with genetics.

They were orgionally started as a service dog in Aus for those who had alergies. Thats all find and dandy and there are alot of GOOD doodle breeders in Aus. However there are very few good breeders in Canada and the US because most reconize the fact that people can be tricked into buying a cross bred puppy for $2000+ that 75% of the time will not turn out to be hypo alergenic.

I wuold also like to point out there is a world club for mixes as well.

Im my opinion there is to much difference in the dogs to be considered a breed. Yes they have a standard but because the majority of doodles are only F1 - F3 there hasn't been enough generations that breed true to a standard to be considered a breed.

Perhaps in many years when they breed true they ca/should become a breed but untill then they are a mutt plain and simple.

No one here has anything against mutt we just have everything against BYB and puppy mills, which is were the majority of doodles come from.

But then again thats just my 2 cents.

[doodleluvr]

So as long as the breeders you are buying your dog from have done health testing, etc, I don't think there will be as big of problem, I believe they are actually trying to make the Australian Labradoodle into a breed, but people that just have a lab and a poodle and think they will breed them and make some money arent those people.

Our pups parents were breed over in Australia. He/she will have a health guarentee for 2yrs. Microchiped before pick up spayed/neutered....all the first shots. We also will be able to trace his family tree down to 30yrs ago to the actually poodle and lab he/she was first breed from. I erased the part on the quote on the no guarentee of non-sheding. Actually the Australian Labradoodle has three different coats and yes the one that actually shed like a lab has been pretty much breed out. The 2nd coat you get a blow out coat at 9 or so months of age turning from the puppy coat to their adult coat so you get one shed for their life. The 3rd coat which we are getting doesn't shed. I'm sure there are some posts I haven't read yet but your answer was the best answer so far. Thanks

[doodleluvr]

Can you speak english please. I dont understand what the hell you just wrote.

All I have to say to this is refer to the adult orientated answer I was looking for.

[Dobiegurl]

All I have to say to this is refer to the adult orientated answer I was looking for.

WHAT?? :confused: :confused: what adult oriented answer are you talking about? You are really confusing me.

[JennSLK]

As long as they are doing everything we would expect from a pure bred breeder and letting the people know there is no garentee they will be hypoalergenic like the poodle then fine. Also if they are actually trying for a standard. Im glad you did your research and got from a good breeder

Do they have a website by the way?

[blue]

DobieGurl must be having an off day doodleluvr. Usually she isnt this dense, she is a very smart young lady.

As long as third generation doodles are being bred and not a lab to poodle breeding I have no problem and have said so many times on this board. When the parents are a Lab and a Poodle the offspring are muts and the buyers better be wiling to gamble.

Welcome aboard.

[doodleluvr]

They were orgionally started as a service dog in Aus for those who had alergies. Thats all find and dandy and there are alot of GOOD doodle breeders in Aus. However there are very few good breeders in Canada and the US because most reconize the fact that people can be tricked into buying a cross bred puppy for $2000+ that 75% of the time will not turn out to be hypo alergenic.
You bring up a good point, people can be swayed into getting a backyard dog. BTW American doodles don't run that high they are around 800 give or take. Let's just say someone spends 2k on a dog honestly wouldn't that person do some research to make sure their getting what they payed for? There are at least 25 breeders in America not sure of how many in Canada that follow the Standards that were set for breeding.

[Dobiegurl]

I am not trying to be rude, but I am seriously confused.

[PoodleMommy]

Hey dont bash the poodle they arent too girly:p
Seeing as I love poodles I am a little biased....lol

I also dont understand why mixed breeds get such a bad rap, yes there are many many bad breeders but the people who use this as an excuse for hating these breeds neglect to look at the fact that there are many very bad breeders breeding pure bred dogs.

As with any breed (mixed or purebred) you need to do a lot of research in order to find a good breeder who has done health testing and treats their dogs well.
It appears that you are well educated on the breed and I am sure that means you have done the required research.

Good Luck with your new puppy and dont let people here turn you off... everyone deserves a dog even those who suffer from allergies.

PLEASE post pictures as soon as you get your new addition to the family.

Elissa

[doodleluvr]

I am not trying to be rude, but I am seriously confused.
What exactly are you confused about there Dobie, just read my first post and go from there. All my others were responces and I think you got confused when I forgot to do the quote.

[Zoom]

I'm going to ignore the ethics of breeding all together and ask you this question instead: What is it about dogs that your son is allergic to? Contrary to popular belief, it's not just the hair that is the allergen. The dander a pet sheds, the environmental allergens the pet picks up and the saliva of the pet itself are all allergens. A Labradoodle or any other dog is not going to keep your son from having a reaction if it's the dog's saliva he is allergic to. Also, just because a dog seems to be hypoallergenic as a puppy doesn't mean that he will continue to be so when his adult coat grows in.

There is a really good book out there about dog allergies called "Sneeze-free Dog Breeds". It goes into great detail about dog allergies, ways to minimize reactions and also gives examples of those breeds that are usually less likely to cause a reaction. No breed is 100% hypoallergenic, for the reasons I listed above.

I wish you luck in your search!

[Dobiegurl]

I understand the topic, its just your second post confused me. No biggie, I'll stick to the main topic.

I have no problem with breeding doodles for useful purposes and taking the proper steps in bredding responsibly. People always use the excuse of "go to the shelter" but guess what? a good % of those dogs are purebred. Its not so much that they are mixed it has to do with just breeding for money when there are millions in the shelter both mixes and purebreds.

[blue]

I'm going to ignore the ethics of breeding all together and ask you this question instead: What is it about dogs that your son is allergic to? Contrary to popular belief, it's not just the hair that is the allergen. The dander a pet sheds, the environmental allergens the pet picks up and the saliva of the pet itself are all allergens. A Labradoodle or any other dog is not going to keep your son from having a reaction if it's the dog's saliva he is allergic to. Also, just because a dog seems to be hypoallergenic as a puppy doesn't mean that he will continue to be so when his adult coat grows in.

There is a really good book out there about dog allergies called "Sneeze-free Dog Breeds". It goes into great detail about dog allergies, ways to minimize reactions and also gives examples of those breeds that are usually less likely to cause a reaction. No breed is 100% hypoallergenic, for the reasons I listed above.

I wish you luck in your search!

Way to rain on her Parade.

[LabBreeder]

So as long as the breeders you are buying your dog from have done health testing, etc, I don't think there will be as big of problem, I believe they are actually trying to make the Australian Labradoodle into a breed, but people that just have a lab and a poodle and think they will breed them and make some money arent those people.

Our pups parents were breed over in Australia. He/she will have a health guarentee for 2yrs. Microchiped before pick up spayed/neutered....all the first shots. We also will be able to trace his family tree down to 30yrs ago to the actually poodle and lab he/she was first breed from. I erased the part on the quote on the no guarentee of non-sheding. Actually the Australian Labradoodle has three different coats and yes the one that actually shed like a lab has been pretty much breed out. The 2nd coat you get a blow out coat at 9 or so months of age turning from the puppy coat to their adult coat so you get one shed for their life. The 3rd coat which we are getting doesn't shed. I'm sure there are some posts I haven't read yet but your answer was the best answer so far. Thanks
i have to agree with zoom. if it's raining on a parade, i'm sorry, but it is the truth. mixed breeds are not the problem...read other posts and you see what we believe the problems are. i think 90% are in agreement about previous posts/explanations.

it's good to hear you know so much about the doodle. it's not a recognized breed. if it becomes one, fine...but it's not one yet. the coat not shedding as much is good, but unless a hypoallergenic test is done on the puppy you get (i.e. dna, blood, saliva testing) you and your son may still be allergic to it. btw, i have 2 Labs and neither of them shed as much as you are letting on. maybe some do...but i've yet to see one with as much of a shedding issue as you are letting on.
no one bashes the doodle...they bash the BYB's that mix 2 purebreeds, make a mutt and advertise it for big $$$ (usually more than what you could get a purebreed for) and some even try to tell you these mutts/doodles can be registered or that they are hypoallergenic/low or no shed....99% of what is said about doodles is a lie. for your sake and your sons i hope this dog IS hypoallergenic. otherwise your out a lot of money and there will be another homeless doodle (unless you find a home for it).

[Zoom]

Way to rain on her Parade.

Just giving more information so she can be prepared for something like that to happen. She can choose to ignore it or not, but I think it's in everyone's best interests to have as much information as possible.

[Roxy's CD]

I'm going to ignore the ethics of breeding all together and ask you this question instead: What is it about dogs that your son is allergic to? Contrary to popular belief, it's not just the hair that is the allergen. The dander a pet sheds, the environmental allergens the pet picks up and the saliva of the pet itself are all allergens. A Labradoodle or any other dog is not going to keep your son from having a reaction if it's the dog's saliva he is allergic to. Also, just because a dog seems to be hypoallergenic as a puppy doesn't mean that he will continue to be so when his adult coat grows in.

There is a really good book out there about dog allergies called "Sneeze-free Dog Breeds". It goes into great detail about dog allergies, ways to minimize reactions and also gives examples of those breeds that are usually less likely to cause a reaction. No breed is 100% hypoallergenic, for the reasons I listed above.

I wish you luck in your search!

That's the only qualm I have with "labradoodles". As I was reading your first post, I get the hint that maybe you haven't done too much research, seeing as I haven't even been looking to purchase a labroodle and I am aware that not all doodles are "hypoallergenic".

Secondly, I don't know why you got soo rude around the end of your post stating that people that got puppies at 5 weeks are irresponsible and got them from BYB. I am insulted! I got my pitt and 5weeks and my rott/dobe at 6. Why? Because firstly the pitt was taken away from his mother at 4 weeks, was flea infested had not been dewormed and wasn't going to get his first shots that are supposed to be given at 5 weeks. As for my other girl I got her at 6 weeks because otherwise she would have been put in a bag and drowned with her brother because they unfortunately were unwanted.

I just feel that perhaps you should realize that just because I got a puppy at way to young age, which I am PERFECTLY aware of, does NOT mean that I am irresponsible or stupid, or endorse BYB!!!!!!

[fillyone]

What are you going to do if you or your son are allergic to the Labradoodle?
Many are not hypoallergenic.
Haven't seen the answer to this yet

[Cassiepeia]

Why people assume that just because it's an 'Australian Labradoodle' it's some how better than american bred doodles is beyond me. Honestly, I it just boggles my mind. :rolleyes:
Maybe it's because we're so far away from you guys that there is this mystical, magical quality to them. "Oooo....but the dog is from Australia or Australian lines...so it MUST be good". What a load of crap.


Why am I against designer mutts breeders? Because there are too many dogs in the world as it is and we don't need hundreds of irrepsonsible, ignorant people throwing any two dogs together to bring more pups into the world.

Human beings are selfish creatures. We want what we want and what we want, we get. Regardless of the cost.
There were plenty of fantastic breeds in the world before designer mutts started being exploited and mass produced.
There were plenty of mutts being born because people where too lazy or ignorant to get their dogs fixed, before designer mutts were even thought of.
And sadly there were plenty of both of these dogs in shelters looking for homes, before designer mutts were in need of help froms rescues.

There was no room for them to begin with and consequently they do nothing but add to an already overwhelming problem. THIS is why I have a problem.

Why should the dogs suffer because of our selfish wants?

Cass.

[doodleluvr]

I'm going to ignore the ethics of breeding all together and ask you this question instead: What is it about dogs that your son is allergic to? Contrary to popular belief, it's not just the hair that is the allergen. The dander a pet sheds, the environmental allergens the pet picks up and the saliva of the pet itself are all allergens. A Labradoodle or any other dog is not going to keep your son from having a reaction if it's the dog's saliva he is allergic to. Also, just because a dog seems to be hypoallergenic as a puppy doesn't mean that he will continue to be so when his adult coat grows in.

There is a really good book out there about dog allergies called "Sneeze-free Dog Breeds". It goes into great detail about dog allergies, ways to minimize reactions and also gives examples of those breeds that are usually less likely to cause a reaction. No breed is 100% hypoallergenic, for the reasons I listed above.

I wish you luck in your search! Our son is allergic to the dander and mine arn't bad enough for me not to get a dog regardless I take pills daily for all kinds of allergies not just dogs. So if I don't take my pill and I'm around them I may sneeze a few times no big deal. As I said before there are 3 different coats and the one we are getting is the most desired because of the fact that it is the best for allergies. We've taken him around the breeding dogs and the last litter and he didn't have a problem at all with any of them. So we did look into if he could handle them because we weren't going to be buying something only to give away.

[blue]

Cass your an Ausie so I blame you for the problem of the doodles.

[doodleluvr]

That's the only qualm I have with "labradoodles". As I was reading your first post, I get the hint that maybe you haven't done too much research, seeing as I haven't even been looking to purchase a labroodle and I am aware that not all doodles are "hypoallergenic".

Secondly, I don't know why you got soo rude around the end of your post stating that people that got puppies at 5 weeks are irresponsible and got them from BYB. I am insulted! I got my pitt and 5weeks and my rott/dobe at 6. Why? Because firstly the pitt was taken away from his mother at 4 weeks, was flea infested had not been dewormed and wasn't going to get his first shots that are supposed to be given at 5 weeks. As for my other girl I got her at 6 weeks because otherwise she would have been put in a bag and drowned with her brother because they unfortunately were unwanted.

I just feel that perhaps you should realize that just because I got a puppy at way to young age, which I am PERFECTLY aware of, does NOT mean that I am irresponsible or stupid, or endorse BYB!!!!!!

"Would you be more upset if someone got an Australian Labradoodle or a Pit bull pup that is only 5weeks old? I've seen tons of people that have gotten puppies from backyard breeders that are way to young to be away from their mothers. Basically what I'm getting at is ya'll should look at the aspect of someone loving a dog not what kind of dog it is, and if they ask you for help you would be adult enough to answer their question no matter if it's a mutt or a purebreed."

Wasn't intended to the owners of the dog

[Cassiepeia]

Cass your an Ausie so I blame you for the problem of the doodles.

LOL Thanks. Just what I need. :p

Cass.

[doodleluvr]

Why people assume that just because it's an 'Australian Labradoodle' it's some how better than american bred doodles is beyond me. Honestly, I it just boggles my mind. :rolleyes:
Maybe it's because we're so far away from you guys that there is this mystical, magical quality to them. "Oooo....but the dog is from Australia or Australian lines...so it MUST be good". What a load of crap.
Your views and smarta$$ comments are why I wrote this

[Cassiepeia]

I'm not being a smartarse. I'm being honest. It's ridiculous to think that just because Labradoodles were first bred here, that there must be a huge difference between the breeders here and the breeders there. There isn't.

"Would you be more upset if someone got an Australian Labradoodle or a Pit bull pup that is only 5weeks old? I've seen tons of people that have gotten puppies from backyard breeders that are way to young to be away from their mothers. Basically what I'm getting at is ya'll should look at the aspect of someone loving a dog not what kind of dog it is, and if they ask you for help you would be adult enough to answer their question no matter if it's a mutt or a purebreed."

Bottom line is that it doesn't matter how much someone loves a dog. If you close your eyes to the bigger problem you're doing all dogs a disservice. Which, once again, amounts to nothing but selfishness.

I'll give you the fact that there is a group of people down here that say they're trying to get the Aust. Labradoodle recognised, but I don't hold high hopes for it or for them being reputable. Which is a shame, because it's the dogs who end up suffering.

Cass.

[doodleluvr]

I really feel like I'm arguing with a bunch of five year olds. There were very few people that were curtious and actually answered like they were adults. So I thank the few of you that were polite and gave honest answers without being rude.

[Cassiepeia]

As far as I'm aware everyone has been mature and polite. We're just passionate. I'm sorry you didn't get the answers you wanted.

Cass.

[doodleluvr]

I'm not being a smartarse. I'm being honest. It's ridiculous to think that just because Labradoodles were first bred here, that there must be a huge difference between the breeders here and the breeders there. There isn't.



Bottom line is that it doesn't matter how much someone loves a dog. If you close your eyes to the bigger problem you're doing all dogs a disservice.

Cass.
Actually here link to the standards:
http://www.laa.org.au/breed_standard.htm

Link to what makes an Australian Labradoodle
http://www.laa.org.au/about_doodles_parentbreeds.htm

American Doodle: Lab and Poodle

So go read the difference yourself

My husband and I are all for shelters and we would gladly take a dog from one if we could. We are not going to get a neglected dog for it to come home and us have to take it back due to the allergies.

[jess2416]

"Would you be more upset if someone got an Australian Labradoodle or a Pit bull pup that is only 5weeks old? I've seen tons of people that have gotten puppies from backyard breeders that are way to young to be away from their mothers. Basically what I'm getting at is ya'll should look at the aspect of someone loving a dog not what kind of dog it is, and if they ask you for help you would be adult enough to answer their question no matter if it's a mutt or a purebreed."
I would be upset for both to be only 5 weeks old, but having a puppy myself that didnt have a mother and was found at around 5 weeks old..she does have some issues because of it...although I didnt get her till she was 9 weeks old...I am so sick and tired of hearing that doodles are better and this and that and so on and so forth, than regular mutts when clearly they are not..they just have a fancy name...I mean come on...you wanna hear my fancy name for my Chloe...?? Its German Shepador Retriever...Hmmm maybe I'll start something and sell them for 2000-5000 dollars a piece:rolleyes: ... Oh thats right I forgot I spayed her which is the responsible thing to do for all mixes and dogs that are not in conformation and showing...

*Just my 2 cents* and of course IN MY OPINION :D

[Cassiepeia]

I've been to that site many times. Don't believe everything you read.

Cass.

[LabBreeder]

my question is how often do "labradoodles" (australian or american) actually meet these "standards"? if the standards are as strict as they seemed, wouldn't you think more doodles would be meeting those standards and that they would be closer to being recognized as a "breed"?
just wondering...cause i've seen loads of doodle sites and very rarely have i seen 1. a conformed litter (all meeting standards) and 2. the doodles all vary site by site so much that it doesn't look like a standard is even set up.

also, could you educate us as to why a doodle costs so much? are necessary health checks, hypoallergenic tests (on parents and pups) being done that make them cost so much? i've seen how much OFA and CERF and CB tests are and they don't add up to $1000 or more, most are pretty cheap to get done (i did say most). why do some breeders say they are a breed when they aren't? or say that they can be registered with a kennel club (and i don't mean the hybrid clubs or CKC *which is only a paper saying your dog is a "non purebred dog"*)? why do they advertise hypoallergenic or low shed when (like zoom said earlier) that can change as they get older or they haven't been tested in the first place?
i understand why a doodle was first done...as a guidance dog for people with allergies...but don't you think it's gotten a little out of hand? all these "designer dogs" that people are just mixing to make money because of a fad...can you honestly tell me that a "puggle" is gonna be a guide dog or is hypoallergenic...or a doberdoodle, schnoodle, goldendoodle, jack-chi, or any of the other smaller mix breed designer dogs that are being "bred"? just wondering if it's ever gonna stop or if people are gonna keep mixing breeds til there is just a huge influx of dogs that are riddled with health problems/temperement issues cause of all the mixing of breeds for money....all just MO. :) legitimate questions, not intended for arguing debate...just answers.

[doodleluvr]

I've been to that site many times. Don't believe everything you read.

Cass.
LOL believe me I don't. I'd believe my breeder over anything someone in a shelter told me though. I've done my research I actually checked out my breeder and made sure her dogs were actually from Tegan Park and Rutland Manor raised dogs. My point is this.......if somone can't get a mutt like in our case and choose to get a designer breed why would it matter to you. People are gonna breed them regardless of what you may think. IMO everytime you see the word Labradoodle the majority of you on here assume it's from a BYB which isn't always the case. Just like most people assume a Pit is a dangerous dog.

[JennSLK]

my question is how often do "labradoodles" (australian or american) actually meet these "standards"? if the standards are as strict as they seemed, wouldn't you think more doodles would be meeting those standards and that they would be closer to being recognized as a "breed"?
just wondering...cause i've seen loads of doodle sites and very rarely have i seen 1. a conformed litter (all meeting standards) and 2. the doodles all vary site by site so much that it doesn't look like a standard is even set up.

Because the "breed" in in it's early stages. Dobermans didnt all look the same in the beginning

[~Tucker&Me~]

My point is this.......if somone can't get a mutt like in our case and choose to get a designer breed why would it matter to you. People are gonna breed them regardless of what you may think.

There are MANY poodle crosses in shelters, why not adopt one of them?

It most definately DOES matter to us when someone purchases a designer breed. I see many dogs in the shelter and many dogs are put down around here and all over the world because someone went to a BYB or bought a designer dog.

We know they are being bred and people will continue breeding them. But think of it like this.
There will always be people doing drugs. However, the more people that are educated the less you will get doing it. Things change; slowly, but they do change. PLEASE, go visit some local shelters and look for a non-allergenic dog there.

~Tucker

[LabBreeder]

jenn- i realize this. it all goes back to the fact that all breeds started out as a mix between two or more breeds waaaay back in the day. i guess what i'm asking is how can doodles be identified as a "breed" when they aren't meeting the set standards in litters and aren't recognized by nationally known and recognized kennel clubs. aren't doodle breeders (legit ones) trying to get them passed and accepted as a breed so they WILL be recognized? if so, aren't they supposed to meet their own set standards to do it?

[doodleluvr]

my question is how often do "labradoodles" (australian or american) actually meet these "standards"? if the standards are as strict as they seemed, wouldn't you think more doodles would be meeting those standards and that they would be closer to being recognized as a "breed"?
just wondering...cause i've seen loads of doodle sites and very rarely have i seen 1. a conformed litter (all meeting standards) and 2. the doodles all vary site by site so much that it doesn't look like a standard is even set up.

also, could you educate us as to why a doodle costs so much? are necessary health checks, hypoallergenic tests (on parents and pups) being done that make them cost so much? i've seen how much OFA and CERF and CB tests are and they don't add up to $1000 or more, most are pretty cheap to get done (i did say most). why do some breeders say they are a breed when they aren't? or say that they can be registered with a kennel club (and i don't mean the hybrid clubs or CKC *which is only a paper saying your dog is a "non purebred dog"*)? why do they advertise hypoallergenic or low shed when (like zoom said earlier) that can change as they get older or they haven't been tested in the first place?
i understand why a doodle was first done...as a guidance dog for people with allergies...but don't you think it's gotten a little out of hand? all these "designer dogs" that people are just mixing to make money because of a fad...can you honestly tell me that a "puggle" is gonna be a guide dog or is hypoallergenic...or a doberdoodle, schnoodle, goldendoodle, jack-chi, or any of the other smaller mix breed designer dogs that are being "bred"? just wondering if it's ever gonna stop or if people are gonna keep mixing breeds til there is just a huge influx of dogs that are riddled with health problems/temperement issues cause of all the mixing of breeds for money....all just MO. :) legitimate questions, not intended for arguing debate...just answers.

You have alot of good points in here and all answer them for you. Australian Labradoodles are different then the BYB here in America. They put alot of work into the breeding of these dogs. If you go to their website they even state that there is a difference between the multi generation dogs that they breed and the ones that Americans are breeding. To make it easier and not so drawn out I'm just gonna post a link to Tegan Park and you can look around in there as to the difference http://labradoodle.com/html/doodle_history.html
As for costing so much for a true Austalian Labradoodle.......You get a 2yr Health Guarentee, microchiped, registration papers to LAA, Vet certification of early spay or Neuter, Copies of the parents DNA profiles, BTW to get an Australian Multi generation breeding dog (non spayed or neutered) will run you 18k to 30k Don't freak out yet lol.........they do this to keep the Australian doodles pure and there is intense testing done on the breeder before they are realised as being able to Breed. So all in all the majority of the cost is because of how much it costs someone to follow the standards of the LAA. Do I agree with the BYB not at all. Do I believe in the Australian Labradoodle becoming AKC recognized someday for sure. I can't see them not being due to the fact how much Tegan Park and Rutland Manor are putting into them.

[ihartgonzo]

My point is this.......if somone can't get a mutt like in our case and choose to get a designer breed why would it matter to you.

LMAO. I looove going in circles. >;(

First off, you ARE getting a mutt, missy.

Second off, it matters to some of us because we foster & volunteer for RESCUES that are over-flowing with doodle & other mix puppies. Most of the members here firmly and openly believe that anyone not breeding purebred, tested, shown, worked, healthy dogs is a BYB and not approved of in any way. I feel that people who consistently reply to "Doodle" threads expressing their opinions are not in the wrong, rather you and others who say we're close-minded and hate all mutts are in the wrong completely. You start a post antagonizing people who disagree with designer dogs because they simply CARE ABOUT and LOVE dogs! I adore dogs, I want to work with dogs for the rest of my life, so it's not a big surprise that I am deeply hurt and personally offended by anyone who exploits these innocent animals for breeding & who lie about puppies & who have no regard for mixed breed dogs dying in shelters (which I feel that any intentional mutt breeders do NOT!).

You're asking why WE care if you want to buy a Doodle... well, you're topic is entitled "Labradoodle vs Purebreed". I listed that I feel that breeds like Portugese Water Dogs & Irish Water Spaniels are exceptional breeds who are strikingly similar in appearance, form, & function to "Labradoodles"... got no reply, too! I feel that it is overall incredibly selfish for people to keep breeding and breeding and "experimenting" with mixed breeds, which is exactly what a Doodle is, while we already have 100's of established breeds and millions of dogs dying EVERY YEAR in our country.

I apologize for having an opinion, and that you aren't hearing what you want to hear. This is my opinion about the breeders, it has nothing to do with the dogs, as I love all dogs and I cannot express the sadness I feel for dogs who are exploited for breeding & selling.

[LabBreeder]

i've been to rutland manors site...and since they did start the australian "labradoodle" for good reasons i tend to believe them more than any other site i've come across (american, canadian, australian or otherwise). you said the parents were tested, but are the pups tested as well? to see if they are really hypoallergenic?
also, haven't the aussie labradoodles been being mixed for 20 or 30 years now? shouldn't the pups all come out looking alike as long as they are at least 3rd gen? i think i saw 1 litter that had all the puppies looking exactly the same...THAT was a good, set standard litter. those litters i agree more with (even though it's still a mixed breed) because they meet the standards that were made so these mixes could eventually become a breed.
is there any chance that if (or when) this particular mix (labradoodle) is allowed to become a breed that they could change the "registered breed name" to something different? i mean, labradoodle kinda sounds degrading to Labradors, Poodles and the pups. they need their own unique name to compliment (what could be) a unique breed. i would prefer this doodle not become a breed until the litters meet the standards at least 90% of the time, the pups have a 75% chance of actually being hypoallergenic (and are all tested to see if they are) and the coat is one uniform/low shed look (to minimize dander and allergic reactions). it just seems like it would be better if they had something more substantial to offer, especially with them costing so much.
as of right now, i still don't approve of doodles (and all of those other "designer dogs" that are being made) because 99% of these mixes have no purpose but for someone to try to make quick money off a fad. i would rather see breeding done by professionals, with purebreeds (that meet/or exceed breed standards, have health certs done, and have good lines, and are striving to improve the breed, etc) than BYB's and money grubbers that are just making more homeless mixed breed dogs. i'm sure even you agree with that. :) a true australian labradoodle (regardless of the fact that it's mixing two breeds) was started to help people with allergies. if the above "standards" were met with these doodles, i'm sure people wouldn't have as much of a problem with them. right now, they are just mixed breeds being sold for lots of money (by most people). BYB's are hindering the possibility of this doodle ever becoming a recognized breed.

[doodleluvr]

LMAO. I looove going in circles. >;(

First off, you ARE getting a mutt, missy.

Second off, it matters to some of us because we foster & volunteer for RESCUES that are over-flowing with doodle & other mix puppies. Most of the members here firmly and openly believe that anyone not breeding purebred, tested, shown, worked, healthy dogs is a BYB and not approved of in any way. I feel that people who consistently reply to "Doodle" threads expressing their opinions are not in the wrong, rather you and others who say we're close-minded and hate all mutts are in the wrong completely. You start a post antagonizing people who disagree with designer dogs because they simply CARE ABOUT and LOVE dogs! I adore dogs, I want to work with dogs for the rest of my life, so it's not a big surprise that I am deeply hurt and personally offended by anyone who exploits these innocent animals for breeding & who lie about puppies & who have no regard for mixed breed dogs dying in shelters (which I feel that any intentional mutt breeders do NOT!).

You're asking why WE care if you want to buy a Doodle... well, you're topic is entitled "Labradoodle vs Purebreed". I listed that I feel that breeds like Portugese Water Dogs & Irish Water Spaniels are exceptional breeds who are strikingly similar in appearance, form, & function to "Labradoodles"... got no reply, too! I feel that it is overall incredibly selfish for people to keep breeding and breeding and "experimenting" with mixed breeds, which is exactly what a Doodle is, while we already have 100's of established breeds and millions of dogs dying EVERY YEAR in our country.

I apologize for having an opinion, and that you aren't hearing what you want to hear. This is my opinion about the breeders, it has nothing to do with the dogs, as I love all dogs and I cannot express the sadness I feel for dogs who are exploited for breeding & selling.
LMAO someone can come on this forum and say I just got a German Shepered and ya'll are oh how cute blah blah blah someone comes on here and says they got a doodle and ya'll freak out on them that is what I don't get your freaking out over one dog you don't tell them why didn't you go to the shelter and save this or that dog but ya'll freak at the doodle word that is what I don't get. People spend money to get a pure breed and that's fine with ya'll and another person pays money for a cross breed and there so wrong because they didn't save a dog from a shelter. You show me a posting where you can get a MULTI GENERATION Australian Labradoodle from a shelter it's just a mutt right?

[LabBreeder]

doodleluvr - i think the point they are trying to make is that regardless of it being multi generation or single generation...it's still considered a mutt. all a labradoodle is, at this point in time, is a cross between a Labrador and a Poodle. it's not recognized as a breed, standards aren't always met with consistency in litters and most pups are not hypoallergenic (and this was the whole purpose for the original Lab/Poodle crossing).

[doodleluvr]

doodleluvr - i think the point they are trying to make is that regardless of it being multi generation or single generation...it's still considered a mutt. all a labradoodle is, at this point in time, is a cross between a Labrador and a Poodle. it's not recognized as a breed, standards aren't always met with consistency in litters and most pups are not hypoallergenic (and this was the whole purpose for the original Lab/Poodle crossing).
98% hypoallergenic from Australian Labradoodles, from the BYB here in America ya I'm sure there is a 50% chance that they won't be due to taking after either the lab or poodle, I'm not arguing over if it's a breed I know it's a mix with several different types of dog not just lab and poodle I'm arguing over why freak out when the "doodle" word gets mentioned. Honestly my biggest problem with the different opions were when you all freaked out on a kid that was so excited that her dad got her a dog and ooops it was a doodle so shame on her. Doodle VS. Purebreed ???? is why don't you tell the people who get purebreeds why didn't u go save a dog at the shelter like you do when Doodle is mentioned

[LabBreeder]

i know i've asked why they didn't go to a shelter...don't know if i've told anyone they should have gone though :confused:

i won't argue about whether or not an aussie is 99% hypoallergenic or not...it all depends on which sites you go to and who you ask about it. i've seen purebred owners get jumped over "wanting to breed" or "accidental pregnancies" so it's not just doodle buyers that get jumped. i think the majority of the people here want others to be aware of the overpopulation situation with dogs (pure and mix) and not contribute to that. breeding (especially mixes) is contributing to the amount of homeless dogs or dogs that will end up euthanised because they won't find homes in time. breeders or BYB's that don't know, or don't care, about what they are doing and are breeding for money are contributing to the pet overpopulation. if these designer dogs hadn't been started years ago...yes, there'd still be mixes in the shelters, but i don't think there would be near as many. (i know purebreeds are in shelters too, so let's not go there) the point is you can get the same kind of dog from a shelter for alot less and not be supporting byb's or designer dog breeders and save a shelter dogs life. i guess the best way is to let others explain their situation on the matter...it's not my business to try and justify everyone elses opinions on this.........:) so, if you have a differing opinion, please try to explain it.

doodleluvr - i hope you get what i was saying and don't think i was jumping you. i think i just asked questions and wanted answers from your side of all of this and tried explaining a few things as well. lately i've been coming off very...ummm..strong on some threads and i'm trying not to do that now. :)

[MomOf7]

You have alot of good points in here and all answer them for you. Australian Labradoodles are different then the BYB here in America. They put alot of work into the breeding of these dogs. If you go to their website they even state that there is a difference between the multi generation dogs that they breed and the ones that Americans are breeding. To make it easier and not so drawn out I'm just gonna post a link to Tegan Park and you can look around in there as to the difference http://labradoodle.com/html/doodle_history.html
As for costing so much for a true Austalian Labradoodle.......You get a 2yr Health Guarentee, microchiped, registration papers to LAA, Vet certification of early spay or Neuter, Copies of the parents DNA profiles, BTW to get an Australian Multi generation breeding dog (non spayed or neutered) will run you 18k to 30k Don't freak out yet lol.........they do this to keep the Australian doodles pure and there is intense testing done on the breeder before they are realised as being able to Breed. So all in all the majority of the cost is because of how much it costs someone to follow the standards of the LAA. Do I agree with the BYB not at all. Do I believe in the Australian Labradoodle becoming AKC recognized someday for sure. I can't see them not being due to the fact how much Tegan Park and Rutland Manor are putting into them.

Whoa there!
I can give you my dogs 10 generation pedigree dating back to the 1940's Probably more if I try.
Most of those things you mention are a given. Question...Does the parents of this pup have thier OFA , Cerf, PRA test. What is it that they are breeding for if it isnt for a hypogenic dog? What is a Labradoodle suppose to do? Who is deciding this? Do you ever see labradoodle breeders uniting across the world to hold events and keep track of performances?
What makes these particular dogs a good representative to this breed? What makes these dogs so outstanding that they should be bred?
Now I might be impressed if these so called new dog breed breeders actually did some scientific work to put together the perfect dog. Using more than 2 types of dogs to create a perfect dog with certain goals in mind for it.
That I could see. That is how the breeds we have come to love now were made. Now we have more scientific advances it would make it that much better. If someone were dedicated to this they would not charge an outragous price for a pup untill the line is completely clean and consistant.

These doodle breeders granted some do make a effort for health and do give guarantees, They didnt do the research not like it should have been looking at todays advances in science. Sorry Just doesnt cut it for me.
However you have already closed your mind to what could be true. I will not try to convince you. Just trying to give you information that makes sense.
Hope you are happy with your pup and I wish you and yours the best.

[ihartgonzo]

Um... I think my point was missed, by like a mile. =/

I disagree with anyone who supports BYB's, intentional mixed breeding, puppy mills, all of that. The reason that people immediately disagree with "Doodles" is because we feel that there is not a reputable Doodle breeder on earth, these dogs do not breed consistently, and in most cases a mixed puppy facing death at a shelter would be just as great for the purpose of being a pet. If some one posted saying "Guess what? I'm buying a (purebred) German Shepherd from a pet store tomorrow!" I would disagree with that decision just as much as if the dog were a Doodle.

[LabBreeder]

see, i get what gonzo's saying....and i also agree with my own thoughts/opinions (hmm...that just sounds weird :) i would hope i'd agree with myself)
we have the same general ideas...some are just more expounded upon than others.

[IliamnasQuest]

BTW to get an Australian Multi generation breeding dog (non spayed or neutered) will run you 18k to 30k

Woah, SOMEONE is making a LOT of money off of this "DESIGNER MUTT" breed. Sheesh. That right there should tell anyone with a modicum of intelligence that this is merely another scam to bring in a ton of money to someone who knows how to play on the (dare I say it?) foolish ignorance of people.

Bottom line .. the "doodles" are merely a way to make money. Someone thought it up, saw the $$$ flashing before them and then made up excuses to try to make the fad credible. It's not a breed, it's a mix of breeds. Yes, most breeds were developed from a mix of breeds at some point. But way back when, most breeds were developed specifically for a working purpose. They built on certain physical working traits and bred for those traits. Nowadays, there are SO many breeds and SO MANY dogs in shelters that there is only ONE excuse to make a "new" breed - and that's to make money. Plain and simple.

Your Australian breeders are not any more important than "doodle" breeders in any other country. They worship the almighty buck and depend on those gullible enough to fall for their slick words and slick websites. Sure, they may make it into an established breed in Australia .. maybe we're a bit more discriminating here in the U.S. and hold breeds to higher standards than they do over there. I am perfectly fine with the thought that no more breeds are "designed" .. we don't NEED more breeds, people are doing that to feed their own egos and their own pockets.

By the way, doodleluvr .. you ask for an "adult orientated" response but if you went back and read your OWN posts, you might notice that you sound like a child much of the time. Every time someone disagrees with you, you suggest they are not adult. That's a childish reaction. You have been given some excellent responses and asked some direct questions which you don't seem to want to answer. You're promoting a mixed breed of dog that you evidently are willing to spend a lot of money on .. to me, that's complete foolishness. But it's your money .. *LOL*

You can't expect to come on here with your attitude and have people kissing up to you. Obviously you're going to do what you're going to do, but sheesh .. the fact is you're giving money to someone who is willingly producing mixed breed dogs, when there are thousands of mixed breed dogs dying every day in shelters.

Where's the adult logic in that??

Melanie and the gang in Alaska

[fillyone]

Quote:
Originally Posted by fillyone
What are you going to do if you or your son are allergic to the Labradoodle?
Many are not hypoallergenic.

Haven't seen the answer to this yet

Still haven't seen the answer to this. But now I'm off to work

[solidstaffs]

Hi :D

It doesn't matter how people try to justify the Doodle it IS and will remain an mutt until breeders stat to breed dogs that conform to a standard that is set and the breed actually gets recognised. There are enough breeds of dog from all around the world to be able to find one that fits your lifestyle and needs without the need to give your money to someone who 9 times out of 10 has no breeding ethics at all, does not health test..etc.. I can only speak from what i have learned over the net and talking to people from various countries, but Americans seem to be more fixated with breeding dogs that are titled rather than looking at the positve virtues of the individual dog (I dont mean to generalise all Americans, and as i said i can only go by what i know so far) If you plan to breed ANY dogs then you should pick 2 dogs that compliment eachothers faults, are of sound temperment, fit the "type" you are looking to produce NOT on how many titles they have won. Yes it's nice to be able to look at a pedigree and see CH's in there but some of the best dogs are sat at home in front of the fire and will never be shown (For various reasons) Anyway i'm rambling now lol.

Some "designer" breeds over here in the UK.

Puggle= Pug x Beagle
Puggychin= Pug x Japanese Chin
French Boston= French Bulldog x Boston Terrier
SpanStaff= Spaniel x Staffordshire Bull Terrier
Bich-Poo = Bichon x Poodle
Boxerdoodle = Boxer x Poodle
Cairnoodle = Cairn Terrier x Poodle
Cavapoo = Cavalier King Charles Spaniel x Poodle
Chi-Poo = Chihuahua x Poodle
Cockapoo = Cocker Spaniel x Poodle
Doodleman Pinscher = Doberman x Standard Poodle
English Boodle = English Bulldog x Poodle
Eskapoo = American Eskimo Dog x Poodle
Goldendoodle = Golden Retriever x Poodle
Labradoodle = Labrador Retriever x Poodle
Lhasapoo = Lhasa Apso x Poodle
Malti-Poo = Maltesex Poodle
Papoo = Papillion x Poodle
Pekepoo = Pekingese x Poodle
Pomapoo = Pomeranian x Poodle
Pugapoo = Pug x Poodle
Saint Berdoodle = Saint Bernard x Poodle
Schnoodle = Schnauzer x Poodle
Scoodle = Scottish Terrier x Poodle
Shepadoodle = German Shepherd x Standard Poodle
Shih-Poo = Shih-Tzu x Poodle
Weimardoodle = Weimaraner x Poodle
Westiepoo = West Highland White Terrier x Poodle
Whoodles = Soft Coated Wheaton Terrier x Poodle
Yorkipoo = Yorkie x Poodle

Now tell me that this isn't a serious problem, and people just "bash" crossbreeds ! The sooner people wake up and realsie that these are nothing other than peoples way of making big money the better.

I own a Staffordshire Bull Terrier and i am in the process of trying to buy myself a Shitzu. I plan on crossing them and making my own designer breed called a Bullshitz which will sum up the whole "Designer" breed situation :D

[mjb]

It seems like the OP is wondering why people don't have the same problem when people post that they've just bought a purebred puppy. The vast majority of purebred puppies are not bred by reputable breeders. Most are bred entirely as a money making proposition. I guess, if the question is going to come up at all, why don't posters ask people who have just purchased a purebred pup why they didn't try to find one at the shelter. There are many, many purebred dogs in the shelter. Our shelter will let you put your name down for a certain breed and get a call when that breed comes in. They will not, however, give you a call when a certain size dog comes in. That was one the important criteria for me. I needed a certain size. I did end up getting my dog from a shelter, but it took many months of searching to find the one that fit my needs. Anyway, in reading this thread, it seemed to me that the OP was wondering why people who purchase any dog, pure or mix, are scrutinized since the majority of purchases are from people trying to make money on their puppies.

[canadianmandy]

I am sensing this is going to be a long post so I just want to say
congrats on your puppy. Allso wow some of these threads rally move ...yesterday there were only three pages!

I believe that I can answer your question.
the question being. Why people get mad b/c of doodles and other mixes and not byb pure breds....

Well I love mutts I am the new mommy of a litter of mutts (not planned)
do the unique mix I could have sold for alot of money and be like Yo I have black golden retrievers... a rare type of retriever... a color unseen b4. But I know in my heart I cannot do that..... The true diffrence between your doodle puppy and say summmerriots German shepherd is this. Sure at one time a german shepherd could have been a mutt. But that mutt has been bred with the same type mutt for generations making its type a pure strain. I can breed a german shepherd with a german shepherd and get german shepherds. If I take my puppies (black Lab/golden retriever) and breed them or a doodle I can have several outcomes. with my puppies I can have offspring that looks like a short hair lab or have the retriever hair. or in your case your doodles puppies could have poodle or lab hair. People here get upset b/c ppl have worked so hard to get the poodle or lab to be what it is today. sure they hate bybs that breed purebreds for money. But in their own way they are still working that perfect strain (unless they are not honest). So ppl here dont get mad at the pure breds. But mutts are mutts b/c they reproduce mutts. Mutts carry genes of two or more breeds and can pass what ever on. example the mom of my puppies is a yellow lab/golden retriever.. so half her puppies had Lab hair half had the retriever hair.(Dad was Black Lab/golden retriever)

Now if say some one worked the doodle strain for generations and made a new breed thats offspring was allways doodle then it could be reconized as a new breed. But todays doodle breeders are normally a one generation of Lab/poodle.
(maybe someone should do that work the doodles till its a pure strain....then ppl cannot sell those mutts for big bucks cuz there is a pure bred version:D )

Hope you enjoy your puppy

Mandy
srry summerriot u were the first person with a purebred to pop in my head.

[Fran27]

It seems like the OP is wondering why people don't have the same problem when people post that they've just bought a purebred puppy. The vast majority of purebred puppies are not bred by reputable breeders. Most are bred entirely as a money making proposition. I guess, if the question is going to come up at all, why don't posters ask people who have just purchased a purebred pup why they didn't try to find one at the shelter. There are many, many purebred dogs in the shelter. Our shelter will let you put your name down for a certain breed and get a call when that breed comes in. They will not, however, give you a call when a certain size dog comes in. That was one the important criteria for me. I needed a certain size. I did end up getting my dog from a shelter, but it took many months of searching to find the one that fit my needs. Anyway, in reading this thread, it seemed to me that the OP was wondering why people who purchase any dog, pure or mix, are scrutinized since the majority of purchases are from people trying to make money on their puppies.

Good point. The thing with purebreds is that we can't know where the people got them from, so usually we don't ask. When we know where the dogs are from though, and it's from a BYB or a petstore, you can bet the poor OP is going to have a lecture though. With designer breeds though, we don't have to ask, it's 99% sure that the dog came from a bad breeder/petshop. Which is why they are an 'easy' target.

So anyway, about the Australian Labradoodles. I like the fact that Tegan Park and Rutland Manor are trying to make it a breed. I despise the way it is done though. Way too many litters, dogs more expensive than purebreds, makes you wonder if they are doing it to really make a breed or just to make money (actually, I'm not wondering). I just don't believe that people really care about a breed when they make so much money out of it (and will make even more if the breed is recognized).

About the breeders that imported one of their dogs to the US to make their own Australian Labradoodles, I just think it's really sad that they are charging so much for them also. Even if it's a breed 'in progress', nothing justifies charging more than purebreds.

So frankly the whole thing sounds like a business to me... not something done by love. They found a good niche with allergy-free dogs, and are making people pay for it. I find it lame.

That being said, I like those dogs and maybe one day I will actually have one too (I have allergies also). But when they are a recognized breed and are not sold for $2000. So I'm not sure it will happen for a long time.

[Red_ACD_for_me]

What I don't understand is that people want to run out and get a "mutt" doodle breed instead of going for a standard poodle, wheaton terrier, etc. There are plenty of "hypo allergenic" breeds already out there and they are purebreds from "reputable breeders" if you do your homework :) . Why pay big money for a mixed breed when there are plenty in shelters or why not put the money into a well bred pure breed. Don't fall for the doodle hype because it is a doodle don't. :rolleyes: Just because it is from Australia doesn't make them any better, it's like saying getting a german shepard from Germany is better when there are plenty of German line bred shepards right here in America.

[Leslie + Chessies]

What's the story with these new breeds, or is it just a mutt?
by Jane Anderson

You've just heard of a groovy new breed. It's non-shedding, medium sized, great with children, and highly intelligent. And it has no health problems! It's been created by a very thoughtful breeder who had your best intentions at heart!
Wow, you've got it made! The perfect dog! oh, and when it might be twice the price of a pedigree dog, won't your neighbours be envious!

Well if you fell for this, you're about to be taken for a ride.


Here are some cross-breed truths:
There is no such thing as a "new" breed. Everything has been tried before, and invariably with pretty average results.
When you mix breeds, it's extremely unlikely you'll get a "non-shedding, hypo-allergenic breed"
There is absolutely no proof that a mixed breed is healthier than a pedigree dog.
Mixed breed dogs cannot be shown.
There is such a variability in offspring, that no breeder of mutts can guarantee why your pup will look like as an adult
No breeder of mutts can offer a real guarantee for a "healthy, intelligent, great with children" mutt pup.
Invariably, the parents of the mutt puppy are poor in quality. You will NEVER produce lovely pups from average (or worse) parents, regardless of breed or mixed breed)
In fact, you might want to join our new email list with the aim to learn more about cross breeds, with particular emphasis to temperament, coat type, genetics, and health. Click here.

So before you rush out and buy that cute little labradoodle, that golden-doodle, or labrashitz, keep in mind, you're about to be ripped off.

And for those of you who are niaive enough to IMPORT mutts such as labradoodles, and other such multi-doodle mutts, you are doing yourself and dogs a great injustice. If you feel the need for a mutt, please go to your local dog shelter, and rescue a pup from there.
So mutt breeders make me angry? Well, it's very disappointing to see people being ripped off when they could get a well bred pure bred dog for a cheaper price.

However, there are people out there who are willing to pay more for a cross breed, then they are a good pure bred dog. Sometimes they justify it because they may have read an article where some "celebrity" has one, so they need to have one. Let me tell you straight,if I had a dollar for every person who contacted me about their fancy cross breed that turned out to not have the characteristics they were told it would, I'd be a wealthy woman. Then there are the very angry people who will continue to justify their decision by telling me their dog "hardly sheds", or is "nearly hypo-allergenic". hmmmm.... too bad it doesn't though, like you were promised by the breeder.

Go and talk to a few groomers, talk to a few vets, and visit a few shelters before you try one of the cross breeds. You'll be sadly disappointed at the terrible stories you'll hear that will put it quickly into perspective. You'll see "fancy" cross breeds dumped at alarming rates, and you'll certainly want to know why.

And if you think that because the cross breed stock is imported from Australia, it must be good - let me tell you straight - I live in Australia, and amongst the knowing dog community, the cross breeds sold at ridiculous prices are seen as a disgrace. In fact, one of the so called "big names" in labradoodles has already tried to acquire my own pure bred dogs to mix with her own. Funny isn't it that the "bad" pure bred genes that cross breeders are trying to avoid and so quickly sought after by them. Goodness knows how those purebred genes magically fix themselves when the dogs are bred to another breed, with its own set of genes.

Unless cross breeders are really genetic scientists who are doing genetic modification, all you'll end up with in the mixed breed is a mix of a lot of things. This is why the F2, and F3 generations are seen as such disasters.

Feel free to email me. jane@bluegrace.com

[Roxy's CD]

dogs more expensive than purebreds...charging more than purebreds.

This is the only problem I have with the doodle vs. purebred thing. I don't think it's right to say that because they aren't "purebred" their not worth as much money. I understand that the reason so much money is being charged is because that's the animals sole purpose. But to me, any good dog, can cost any amount of money. My girl was an accident, a mutt, a heinz 57 and I would pay just as much for her than any purebred animal in the world.

Let's take away the term 'designer dog" and just use mutt. I don't think mutts are LESS valuable than purebred animals. :)

[Roxy's CD]

Mixed breed dogs cannot be shown. Wrong. National Association for Mixed Breeds.

[Chrissy&B]

But how would you show them if there are no standards?? :confused:

[JennSLK]

jenn- i realize this. it all goes back to the fact that all breeds started out as a mix between two or more breeds waaaay back in the day. i guess what i'm asking is how can doodles be identified as a "breed" when they aren't meeting the set standards in litters and aren't recognized by nationally known and recognized kennel clubs. aren't doodle breeders (legit ones) trying to get them passed and accepted as a breed so they WILL be recognized? if so, aren't they supposed to meet their own set standards to do it?

There is an Aus standard that many american breeders have adopted (the good ones) and there are alot of dogs that are F5, F6 that are breeding true. It's a process, they are trying to breed to a standard wich is set up. It is in the early stages not all are going to breed true yet, but most are

[LabBreeder]

this link lists what kennels, associations and clubs either accept mixes or let mixes compete in events: http://www.dogplay.com/GettingDog/mixed.html#clubs

i think the one Roxy's talking about is NAMBR (north american mixed breed registry) *let me know if i'm wrong roxy, i just couldn't find anything with the name you listed* they have events in obedience, companion, utility, tracking, flyball and agility. the also accept registered purebreds and non registered purebreds. this way all dogs, regardless of mix or not, can show off their skills. they don't need a standard because it's not a "show".

[Roxy's CD]

^Perhaps.lol. NAMBR (I just came up with my own words for the abbrev. LOL)... There are the same titles so your doodle could get a CD title or get his CH etc. Same rules, in a CKC or AKC handbook there are rules and standards for shows asides from the obvious, that they have to be purebred and registered.

[LabBreeder]

There is an Aus standard that many american breeders have adopted (the good ones) and there are alot of dogs that are F5, F6 that are breeding true. It's a process, they are trying to breed to a standard wich is set up. It is in the early stages not all are going to breed true yet, but most are

i have read the standards (they were posted earlier) and i know that part of becoming a "recognized breed" is to have and conform to a standard. so they are partially there. i still agree with the other posters about not needing any more "breeds" and that there are other "hypoallergenic/low shed" breeds already. plus it's ridiculous to charge that much for a dog (purebred or not). i can't see a breeder charging that much for any dog without a very, very good reason. it seems these doodles are being bred for money still.

either way, this debate could go on forever and it would never have any effect on the OP or them buying/not buying a doodle. if they want a doodle they'll get one...if they want a purebred they'll get one. if they think they've done enough research, and believe this 'breeder' is good because they SAY their generations can be traced back to rutland manor, and believe the dog will be hypoallergenic even though it hasn't been tested and are willing to spend that much money on something that's not a "sure thing" for her and her son's allergies...that's up to them. i just hope the dog gets a good home if things don't work out.

[Zoom]

I think this is a great note to end this thread on. If anything more needs to be said, take it to PM's.

[Leslie + Chessies]

^Perhaps.lol. NAMBR (I just came up with my own words for the abbrev. LOL)... There are the same titles so your doodle could get a CD title or get his CH etc. Same rules, in a CKC or AKC handbook there are rules and standards for shows asides from the obvious, that they have to be purebred and registered.

The dogs in this organization are not shown. They can complete in
obedience and tracking trials only.

[Leslie + Chessies]

I think this is a great note to end this thread on. If anything more needs to be said, take it to PM's.

Sorry Zoom...I posted as you did....I'm done.

[Bailey+Ralph]

Ok, i can't answer on the Doodle thing b/c i hadn't even heard of them before i found this site.
I would like to know though, trying to put this the right way so that i don't get hounded...............
Ok, you say that shelters have enough dogs, mutts and purebreds.......... and you blame BYB for this..................
Why doesn't anyone ever think that the owner of these dogs is to blame also??
If someone could go all out to get a great Purebred dog from a reputable breeder, and then beat the s*** out of it every night b/c they have had a good drink.

I don't condone BYB but it also comes down to the person that bought the dog.

[bubbatd]

I agree with Zoom... this is going no where. To the OP, welcome and sorry that your first post wasn't a pleasant one. I'm sure you will love your pup to be. Australian breeding ( from dedicated breeders ) are now into several generations.... what we here don't like is the 1st time breeder of a poodle and a Lab or Golden , and the prices they can rake in because of the designer phase. To me, there are Doodles and there are " doodles" ...buyers beware.

[pitbulliest]

People that breed mutts need to get a real job...or a real hobby....or both

these BYBs have way too much time on their hands, way too little information and education on dogs and breeding under their sleeve, and a tiny little greedy devil on their right shoulder...

[doodleluvr]

Still haven't seen the answer to this. But now I'm off to work
If you've read all my posts you would see that I did answer it, we've taken our son around the breeders dogs and the pups from the last litter. He had no problem at all.

[doodleluvr]

It seems like the OP is wondering why people don't have the same problem when people post that they've just bought a purebred puppy. The vast majority of purebred puppies are not bred by reputable breeders. Most are bred entirely as a money making proposition. I guess, if the question is going to come up at all, why don't posters ask people who have just purchased a purebred pup why they didn't try to find one at the shelter. There are many, many purebred dogs in the shelter. Our shelter will let you put your name down for a certain breed and get a call when that breed comes in. They will not, however, give you a call when a certain size dog comes in. That was one the important criteria for me. I needed a certain size. I did end up getting my dog from a shelter, but it took many months of searching to find the one that fit my needs. Anyway, in reading this thread, it seemed to me that the OP was wondering why people who purchase any dog, pure or mix, are scrutinized since the majority of purchases are from people trying to make money on their puppies.
Exactly what I mean thanks mjb you summed it up great for me

[PoodleMommy]

Doodle... you say these dogs run 18k to 30k... Is this what you are actually paying for yours?... I really think that this breeder is making money off of you ALOT of money...I understand that they need to charge a great sum of money in order to ensure that the dog is healthy and well cared for but 18k to 30k seems like way tooooo much money.

When you said you were paying a lot I was assuming 1,000 or there abouts.

Elissa

[PWCorgi]

I think she was saying that the 18k to 30k was for one with full breeding rights...

[Saje]

I can't remember if I asked this before but are labradoodles bred to labradoodles? Or is it always a lab+poodle?

[PWCorgi]

Saje- From what I understand when you breed a lab and a poodle together that is when you get the shedding problems, etc. Then they breed labradoodle to labradoodle and they are called a 1st generation, then a 2nd generation, and so on and so forth.

Could someone please varify if this is correct?

[LabBreeder]

first gen is lab to poodle...and then it goes doodle to doodle (it's supposed to at least)
*i hope that was right!*

[stevinski]

thts how it works! if its doodle to doodle then thts better then poodle to lab

[Saje]

Well it seems to me that poodle to lab is a mutt but labradoodle to labradoodle has the potential of possibly building into a breed.

[LabBreeder]

still not 100% guarantee of no/low shed and hypoallergenic though. that's what most breeders advertise as a "guarantee". i know health can't be guaranteed in any dog 100% but tests should be done to insure the parents are as healthy as possible and as free of genetic/hereditary defects as possible. at least then the pups may not get the genetic defects from 2 breeds (or at least the possibility is lower) IMO.

[LabBreeder]

doodle to doodle could be a breed if it was kept pure (no more poodles or labs involved) and if all pups were consistent with the standards that's being set. i think there is still a long way to go before it's recognized as a purebreed...but it could happen as long as it's done right.

[Meggie]

But how many generations does it take before you get a whole litter to whatever standard there is for Doodles? I mean, 1st generation Doodle to Doodle would still produce some "poodlish doodles" and some "labish doodles", wouldn't it?

Oh my, that sounded like a tongue twister in the making.

[stevinski]

it would take a while for them to breed true!, i think that if they breed a lab to a poodle then they have to call it a lab x poodle but if they breed doodle to doodle then i think they can call it a labradoodle

[LabBreeder]

But how many generations does it take before you get a whole litter to whatever standard there is for Doodles? I mean, 1st generation Doodle to Doodle would still produce some "poodlish doodles" and some "labish doodles", wouldn't it?

Oh my, that sounded like a tongue twister in the making.

i agree and that is part of the problem. you have to have quite a few doodle to doodle generations before you get consistent litters. right now some of the standards are so out there and all inclusive that consistency isn't really...well...constant. 3 different coat lengths, c'mon...most breeds have one unless it's like the chihuahua (but those are breeds within a breed...long hair, short hair, etc).
like i said, it'll be awhile before everything is constant enough for them to become recognized as a breed and weed out the byb's that are doing it for money and cause it's a fad thing (like the other mixes going on that aren't even trying to be recognized as a breed).

[Meggie]

i agree and that is part of the problem. you have to have quite a few doodle to doodle generations before you get consistent litters. right now some of the standards are so out there and all inclusive that consistency isn't really...well...constant. 3 different coat lengths, c'mon...most breeds have one unless it's like the chihuahua (but those are breeds within a breed...long hair, short hair, etc).
like i said, it'll be awhile before everything is constant enough for them to become recognized as a breed and weed out the byb's that are doing it for money and cause it's a fad thing (like the other mixes going on that aren't even trying to be recognized as a breed).

Hmmmm, you see, what I'm thinking is that you get a breeder who sets out to be a Labradoodle breeder, possibly with the best of intentions. They spend a whack of money getting a decent purebred Lab and a purebred Poodle to start their breeding program. Unless they're independently wealthy, they're not out to lose money in the long run. So they have a litter of so many poodleish doodles, and so many labish doodles and some to "standard" Labradoodles. They have to sell off their "non-standard" pups as what, pet quality Doodleishy dogs? And then turn around and charge high prices for their "standard" Doodles to recoup something of what they've invested? Wonder how many "pets" are going to be generated before you get a purebreed line? This doesn't even count in the BYBs who are cashing in by saying "If it looks like a Doodle, it is a Doodle". Which, technically, they can because it's not a recognized breed.

I don't get it, to tell you the truth. Not even sure if that made any sense, LOL!

[solidstaffs]

doodle to doodle could be a breed if it was kept pure (no more poodles or labs involved) and if all pups were consistent with the standards that's being set. i think there is still a long way to go before it's recognized as a purebreed...but it could happen as long as it's done right.

I think the biggest thing being overlooked in this whole thread, is the fact that IF this is going to become a recognised breed then there is going to need to be alot of crosses introduced for a very long time to create a gene pool that will be large enough to sustain a new breed, without the need to bring in new blood :D

[LabBreeder]

definitely agree with solidstaff...still don't promote doodles, but if they are ever going to be a recognized breed alot more needs to be done.

meggie - omg...that was confusing, yet oddly enough i think i understood most of it. lol
doodles born that don't meet standards (or are poodlish or labish) may end up with BYB's looking to cash in on the doodle craze (i did say MAY) and the doodles that meet the standards could either go to byb's, good homes, breeders that want to cash in on the money but also keep with standards....so many things can happen here. i guess it to soon to tell if labradoodles will end up a recognized breed or not. there are to many byb's mucking it up so far, IMO, to get any real progress.

[solidstaffs]

You may find this interesting :D Sorry if it's a little difficult to read, you may need to save it and make it a little bigger:p

Taken from the dog world newspaper june 2nd 2006
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d169/solidstaffs/Labradoodle1.jpg

[bubbatd]

I could read that, but will again put in my $.02 ...... I would go with the Australian if it was 4th generation ( by Oct. it should ) I believe the dedicated breeders are reaching a Standard , from what I've read and seen.STAY AWAY from those stepping on the band wagon and calling a poodle to whatever a " doodle " . There were 5 ads in the Indy paper today ... none less than $500. I'm tempted to call each one, find out the line, testings etc as if I was interested. I used to do this with Golden listings as to the awareness of testings.

[LabBreeder]

i did that with a goldendoodle ad once. i called and asked all kinds of questions. why she bred them, why so much and why she said they were registerable. needless to say she got mad and hung up on me...i called back as a different person and asked again, but not accusing of anything and she said the parents were registered and some clubs recognized them...no testings had been done and (i think) the pups had been an accident anyways. but she was charging $500 for them!

[Fran27]

This is the only problem I have with the doodle vs. purebred thing. I don't think it's right to say that because they aren't "purebred" their not worth as much money. I understand that the reason so much money is being charged is because that's the animals sole purpose. But to me, any good dog, can cost any amount of money. My girl was an accident, a mutt, a heinz 57 and I would pay just as much for her than any purebred animal in the world.

Let's take away the term 'designer dog" and just use mutt. I don't think mutts are LESS valuable than purebred animals. :)

That's not the point. The only reason to charge money IMO is to pay for all the vaccination, vet visits, health testings on the parents etc of course, but I believe it's normal to charge more for a dog with a good pedigree, from healthy parents that are a good representation of their breed.

For mutts, there's no such thing. So there's no reason to charge for that, even less to charge more than a purebred. What breeders charge for is novelty. Supply and demand. With such reasoning, dogs are considered a product, not a pet, and that's why I have no respect for those breeders asking even $1000 for a mutt. If they really cared that much for their dogs, they wouldn't use them to make such a quick buck in the process.

Nothing to do with the old mutt vs purebred debate.

[bubbatd]

Me thinks the Indians have circled the wagons enough ... neither will surrender , nor should they. We are basically talking about 2 issues here. BYBs who breed a lab to a poodle, and those who are working on a cross breed, with a standard and eventual acceptance .

[doodleluvr]

I can't remember if I asked this before but are labradoodles bred to labradoodles? Or is it always a lab+poodle?
Here Saje I found you a few links to so you can look at the differences of the F1 to some multigenerations........Most of the BYB here in the states are doing the F1's

http://labradoodle-dogs.net/gallery/
This site is good to see the difference in the generations although it doesn't stat what generation the dogs are

http://www.goldendoodles.com/generations.htm
This one here you can see that some of the pictures are at a BYB place because you can see the dogs are not cared for properly (matted hair dirty etc) Don't agree with it at all. There is a chart on the page that explains the generations in a simple format tho that is easy to read and understand

Someone else posted asking if we were paying the 18k for our pup no were not paying that much that is for a breeding dog. Which we don't want and thought it was good that our pup is already gonna be spayed or neutered. Husband did look into what the difference in getting one would be though. You don't even get the breeding puppies until at the very earliest 6months of age. They do DNA profiles of them and make sure they are very sound and capable of breeding. Not sure of all the tests I could ask my husband tho and see if he can remember any of the actually tests they perform on them.

[LabBreeder]

I have a question doodleluvr. Is the first link supposed to show the difference between just the different generations or are these doodles supposed to be meeting with the doodle standards also? There were very few that looked alike. All the hair/fur was different lengths and there were so many different colors and looks and textures. Some looked like Labs some looked like Poodles and others just looked like a mix. It just doesn't look like a good site to promote the labradoodle with so many differences IMO. If it is just to show what different generations look like then I guess it's perfect because it certainly shows the difference between the gens and looks.

[princess_poppy]

Secondly, I don't know why you got soo rude around the end of your post stating that people that got puppies at 5 weeks are irresponsible and got them from BYB. I am insulted! I got my pitt and 5weeks and my rott/dobe at 6. Why? Because firstly the pitt was taken away from his mother at 4 weeks, was flea infested had not been dewormed and wasn't going to get his first shots that are supposed to be given at 5 weeks. As for my other girl I got her at 6 weeks because otherwise she would have been put in a bag and drowned with her brother because they unfortunately were unwanted.

I just feel that perhaps you should realize that just because I got a puppy at way to young age, which I am PERFECTLY aware of, does NOT mean that I am irresponsible or stupid, or endorse BYB!!!!!!

i think 5 weeks is to early, they need to be with there litter mates for about 8 weeks, then they learn not to mouth or play rough as there litter mates will yelp and the pup will learn not to do it, being taken away from litter mates to early can cause some dogs to mouth, anyway it doen't mean your a bad owner does it!

[princess_poppy]

most people on here do have mutts, and most work or own a rescue dog. theres no good haveing a go at us on our opinions. i have to say most people here know more than you. most people have looked round rescues. also if people have said on here, oh, im want a lab, people will say back look in a rescue first!

[LabBreeder]

who are you talking to princess?

In regards to the last post. Was that just a general sweeping statement or directed at someone in particular?

[Roxy's CD]

princesspoppy I know that 5 weeks is too soon and there are plenty of things a mother teaches them that Hades missed out on, hence our horrible time house training him, BUT I DIDN'T TAKE HIM AWAY just because! His mother had already been taken away from him at 4 weeks. I worked extra hard with him, socializing and such just because of the fact he was taken away at such a young age. Me, my bf and Roxy all helped raise him to be teh well behaved boy that he is today.

And we've never had any trouble with him "mouthing" despite the fact that he was taken away from his littermates at 5 weeks and despite the fact that he's a pittbull! Our main problem as I mentioned was housebreaking.

To the OP: I'm sorry if I seemed rude in my previous post but it seemed like a direct hit to me, seeing as I think I'm the only one here that got my pitt at 5 weeks.

You seem to be genuninely interested in going to a good breeder that's not just in it for the money. I wish you luck with your pup whenever you get it and you have to post pics!

[bubbatd]

Civility re -enters ....Thanks !!! Grammy didn't want to get a switch and take anyone back behind the woodshed.!!

[Roxy's CD]

LOL.. *rubs my behind* nope that's ok , the first one did it for me!! :)

[MomOf7]

Whoa there!
Question...Does the parents of this pup have thier OFA , Cerf, PRA test. What is it that they are breeding for if it isnt for a hypoallergenic dog? What is a Labradoodle suppose to do? Who is deciding this? Do you ever see labradoodle breeders uniting across the world to hold events and keep track of performances?
What makes these particular dogs a good representative to this breed? What makes these dogs so outstanding that they should be bred?
Now I might be impressed if these so called new dog breed breeders actually did some scientific work to put together the perfect dog. Using more than 2 types of dogs to create a perfect dog with certain goals in mind for it.
That I could see. That is how the breeds we have come to love now were made. Now we have more scientific advances it would make it that much better. If someone were dedicated to this they would not charge an outragous price for a pup untill the line is completely clean and consistant.

These doodle breeders granted some do make a effort for health and do give guarantees, They didnt do the research not like it should have been looking at todays advances in science. Sorry Just doesnt cut it for me.
However you have already closed your mind to what could be true. I will not try to convince you. Just trying to give you information that makes sense.
Hope you are happy with your pup and I wish you and yours the best.

Again I pose these questions that I previously asked that no one acknowledged.
What is the purpose for labradoodles? What were they designed for? I have seen anywhere from hypoallergenic non shedding which isnt true. All the way to companion dogs......
Dont we have enough breeds to cover these needs? Why do we need another group of breeds? What makes them so outstanding?
I have seen alot of doodles in shelters. Most with some type of problem.
Arent there more scientific ways to perfecting a breed? Why arent those methods being used?
Honestly I will not condone doodles or doodle breeders even IF they are doing health clearances and health guarantees. We simply do not need another breed of dogs in this country or any other. AND..I truely believe they are breeding them to line thier pockets. I do all the same health clearances as they do. I do all the research of lines to produce a great dog as they do if not more...What makes thier dogs worth so much more than mine or for that matter anyother well bred dog who has the clearances and titles behind it to prove that its of worth? I just dont get it?!!
I will not ever ever ever ever ever ever ever look at a labradoodle breeder as being responsible. If for nothing else for this reason....WE DONT NEED ANOTHER BREED OF DOG! How are they doing the dog world justice? Arent there enough mixed breeds in the shelters?

Sorry Grammy....:mad:

[LabBreeder]

I agree with Mom. However, what can we do to stop mix breeding for profit and the supposed "taking the best of each breed and making a better breed"? You can't really talk to the breeders of doodles (or puggles, doberrotts, etc) because they get mad and defensive. If someone, or a group of someone's, wants to mix and match to get another breed (with standards/certs/health/etc) going, what can WE do to stop it? *seriously*

[PoodleMommy]

Doodleluvr.... thanks for answering the question about the money.

I wasnt trying to be rude or prying... it just seemed like 18k was a lot for a "pet".

This thread has gotten totally out of control... but when are you getting your puppy?

[MomOf7]

I agree with Mom. However, what can we do to stop mix breeding for profit and the supposed "taking the best of each breed and making a better breed"? You can't really talk to the breeders of doodles (or puggles, doberrotts, etc) because they get mad and defensive. If someone, or a group of someone's, wants to mix and match to get another breed (with standards/certs/health/etc) going, what can WE do to stop it? *seriously*
Cant stop it...It is what it is.
Very soon doodles will be out and some other type of mix will be in.

Im not trying to offend the original poster. Hope you get a lovely puppy.

[Sheka]

Ok, im really sick of the doodle debate. This lady is gonna get her doodle no matter what eether of us say, Some people are just stubborn. Oh and hes the great reason why she doesnt want a poodle "her husband thinks they are girly"..Wow. U dont have to give the poodle that haricut and without it they dont look "girly", infact they look alot more manly than labradoodles in my opinion. and with a poodle you actually pay FOR AN ACTUAL BREED! *GASP* Lol. Be4 coming here i wanted a MINI AUSSIE more than anything in the world, alot like you. I found the "perfect" breeder and i researched so much. And then i adopted Kya and realised "WHY THE HECK WAS I GONNA PAY A THOUSAND FROM A THE RUNT OF AN AUSSIE LITTER?!". Ok fine doodlvr, get your precious labradoodle, but dont expect much support here. i dont know what u expected from this thread, but it seems like a pure debate started to me. if u dont wanna deal with us, fine. THese "designer dogs" already have books, and breeders. they probably have forums 2.

[doodleluvr]

I have a question doodleluvr. Is the first link supposed to show the difference between just the different generations or are these doodles supposed to be meeting with the doodle standards also? There were very few that looked alike. All the hair/fur was different lengths and there were so many different colors and looks and textures. Some looked like Labs some looked like Poodles and others just looked like a mix. It just doesn't look like a good site to promote the labradoodle with so many differences IMO. If it is just to show what different generations look like then I guess it's perfect because it certainly shows the difference between the gens and looks.
First one was just the gens and looks and if you looked at the multi generation the ones that stat Australian are more conformed and yes there are several colours....the majority being creame, black, brown in the multi......there is also a redish and lavendar (IMO looks like charcoal) those are considered rare.

[bubbatd]

Shall I lock this ???? It's going no where. And BTW... all of our lovable recognized breeds started somewhere.

[doodleluvr]

Hey all this is the don't want a "girly" dog. My wife has enjoyed all of your responses some more then others and she still doesn't quite understand some of ya'lls I wouldn't say opions because everyone has a right to there own opion yes I think the poodle is a girly dog no matter how the hair is cut my strict opion. Just like I wouldn't get a Bassett Hound don't like them all MO.
My wife wasn't meaning to start a debate as of the Australian Labradoodle being a breed and it is her unfortune she may not have stated what she was meaning clearly enough for ya'll. Which after reading everything I have given her what I think you all are trying to say some more open minded then others. My wife is very hard headed or passionate. Labradoodle vs purebreed was probably a bad idea for her to put (she's not too bright at times LOL) I think by her puttin that is why it turned into a debate and that wasn't her intention. It was to see why when one dog was mentioned boom BYB. When there are so many BYB for not just mutts but purebreeeds also. It just seemed like to her that ya'll assumed at labradoodle it's some crackhead breeder that doesn't care for the dogs at all just wants the money, not always the case for any kind of dog. BYB are everywhere and not just for labradoodles every breed of dog and even mutts have BYB. Granted I think it's alot to pay for a dog. Do I think it's too much to pay for my son to have a best friend that loves him no matter what he does. Heck No, I would pay a million dollars for my son to have a companion like I had when I was a kid.

[dr2little]

Ok, im really sick of the doodle debate. This lady is gonna get her doodle no matter what eether of us say, Some people are just stubborn. Oh and hes the great reason why she doesnt want a poodle "her husband thinks they are girly"..Wow. U dont have to give the poodle that haricut and without it they dont look "girly", infact they look alot more manly than labradoodles in my opinion. and with a poodle you actually pay FOR AN ACTUAL BREED! *GASP* Lol. Be4 coming here i wanted a MINI AUSSIE more than anything in the world, alot like you. I found the "perfect" breeder and i researched so much. And then i adopted Kya and realised "WHY THE HECK WAS I GONNA PAY A THOUSAND FROM A THE RUNT OF AN AUSSIE LITTER?!". Ok fine doodlvr, get your precious labradoodle, but dont expect much support here. i dont know what u expected from this thread, but it seems like a pure debate started to me. if u dont wanna deal with us, fine. THese "designer dogs" already have books, and breeders. they probably have forums 2.

I've been reading this thread and purposly staying out of it because I knew it could only end badly....IT'S JUST GOTTEN SO NASTY!:mad:

I do have a Labradoodle. I'm well aware of the problems with Designer breeding, so I chose to have mine flown in from Australia and you'll hear no apologies from me. 4 of my 5 dogs are purebred rescues from "breeders" and I did do research (2 years before making a decision) on my Labradoodle before choosing where to get her from, (posted on other threads). I think the thing that I have such a hard time with is the cruel nature of the arguments.

I'm not a supporter of all but 2 breeders, the ones who are, and have been for many years, trying to acheive a standard. As for my own dog and what's so great about her. Here goes....
Sophie is the kindest, sweetest, most intelligent, willing to learn, most tollerant (helps me teach all my classes - from puppy classes to growl classes) one in a million dog...and she is 85 lbs of love...who incidentally does not shed.

Why did I not just get a Standard Poodle? While I love poodles, I train many of them and they are always top of the class, like many of you and the breeds that you have chosen, I found the Labradoodle more suited what I was looking for in a dog. I also love the Lab but due to severe allergies in my home (son with asthma) it was not an option. And no, my son is not the least bit allergic to Sophie.

There are many breeds/mixes owned by loving people on this forum that I would never want to have. I would still refrain from bashing that breed/mix or the person for having one. And no, this is not just a discussion on BYB's anymore. It is, and has been personal from the start.
And if you think that all breeds/mixes on Chaz were attained by "proper" means...you''d be fooling yourself.

No one likes BYB's or puppymills. Trust me, I deal with the horrors on a daily basis, but to say that Labradoodle=BYB or puppy mill is just plain ignorance. It's easy to get on the Doodle lynch wagon, I hate what's happening with them myself ...but the personal attacks are just going too far.

It's hard to hear these "discussions" get so harsh, on both ends. If anyone so much as mentions Labradoodle, the posts get so cruel, so fast!:mad: Please don't forget that we all love our dogs. You can have your points, many are valid, but please just try to show a little decorum.

Like Grammie and I believe Saje said.....WE'RE BEATING A DEAD HORSE!!...what an awful saying..:rolleyes:

[dr2little]

Shall I lock this ???? It's going no where. And BTW... all of our lovable recognized breeds started somewhere.

Thank you, you tried to say this many, many post ago. I hope your message gets across, I suspect mine won't.:(

[bubbatd]

Everyone is entitled to an opinion ....all have posted theirs. Therefore I consider this closed.