Puppies mistakenly Euthanized

[soft pawz]

http://s10.invisionfree.com/Small_Breed_DOGs/index.php?showtopic=249

:( :( :(

[LabBreeder]

the video didn't say much about what happened...but it's pretty self explanatory without it. :(

why in the world did this shelter kill 6 puppies that were just brought in that day? isn't there a specific time frame of X amount of days/weeks before they can legally do that? you know, time for a possible owner to come forward and claim their puppies/dogs before they are put down. and whatever happened to shelters trying to find dogs/puppies homes BEFORE putting them down? this place should be sued for pain/suffering and personal losses. they killed 6 puppies for God's sake!!! :mad: what were they thinking???

[Red_ACD_for_me]

Not really a whole lot of details in the article, they said that they escaped out of there home and were found a few streets over and that someone brought them to the shelter. So I'm assuming that the owners were looking for them and found that they were PTS :confused: . Either way what a sad story and they looked like pitbull mixes, maybe that was the reason they were PTS. Not that it is right because I love the bully breeds, just that we have one shelter in Boston that doesn't even give pitbull or pitbully mixes a chance even pups. It is sad. Poor babies :(

[LabBreeder]

the owner was looking for them, from what i gather from the story, but the pups were pts before he knew where they were.
it looked to me like the mother was a lab or lab mix, but she was standing sideways and facing away from the camera so i may be wrong. still, just because the shelter "thought" the pups MIGHT be pit or pit mix doesn't mean they shouldn't have given at least a couple days for the owner to find them. it's just wrong to put pups to sleep just because they were brought into a shelter and may, or may not, have been pits (we really don't know). :mad:

[Red_ACD_for_me]

the owner was looking for them, from what i gather from the story, but the pups were pts before he knew where they were.
it looked to me like the mother was a lab or lab mix, but she was standing sideways and facing away from the camera so i may be wrong. still, just because the shelter "thought" the pups MIGHT be pit or pit mix doesn't mean they shouldn't have given at least a couple days for the owner to find them. it's just wrong to put pups to sleep just because they were brought into a shelter and may, or may not, have been pits (we really don't know). :mad:
I totally agree with you that they shouldn't have done it right away, it makes me upset to.

[MomOf7]

I saw the news cast on this...It happend in seattle somewhere.
Very sad. I guess they are going to get down to the bottom of this and repremand those involved.
I got to see the other puppies in the litter on tv. Cute!

[bubbatd]

Sad,sad, sad !!! Just like Elin's wonderful lab was ready to be PTS the day after we sprung him. They thought he was un trainable... this is the dog that is velco to both of us and has no issues ! He was upset at the HS and only wanted out and TLC....he got his wish !

[SalemWitchChild]

OMG! How awful! I hope the newscast can at least help find homes for the rest of the pups. And I hope they fire the person who did this..

[Babyblue5290]

Ack...not this again! Yes, the pups where put to sleep. They where suppose to be held for 3 days minimum (usually 4 days though). It's not like that is common practice! Don't ask me why they where put to sleep that early, it wasn't suppose to happen. Someone made a really bad mistake, but I don't know who. I already had some lady give me some hell about this even when I told her I had nothing to do with it, but no she still gives me hell. I hate that the pups where put to sleep. It's really horrible. It's also not like the person who made the mistake is some heart-less person who just wanted to kill some pit puppies. All the kennel staff/vets who work theree care very much about these dogs. Then again what owner/"breeder" leaves their new born pups in the backyard?

[soft pawz]

no need to get so defensive.
yes, it is a really bad mistake and nobody said its common practice.
nobody here blamed you for it. so just because its a mistake and not done on purpose means that we are not allowed to talk about it????

just because it was a mistake doesnt make the puppies less dead either. and what kind of shelter kills PUPPIES anyway? and of course the person who did it is heartless IMO: it takes a special kind of character to be able to do that. i couldnt kill even if somebody would give me millions for it. not everybody is able to kill, most people couldnt do it.

i agree that the owner/ breeder whatever should not have let the puppies unsupervised. how can puppies run away??? but its pretty obvious that the owner is not the most responsable, who breeds pit-mix puppies in the first place..........

[Sheka]

Thats so sad :( i could never put a dog to sleep, no matter how much some1 payed me. Especially puppies, DONT U THINK IT WOULDVE BEEN SMART FOR THE PERSON TO ASK AROUND BEFORE PUTTING ALL THOSE PUPS TO SLEEP?
didnt he see something strange with that? whats done is done, but its still not fair to all those pups, even if only 1 found a loving home, it wouldve been worth it.

[LabBreeder]

wait...when did we find out for sure that they were pit mixes? mom saw the newscast........what did you think mom? were they pit mixes?

last i heard someone thought they "might be pit or pit/mix" and that was maybe why they were pts.

[casablanca1]

It's a law of this forum - if there's the remotest possibility that pit bulls were victimized, the topic will take over. Puppies being put to sleep not being bad enough, I suppose.

[Babyblue5290]

wait...when did we find out for sure that they were pit mixes? mom saw the newscast........what did you think mom? were they pit mixes?

last i heard someone thought they "might be pit or pit/mix" and that was maybe why they were pts.

They where pit mixes. I saw the newscast also. I never actually saw the pups though, I wasn't there that day. They where not put to sleep because they where pit mixes, at least not that soon. They where suppose to be held for 3 days minimum. I don't know how they messed up or who but they did and I'm sure they feel horrible about it. If they had stayed there three business days and weren't claimed by there owner after the 3rd business day and they where labled as pit mixes then yes, they would've been put to sleep.

[LabBreeder]

ok, so the mom or dad was a pit or pit mix then. still, i don't think a dog should be put down just because he's a specific breed or mix of that breed. that would be like killing all muslims or muslim americans cause some of them are terrorists. (just an example, no need to bash or make it a topic)
everything deserves a chance to be raised with love and taught what's right and wrong before being condemned to death because of what it is.

[Roxy's CD]

This reminds me of the time a guy took his retriever in to be neutered and they mixed up the kennels (his dog was in 6 and a dog that was supposed to be euthanized, old age was in 9) They put down his perfectly healthy dog!! How said would that phone call be "Ahh, this is the vet's office, I know your dog was supposed to be neutered today but we actually put him down."

OMG I WOULD KILL THEM!!!

[LabBreeder]

i would have sued the pants off of that vet!! :mad:
there is no excuse for stupidity, especially when you work in a hospital. it's your job to keep records straight...not screw it all up and kill a perfectly healthy animal. i worked in a vets office as a vet tech when we lived in s.c. you made d*mn sure you had everything filled out and the papers put where they were supposed to be before you did ANYTHING. if you even had a shadow of a doubt as to what was going on you didn't do anything til you asked and made sure...twice!
i would have had that vet shut down. i'm sorry, but i don't think anybody should have to suffer like that. if the vet did it once, he'd do it again (or the person that messed it up would). i also don't think a dog deserves to be cut down in the prime of life by some idiot. :mad:

[Roxy's CD]

^ I think he did try to sue them I don't know the outcome though. It was in Alberta, CA. I just couldn't imagine it. You trust your vet. When you leave your animal there you expect them to come back unless it's major surgery and they've warned you etc. But I remember when I got my little guy fixed, my normal vet had just had surgery and they had a "filler in vet there". I was calling them every hour, is he ok? He's getting neutered right you didn't forget!?!?!

(I would've waited until she came back but she had cancer surgery and wouldn't have been back for 3 months, and the pitt ban is on where I live so he had to be fixed at 6 months, no later)

[cowgurl6254]

Most shelters do have a time frame to keep animals, but I know that my local one will sometimes euthanize animals right away if they are getting too crowded. Still doesn't make it right though...:(

[Babyblue5290]

I didn't see this until just now so forgive me for not replying to this earlier this morning.

no need to get so defensive.
yes, it is a really bad mistake and nobody said its common practice.
nobody here blamed you for it. so just because its a mistake and not done on purpose means that we are not allowed to talk about it????

Ok, I'm not getting defensive. So don't worry about that. I never said you couldn't talk about this, but I was saying don't automatically crucify the shelter/people for doing this. They do really care about the animals and almost all the people who work there believe putting pits to sleep just for their breed is not right.

just because it was a mistake doesnt make the puppies less dead either. and what kind of shelter kills PUPPIES anyway?

What kind of shelter kills puppies? Well.......have you visited a kill shelter latley? More dogs (including puppies) are killed then you would probably like to believe. Just because the puppies are cute and cuddly doesn't mean they always get adopted.

and of course the person who did it is heartless IMO: it takes a special kind of character to be able to do that. i couldnt kill even if somebody would give me millions for it. not everybody is able to kill, most people couldnt do it.

No they aren't heartless. Just because you don't have a strong enough stomach to stand it doesn't mean those who do are heart-less. They don't like it, they may even despise it, but they are far from heart-less.
Everyone has the ability to kill. If it came down to it everyone (yes including you) would have the ability to kill. (Main word being "ability" meaning "able to") Just because you are so sheltered from the sight of death doesn't mean it isn't there and doesn't mean all those who kill are heart-less. I guess you say the same thing about all the soldiers then?

i agree that the owner/ breeder whatever should not have let the puppies unsupervised. how can puppies run away??? but its pretty obvious that the owner is not the most responsable, who breeds pit-mix puppies in the first place.........

The news said that the owner left them outside and, I'm not totally clear on if they where inside or outside their year, but someone thought the pups where abandoned and took them to THS.

[Babyblue5290]

Most shelters do have a time frame to keep animals, but I know that my local one will sometimes euthanize animals right away if they are getting too crowded. Still doesn't make it right though...:(

Just to clarify, that isn't what happened. The pups where not killed due to lack of space.

ok, so the mom or dad was a pit or pit mix then. still, i don't think a dog should be put down just because he's a specific breed or mix of that breed. that would be like killing all muslims or muslim americans cause some of them are terrorists. (just an example, no need to bash or make it a topic)
everything deserves a chance to be raised with love and taught what's right and wrong before being condemned to death because of what it is.

That's also not why they where put down (not so early at least). Yes this shelter PTS pitbulls because of their breeds, but the people who work there are not responsible for that rule. They (Almost all of them) don't like that rule and don't believe pit bulls are the evil monsters the news portrays just like they aren't the heartless people the news portrays them as.

I totally agree they should be given a chance to be raised with love and taught what's right and wrong before being put to sleep. I agree no dog should be put to death because of it's breed. I totally agree with all that:)

*edit* and just so everyone knows I'm not saying any of these reasons is an excuse for putting these pups to sleep before their time was up. I just want to clarify that these people aren't heartless, this shelter isn't horrible, and that it was a horrible, tragic mistake that shouldn't have happened. But these people are so understaffed, over-worked, and underpaid and people still give them hell. Personally I think the staff who work there are amazing to put up with the crap people give them and still be so nice and caring (NOT heartless)

[soft pawz]

No they aren't heartless. Just because you don't have a strong enough stomach to stand it doesn't mean those who do are heart-less. They don't like it, they may even despise it, but they are far from heart-less.
Everyone has the ability to kill. If it came down to it everyone (yes including you) would have the ability to kill. (Main word being "ability" meaning "able to") Just because you are so sheltered from the sight of death doesn't mean it isn't there and doesn't mean all those who kill are heart-less. I guess you say the same thing about all the soldiers then?


Even if they dont make the rules they chose to follow it.
its actually not a bad idea to compare it to war and soldiers. its like those soldiers who after a war is over say its not their fault ( just remember WWII), "they all just did what they have been told", they all didnt want to be responsable for their actions...........but just because somebody told you to do it doesnt justify it!!

sure everybody has the physical "ability" to kill but most people dont, luckily...
taking a life is crossing a line.....most people will shy back before doing it.

killing is no normal behaviour.

btw who said i grew up sheltered???

as far as kill-shelters go, i never really got it i guess.......
if you dont have space for the animals why do you accept them?
wouldnt it be better for the dog to run around lost outside than accepting him just to kill him within the next 3 days....

[J's crew]

Even if they dont make the rules they chose to follow it.
its actually not a bad idea to compare it to war and soldiers. its like those soldiers who after a war is over say its not their fault ( just remember WWII), "they all just did what they have been told", they all didnt want to be responsable for their actions...........but just because somebody told you to do it doesnt justify it!!

sure everybody has the physical "ability" to kill but most people dont, luckily...
taking a life is crossing a line.....most people will shy back before doing it.

killing is no normal behaviour.

btw who said i grew up sheltered???

as far as kill-shelters go, i never really got it i guess.......
if you dont have space for the animals why do you accept them?
wouldnt it be better for the dog to run around lost outside than accepting him just to kill him within the next 3 days....


Wow. You have never been involved in rescue work have you? You would rather a dog run around starving, with the possibility of being hit by a car, used as a bait dog, abused by idiots, etc....than to be at peace?

[Babyblue5290]

Even if they dont make the rules they chose to follow it.
its actually not a bad idea to compare it to war and soldiers. its like those soldiers who after a war is over say its not their fault ( just remember WWII), "they all just did what they have been told", they all didnt want to be responsable for their actions...........but just because somebody told you to do it doesnt justify it!!sure everybody has the physical "ability" to kill but most people dont, luckily...
taking a life is crossing a line.....most people will shy back before doing it.

killing is no normal behaviour.

Ever have a hamburger? or a hot dog? or steak? I guess every animal who eats meat isn't normal? Most (the vast majority) kill just by eating the meat. Inadvertantly maybe, but still they eat the meat of dead animals....the carcasses, the tendons ripping the muscle off of a dead animals body and chewing it. Some even like the blood (rare or medium rare) as a flavor inhancer....yummmm tasty! :p

Plus most of those animals are treated horribly, a lot worse than dogs. Their deaths are a lot worse than those at the shelters.

btw who said i grew up sheltered???

Ok by sheltered I meant you most likley haven't seen too many dead animals with skin still attached too often, and probably not every day. Most people haven't because they don't think of what they buy at the supermarket as "animals" or as anything living. They can't stand to think of what they eat as something that use to breath. But that's just an assumption so if you grew up around the sight of many dead bodies sorry for assuming.

as far as kill-shelters go, i never really got it i guess.......
if you dont have space for the animals why do you accept them?
wouldnt it be better for the dog to run around lost outside than accepting him just to kill him within the next 3 days....

Ok then when people complain about dogs running loose, attacking their dogs, chasing their small animals, destroying their yards, chasing their children, getting hit by cars, and all the other consequences of letting dogs run loose then what? Have you ever seen anyone put a dog to sleep? It's a lot less painful then being hit by a car left to die on the side of the road. If you saw a dieing dogs eyes in so much pain you might think twice. If you ever saw a dog be mauled to death or beaten by people you might think it was better to be put to sleep peacefully. Not saying it's the best solution, but it's the best we got right now.

[soft pawz]

again just another assumption about me...amazing how many people seem to know so much about me.....anyway

"be at peace".....nice term
how do you know death is peaceful? ever been there?
would you rather put starving children in 3rd world countries to sleep too? so they are "in peace" and dont have to go through a life of poverty, hunger and abuse? - i dont think so.

i never said dont help the dog. it is horrible that dogs have to go through hunger, thirst, abuse but sorry, i dont think death is an improvment to their situation. killing isnt helping. before you got to kill the dog rather dont accept it - thats all i was saying.

babyblue hunting and killing isnt the same. at least not in my opinion. hunting is to provide food. it has a purpose and place in life. killing dogs is not part of that ( at least not in this country).
most people can tell the difference between shooting a goose or duck for dinner and going to the backyard and shooting the family pet dog.

[Roxy's CD]

Euthanizing animals that would otherwise lead a not so great life is sad, but I can truly understand why. If I was in an accident where I became unconscious to the known world I would rather be dead.

For a dog to spend it's life jumping from bad home to bad home or from shelter to shelter, sometimes death is a way to put it out of it's misery. If you had an old dog that was in constant pain would you allow it to continue on this way until it died "naturally"? If so I would consider THAT INHUMANE.

[Babyblue5290]

again just another assumption about me...amazing how many people seem to know so much about me.....anyway

I'm sorry. Please could you quote and post exactly where I made another assumption about you and I can clearify my meaning? That way there will be no hard feelings. :)

"be at peace".....nice term
how do you know death is peaceful? ever been there?

Not personally, but in my beliefe once your dead that's the end. But that's just my beliefe (didn't say that for an argument about the afterlife). How do you know it's not? The thing is we don't know. How about you tell me a solution to our problem? If I had a starving dog painfully dieing would I rather have it put to sleep? yes.

would you rather put starving children in 3rd world countries to sleep too? so they are "in peace" and dont have to go through a life of poverty, hunger and abuse? - i dont think so.

No I wouldn't, I wouldn't rather have dogs put to sleep because of human error, but if you give us another solution other than just ignoring the problem or letting all the dogs loose on the streets I'd love to hear it.

i never said dont help the dog. it is horrible that dogs have to go through hunger, thirst, abuse but sorry, i dont think death is an improvment to their situation. killing isnt helping.

Your right it doesn't help the situation, but tell me another solution? We can't just let them all go on the streets. We try and get people to change their mind set and neuter/spay their animals, but it's a slow process when you have to deal with people who believe animals are a piece of property.

before you got to kill the dog rather dont accept it - thats all i was saying.

What? That makes no sense to me sorry. Could you please rephrase?


We are so far off topic on this thread. So if you would like to further discuss the policies of kill shelters and their solutions please either make a new thread or PM me. I would be glad to share with you any of my opinions as long as you keep it civil.

[soft pawz]

roxy, the dogs that get euthanized in those kill shelters arent sick.
hardly anybody will argue that its humane to put a dog to sleep that is in constant pain without the chance of inprovement.

because the dog is from a broken home or there might be a chance that it will get mistreated, or hit by a car...(all assumptions..) is not a good enaugh reason for me.

if you dont got space, bring it to a shelter that has space.
allowing to kill these animals is just the easy way out.
they cost money, they need food and space and the state doesnt want to spend money on homeless dogs, thats all.

[J's crew]

again just another assumption about me...amazing how many people seem to know so much about me.....anyway

"be at peace".....nice term
how do you know death is peaceful? ever been there?
would you rather put starving children in 3rd world countries to sleep too? so they are "in peace" and dont have to go through a life of poverty, hunger and abuse? - i dont think so.

i never said dont help the dog. it is horrible that dogs have to go through hunger, thirst, abuse but sorry, i dont think death is an improvment to their situation. killing isnt helping. before you got to kill the dog rather dont accept it - thats all i was saying.

No I have never been there. Have you ever had to run around searching and stealing food. Have you ever been kicked by people who do not want you in their yard? Have you ever been hit by a car because no one gives a rip?

When I first started rescuing dogs I thought I could save them all. To me the worst thing in the world was for them to be PTS. A few years later and a whole lot wiser I see that the number of dogs and cats without homes is astronomical. The local AC in my city euthanizes 20-30 dogs per day and that is a big improvement since they have a new, bigger shelter. It used to be 50-75. I cannot help them all. It is physically impossible.

You think I like the idea of a dog being PTS? It makes me sick. It makes me cry. The first time I ever saw it done was the worst experience of my life! But it is much better considering the alternative. I work my ass off EVERY single day to help as many animals in need as possible. Please do not insinuate that I think it is all honkey dory.

[Babyblue5290]

roxy, the dogs that get euthanized in those kill shelters arent sick.
hardly anybody will argue that its humane to put a dog to sleep that is in constant pain without the chance of inprovement.

because the dog is from a broken home or there might be a chance that it will get mistreated, or hit by a car...(all assumptions..) is not a good enaugh reason for me.

if you dont got space, bring it to a shelter that has space.
allowing to kill these animals is just the easy way out.
they cost money, they need food and space and the state doesnt want to spend money on homeless dogs, thats all.

Again I would reply to all your statements/beliefes you have made but I think this has gone too far off topic. So I will do the right thing and no longer reply to anythig off topic. But if you want to continue our conversation make a new thread or PM me and I'd happily share with you my beliefes. :)

[Roxy's CD]

soft pawz I think what your doing rather than prove a point is your putting down the people that are out there trying to help these animals. You have to be reasonable when it comes to this matter. People do what they can, but as of right now and with this issue it takes more than a handful of people that actually GO OUT and work hard to try and save animals.

I know your just stating your opinion but I'm afraid in doing so you've insulted the very people that have taken their time and energy to help save animals. One of my friends had the same attitude as you, (I'm not saying that in a rude way), she loved animals but hated the fact that they had to be put down. She volunteers at the local humane society now and after being in the front lines of this battle even she will agree that there are tooo many homeless animals out there and euthanizing the ones that have the least chance of getting adopted is the only way to save the ones that MAY get a new home.

[Babyblue5290]

No I have never been there. Have you ever had to run around searching and stealing food. Have you ever been kicked by people who do not want you in their yard? Have you ever been hit by a car because no one gives a rip?

When I first started rescuing dogs I thought I could save them all. To me the worst thing in the world was for them to be PTS. A few years later and a whole lot wiser I see that the number of dogs and cats without homes is astronomical. The local AC in my city euthanizes 20-30 dogs per day and that is a big improvement since they have a new, bigger shelter. It used to be 50-75. I cannot help them all. It is physically impossible.

You think I like the idea of a dog being PTS? It makes me sick. It makes me cry. The first time I ever saw it done was the worst experience of my life! But it is much better considering the alternative. I work my ass off EVERY single day to help as many animals in need as possible. Please do not insinuate that I think it is all honkey dory.

J's Crew: You do a wonderful job :) Believe me you really do! I work my butt off every day helping as many as I possibly can also. It takes a while for people to realize just how bad the situation is and that a gung-ho approach of just not euthinizing any animals is impossible right now. All the help by people like you is something we need. If more people where like you, maybe we would see the end of euthinizing do to lack of space. And I know it's really hard working and trying to save animals knowing you can't save them all. It hurts. A lot. I know. But to continue to strive to help as many as possible is so much more admirable then just saying "don't kill". You're helping to make a solution which is the best thing possible :)

*sorry just had to give you the admiration you deserve for helping the animals. Back on topic now :)*

[soft pawz]

babyblue i didnt mean you with saying "another assumption" i ment J's crew

i wish i had a solution, i really do.
i do understand that there is no easy solution. and i dont want to say that the people who work there dont do good things too.
i dont got a better solution, i dont have the money to help and rescue all the perfectly healthy animals that are already schedualed to get killed right this minute. i dont agree with it but i admit i dont know a solution.

but it does sound like you do agree with me. what happens at the moment is not the best way to face the problem. thats pretty much all i said too.

i dont think a dog is rather dead than having a shitty life. if some see that different than thats their opinion. if you as a shelter dont have space for a dog i'd rather see you not take that dog than take it just to kill it. - i know, that too is no solution to the stray dog problem ( never claimed it was)

i still do belive that it takes a special kind of character to be actually able to kill these puppies too and that most people probably couldnt.

J's crew "Have you ever had to run around searching and stealing food. Have you ever been kicked by people who do not want you in their yard? Have you ever been hit by a car because no one gives a rip?"

answer: no but if i would i for sure wouldnt like it better if somebody kills me...
and neiter do you: as you said its an improvment that the shelter now only kills 20 instead of 70 dogs each day. that makes me think that you dont see "putting the dogs to sleep" as the best thing that could have happened to those dogs either.....

i dont think i got anything else to add about kill-shelters. as babyblue already said it would lead to far off topic and might be discussed but in a different thread...

[LabBreeder]

first of all, cowgurl didn't say that those particular puppies were put down because of lack of space...she was talking about the animal shelter in her area.

second, i didn't say these puppies were killed specifically because they were pit mixes...just that i didn't think it was right.

i would like to know WHY these pups were killed within 6 hours of being brought to the shelter though. surely the assistants and such know which dogs have been there longer and which are the newer ones. you're bound to notice something is different

[LabBreeder]

softpawz needs to come to the realization that leaving dogs to run loose is not the solution to waiting 3 days then killing them. killing them isn't an answer either, but if no one claims them...then what? keep every dog you find and hope they'll all be adopted? unfortunately that's not an option for most shelters as they are non-profit and have volunteers.

if you leave a dog to run loose for 3 more days instead of taking it in and giving shelter, some attention, food, water and some socialization it has a better chance (in those 3 days) of finding a home than it would have being on the street. at the very least it receives food, water, attention, shelter, etc. before being pts. i'm not saying that feeding a dog then killing it's good, but at least the dog goes peacefully with a shot instead of being run over, poisoned, kicked or shot.

[Babyblue5290]

first of all, cowgurl didn't say that those particular puppies were put down because of lack of space...she was talking about the animal shelter in her area.

second, i didn't say these puppies were killed specifically because they were pit mixes...just that i didn't think it was right.

I know :) I just said that so others didn't think that's what happened to these specific puppies :)

I don't think it's right either to kill the dogs based on their breed. It's really not right.

i would like to know WHY these pups were killed within 6 hours of being brought to the shelter though. surely the assistants and such know which dogs have been there longer and which are the newer ones. you're bound to notice something is different

I would like to know why also. I sure know which dogs are there that are new and which are there that are old, but some of the vets (the people who euthinize) don't spend much time in the kennels other than medicine and getting dogs from the kennels. So they wouldn't really see the dogs out there every day. Really they should have seen the animal Id numbers didn't match so all I can think of was someone put the intake day in the computer wrong. But really I don't know.